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Setting Russia aside for a second, the UK has a malnutrition rate that's 4-5x lower than the US as well. Why is this? I suspect this is related to the high rate

by whack 10y ago

Setting Russia aside for a second, the UK has a malnutrition rate that's 4-5x lower than the US as well. Why is this? I suspect this is related to the high rates of obesity in the US, and that this site is including all deaths caused by obesity related problems?

dpark 10y ago
France also has a rate ~4x higher than the US, and even Norway has a rate double that of the US. I do wonder how much of this is difference is legitimate differences between countries and how much is a difference in categorization. Are the French really 20x as likely to die of malnutrition as the neighboring Germans?
- marcosdumay 10y ago
  How much of it is pure noise? Those numbers are smaller than 1/100,000. You are counting 200 occurrences an year at the US, and many less at France or Germany.
  - dogma1138 10y ago
    I have it hard time to believe that only 200 people die in the US due to malnutrition it's likely different classification. Death due to lack of certain nutrients isn't that uncommon. While VAD deaths in the US and the west are probably rare VDD related deaths are quite common especially in cardiac cases. Same goes for many other things. If you only count acute starvation then 200 cases per year might make sense but diet has a huge impact on mortality.
    - marcosdumay 10y ago
      That's the number on the link, rounding up US population, and down the death rate. A single hospital misclassifying deaths could double it and maybe not even raise an alarm.
    - dpark 10y ago
      > Death due to lack of certain nutrients isn't that uncommon. Citation? My understanding is that study after study has generally shown little impact from vitamin supplementation except in specific cases where subjects show obvious signs of deficiency (e.g. iron deficiency in pregnant women). > VDD related deaths are quite common especially in cardiac cases I'm assuming this is "vitamin D deficiency". I'd against ask for a citation. I couldn't find anything supporting this claim. Seems to be a risk factor but that's very different than being caused by the deficiency. We’re still a few years away from clinical trials that explore the possible link between taking vitamin D supplements to achieve higher vitamin D levels, and lower cardiovascular risk. http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heart_vascular_institute/clinical_services/centers_excellence/womens_cardiovascular_health_center/patient_information/health_topics/vitamin_d_and_the_heart.html http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heart_vascular_institute/clin...
      - dogma1138 10y ago
        Nothing to do with supplements, that is nonsense but we're talking about very low levels of certain nutrients including vitamins and various minerals. Low levels of vitamin D have been directly linked to increased death rates from cardiovascular conditions that doesn't mean the swallowing pills would help. Vitamin A deficiency is one of the leading causes of blindness amongst children and pregnancy related mortality in the world, this also happens in western countries by not as much. And so on and so on, eventually you can tie a lot of medical causes to poor diet, not getting enough X which causes or makes condition Y worse leading to death. Dying to starvation proper (excluding famines and other natural disasters) is kinda hard in the west, and in many other places unless it's enforced starvation, you simply tend to die to exposure way before that.
        dpark 10y ago
        > Nothing to do with supplements, that is nonsense but we're talking about very low levels of certain nutrients including vitamins and various minerals. I don't know how to interpret this. You're saying that supplements are nonsense but the deficiencies are real? So the deficiency causes mortality but from fixing the deficiency doesn't reduce mortality? > Low levels of vitamin D have been directly linked to increased death rates from cardiovascular conditions that doesn't mean the swallowing pills would help." Vitamin D deficiency is correlated with certain cardiovascular conditions. "Directly linked" doesn't really mean anything and is misleading because it could easily be interpreted to be causal which is definitely not established. If it were causal then supplements would fix it. > And so on and so on, eventually you can tie a lot of medical causes to poor diet, not getting enough X which causes or makes condition Y worse leading to death. This is the sort of statement that I don't think is supported by the science, but is so vague that it's difficult to meaningfully discuss. What is "a lot"? Is it some small fraction of a percentage? My understanding is that in the western world, vitamin deficiencies are fairly rare and clinical evidence doesn't indicate most conditions are clearly tied to deficiencies. Obviously what you eat will impact your health but the area is so complex that the contribution of minor deficiencies is basically impossible to separate from the noise. An implication of this is that recommendations of specific supplements or specific foods for correcting deficiencies are generally not scientific.
kafkaesq 10y ago
One suspects that there's a great deal of variability in how a given death gets labelled as being due to "malnutrition" or something else. Or for example whether miscarriages due to poor nutritional health of the mother get labelled as "infant deaths" or not; etc.

