10 ms·

Python for Feature Film: Programming Images to Life

187 points by dagmx 10y ago

dagmx 10y ago
Just sharing a series of posts I wrote recently about how Python is used in the film industry. The post linked outlines the pipeline in general, and there are individual case study posts for films I've worked on. They're less technical and more of an overview but I thought it would be of interest nonetheless.
- pryelluw 10y ago
  This is greag content. Thanks for sharing. Where else in the fil industry do you see python being used in the next 3 years?
  - dagmx 10y ago
    I could see it maybe being used to develop on set controllers. Things like programming of lights etc could potentially use it. I also see it being commonly used for web servers that are also used by the film industry. Django is quite common so I suspect that's another area. Unfortunately I think that's about it. The de facto tools that are used outside of VFX and animation each have their own APIs on other languages and I don't see them converging on any particular language.
    - pryelluw 10y ago
      As a Django consultant its nice to know about this info. Do you happen to know the name of companies using Django? Id like to approach them for work :)
      - dagmx 10y ago
        Well my company does for certain projects: http://www.imageworks.com/jobs.php?p=job-postings&s=vancouver&a=8 http://www.imageworks.com/jobs.php?p=job-postings&s=vancouve... I believe Disney Animation do as well for certain projects too, and probably Pixar too. ILM also have a web department though I don't know if they use django but I suspect they would. It's not really front and center on any of the job listings I see, even on ours but we do definitely use it for some of our backend.
        pryelluw 10y ago
        Thanks thats really useful info.:)
      - kelsolaar 10y ago
        Some London companies are using it for their production tools.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
di 10y ago
Cached: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVSuYnYJ:dgovil.com/blog/2016/11/30/python-for-feature-film/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVS...
- wjdp 10y ago
  also here: https://archive.fo/TnKIM https://archive.fo/TnKIM
- dagmx 10y ago
  Thank you for sharing that. It seems I got reddit hugged to death. I was totally not expecting that many concurrent hits and failed to setup proper caching.
glaberficken 10y ago
Thanks for sharing, my favorite part wasn't even the one about Python. It's that you included a step by step list of the Animated feature film pipeline, I had no idea how it worked =)
- dagmx 10y ago
  Glad you found the breakdown of the stages interesting. It's a lot of moving pieces at one time.
dagmx 10y ago
Should be back up now. Reddit hugged my RAM to death. Set up a cacher and upgraded my VPS for the time being Sorry about the site going down. How embarrassing. Mirror here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVSuYnYJ:dgovil.com/blog/2016/11/30/python-for-feature-film/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVS... I was totally not expecting that much traffic in such a short period of time and failed to set up a cacher properly.
awongh 10y ago
this is very cool. what are some of the names of the jobs that are programming based (as opposed to 3d artist based)? I am also very curious about what the breakdown is between people who write the pipeline code and those who write the stuff being put into and out of these pipelines- is the difference very big? (i.e. how deep in the stack does each role go?) And what kinds of experience do they look for, and how would you say a regular old web dev programmer would go about getting that experience?
- wdfx 10y ago
  Vfx companies need web devs too! I'm a lead for a team which delivers web based tools for vfx production management. Quite a few bits of our apps and back ends have to integrate with pipeline tools and asset management systems, so there is an interesting cross over. Also for that reason we have python services and web stacks.
  - wdfx 10y ago
    That is to say, you could join a vfx company using your existing web dev skills and once you are familiarized with the vfx environment and pipeline, transfer onto a pipeline team.
- robbs 10y ago
  Hi awongh, Have a look at the jobs boards for VFX companies. For example: https://www.wetafx.co.nz/jobs https://www.wetafx.co.nz/jobs Web development is very much needed!
- dagmx 10y ago
  > what are some of the names of the jobs that are programming based (as opposed to 3d artist based)? We have a lot. A few of the top of my head: * Render developer. It's less artist focused and more about the math and optimizations. * Web infrastructure developer (we use oracle dbs, django, various RPC services etc) * Computer Vision A good example is Disney who do research in various fields: https://www.disneyresearch.com/publications/ https://www.disneyresearch.com/publications/ > I am also very curious about what the breakdown is between people who write the pipeline code and those who write the stuff being put into and out of these pipelines- is the difference very big? This depends on the studio a lot. At our studio, there's a wide variety of people. We never expect an artist (Animator, lighter, etc) to be able to program. They just need to know how to hit a button to open a publish UI and then hit publish in there. But for the programmers we don't expect them to have an artistic background. They often just need to know how to develop. That said the best people are the ones who can do both. Artists who understand the technical aspect often work faster, and developers who understand the artistic side often make better tools because they understand the mindset > And what kinds of experience do they look for, and how would you say a regular old web dev programmer would go about getting that experience? The experience really depends on the role to be honest. If you're a web developer, studios often have dedicated web development teams for both backend and frontend web development who really don't need experience in the film industry. The kinds of projects include: * Our production tracking software is all web based. A similar project is: https://www.shotgunsoftware.com/ https://www.shotgunsoftware.com/ * Our payroll systems are all web based * Similarly all our media management also has dedicated servers to fascilitate creation and acquisition of media. There's always room to move departments too and many people have as well once they get more hands on in the studio.
brachi 10y ago
> Additionally, it’s important to note that the film industry uses Python 2.7 and not Python 3. There has been significant code developed with Python 2 and it’s not easy to switch forward yet, It's worth mentioning that Blender has adopted Python 3 as its scripting language since 2.5 (2011), but maybe represents a small set of 'the industry', with smaller studios.
- dr_zoidberg 10y ago
  While I'm guilty of staying with an "aging" 2.7 codebase (due to lack of time, and my employer not being really sure about Py3), with 3.6 I've been looking more and more into porting and it doesn't look that complicated. Am I missing something when people say that "it's not easy to switch"?
  - anewhnaccount 10y ago
    My guess is people are afraid they're going to end up with difficult to debug edge case type bugs and have to sink loads of time into it beyond the standard porting steps.
  - auxym 10y ago
    From my limited experience, the code that needs the most work is that involving reading text files -- the whole unicode vs bytes thing. For the rest, the 2to3 tool does the vast majority of the job.
    - singularity2001 10y ago
      just tried 2to3 on a small code-base and it seriously BROKE logic, i.e. introduced bugs!
      - dekhn 10y ago
        could you be more specific
  - dagmx 10y ago