by whack 10y ago

dpark 10y ago

France also has a rate ~4x higher than the US, and even Norway has a rate double that of the US. I do wonder how much of this is difference is legitimate differences between countries and how much is a difference in categorization. Are the French really 20x as likely to die of malnutrition as the neighboring Germans?

marcosdumay 10y ago
How much of it is pure noise? Those numbers are smaller than 1/100,000. You are counting 200 occurrences an year at the US, and many less at France or Germany.
- dogma1138 10y ago
  I have it hard time to believe that only 200 people die in the US due to malnutrition it's likely different classification. Death due to lack of certain nutrients isn't that uncommon. While VAD deaths in the US and the west are probably rare VDD related deaths are quite common especially in cardiac cases. Same goes for many other things. If you only count acute starvation then 200 cases per year might make sense but diet has a huge impact on mortality.
  - marcosdumay 10y ago
    That's the number on the link, rounding up US population, and down the death rate. A single hospital misclassifying deaths could double it and maybe not even raise an alarm.
  - dpark 10y ago
    > Death due to lack of certain nutrients isn't that uncommon. Citation? My understanding is that study after study has generally shown little impact from vitamin supplementation except in specific cases where subjects show obvious signs of deficiency (e.g. iron deficiency in pregnant women). > VDD related deaths are quite common especially in cardiac cases I'm assuming this is "vitamin D deficiency". I'd against ask for a citation. I couldn't find anything supporting this claim. Seems to be a risk factor but that's very different than being caused by the deficiency. We’re still a few years away from clinical trials that explore the possible link between taking vitamin D supplements to achieve higher vitamin D levels, and lower cardiovascular risk. http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heart_vascular_institute/clinical_services/centers_excellence/womens_cardiovascular_health_center/patient_information/health_topics/vitamin_d_and_the_heart.html http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/heart_vascular_institute/clin...
    - dogma1138 10y ago
      Nothing to do with supplements, that is nonsense but we're talking about very low levels of certain nutrients including vitamins and various minerals. Low levels of vitamin D have been directly linked to increased death rates from cardiovascular conditions that doesn't mean the swallowing pills would help. Vitamin A deficiency is one of the leading causes of blindness amongst children and pregnancy related mortality in the world, this also happens in western countries by not as much. And so on and so on, eventually you can tie a lot of medical causes to poor diet, not getting enough X which causes or makes condition Y worse leading to death. Dying to starvation proper (excluding famines and other natural disasters) is kinda hard in the west, and in many other places unless it's enforced starvation, you simply tend to die to exposure way before that.
      - dpark 10y ago
        > Nothing to do with supplements, that is nonsense but we're talking about very low levels of certain nutrients including vitamins and various minerals. I don't know how to interpret this. You're saying that supplements are nonsense but the deficiencies are real? So the deficiency causes mortality but from fixing the deficiency doesn't reduce mortality? > Low levels of vitamin D have been directly linked to increased death rates from cardiovascular conditions that doesn't mean the swallowing pills would help." Vitamin D deficiency is correlated with certain cardiovascular conditions. "Directly linked" doesn't really mean anything and is misleading because it could easily be interpreted to be causal which is definitely not established. If it were causal then supplements would fix it. > And so on and so on, eventually you can tie a lot of medical causes to poor diet, not getting enough X which causes or makes condition Y worse leading to death. This is the sort of statement that I don't think is supported by the science, but is so vague that it's difficult to meaningfully discuss. What is "a lot"? Is it some small fraction of a percentage? My understanding is that in the western world, vitamin deficiencies are fairly rare and clinical evidence doesn't indicate most conditions are clearly tied to deficiencies. Obviously what you eat will impact your health but the area is so complex that the contribution of minor deficiencies is basically impossible to separate from the noise. An implication of this is that recommendations of specific supplements or specific foods for correcting deficiencies are generally not scientific.

kafkaesq 10y ago

One suspects that there's a great deal of variability in how a given death gets labelled as being due to "malnutrition" or something else. Or for example whether miscarriages due to poor nutritional health of the mother get labelled as "infant deaths" or not; etc.