187 points by dagmx 10y ago

dagmx 10y ago

Just sharing a series of posts I wrote recently about how Python is used in the film industry. The post linked outlines the pipeline in general, and there are individual case study posts for films I've worked on. They're less technical and more of an overview but I thought it would be of interest nonetheless.

pryelluw 10y ago
This is greag content. Thanks for sharing. Where else in the fil industry do you see python being used in the next 3 years?
- dagmx 10y ago
  I could see it maybe being used to develop on set controllers. Things like programming of lights etc could potentially use it. I also see it being commonly used for web servers that are also used by the film industry. Django is quite common so I suspect that's another area. Unfortunately I think that's about it. The de facto tools that are used outside of VFX and animation each have their own APIs on other languages and I don't see them converging on any particular language.
  - pryelluw 10y ago
    As a Django consultant its nice to know about this info. Do you happen to know the name of companies using Django? Id like to approach them for work :)
    - dagmx 10y ago
      Well my company does for certain projects: http://www.imageworks.com/jobs.php?p=job-postings&s=vancouver&a=8 http://www.imageworks.com/jobs.php?p=job-postings&s=vancouve... I believe Disney Animation do as well for certain projects too, and probably Pixar too. ILM also have a web department though I don't know if they use django but I suspect they would. It's not really front and center on any of the job listings I see, even on ours but we do definitely use it for some of our backend.
      - pryelluw 10y ago
        Thanks thats really useful info.:)
    - kelsolaar 10y ago
      Some London companies are using it for their production tools.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

di 10y ago

Cached: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVSuYnYJ:dgovil.com/blog/2016/11/30/python-for-feature-film/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVS...

wjdp 10y ago
also here: https://archive.fo/TnKIM https://archive.fo/TnKIM
dagmx 10y ago
Thank you for sharing that. It seems I got reddit hugged to death. I was totally not expecting that many concurrent hits and failed to setup proper caching.

glaberficken 10y ago

Thanks for sharing, my favorite part wasn't even the one about Python. It's that you included a step by step list of the Animated feature film pipeline, I had no idea how it worked =)

dagmx 10y ago
Glad you found the breakdown of the stages interesting. It's a lot of moving pieces at one time.

dagmx 10y ago

Should be back up now. Reddit hugged my RAM to death. Set up a cacher and upgraded my VPS for the time being Sorry about the site going down. How embarrassing. Mirror here: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVSuYnYJ:dgovil.com/blog/2016/11/30/python-for-feature-film/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QEt3EVS... I was totally not expecting that much traffic in such a short period of time and failed to set up a cacher properly.

awongh 10y ago

this is very cool. what are some of the names of the jobs that are programming based (as opposed to 3d artist based)? I am also very curious about what the breakdown is between people who write the pipeline code and those who write the stuff being put into and out of these pipelines- is the difference very big? (i.e. how deep in the stack does each role go?) And what kinds of experience do they look for, and how would you say a regular old web dev programmer would go about getting that experience?

wdfx 10y ago
Vfx companies need web devs too! I'm a lead for a team which delivers web based tools for vfx production management. Quite a few bits of our apps and back ends have to integrate with pipeline tools and asset management systems, so there is an interesting cross over. Also for that reason we have python services and web stacks.
- wdfx 10y ago
  That is to say, you could join a vfx company using your existing web dev skills and once you are familiarized with the vfx environment and pipeline, transfer onto a pipeline team.
robbs 10y ago
Hi awongh, Have a look at the jobs boards for VFX companies. For example: https://www.wetafx.co.nz/jobs https://www.wetafx.co.nz/jobs Web development is very much needed!
dagmx 10y ago
> what are some of the names of the jobs that are programming based (as opposed to 3d artist based)? We have a lot. A few of the top of my head: * Render developer. It's less artist focused and more about the math and optimizations. * Web infrastructure developer (we use oracle dbs, django, various RPC services etc) * Computer Vision A good example is Disney who do research in various fields: https://www.disneyresearch.com/publications/ https://www.disneyresearch.com/publications/ > I am also very curious about what the breakdown is between people who write the pipeline code and those who write the stuff being put into and out of these pipelines- is the difference very big? This depends on the studio a lot. At our studio, there's a wide variety of people. We never expect an artist (Animator, lighter, etc) to be able to program. They just need to know how to hit a button to open a publish UI and then hit publish in there. But for the programmers we don't expect them to have an artistic background. They often just need to know how to develop. That said the best people are the ones who can do both. Artists who understand the technical aspect often work faster, and developers who understand the artistic side often make better tools because they understand the mindset > And what kinds of experience do they look for, and how would you say a regular old web dev programmer would go about getting that experience? The experience really depends on the role to be honest. If you're a web developer, studios often have dedicated web development teams for both backend and frontend web development who really don't need experience in the film industry. The kinds of projects include: * Our production tracking software is all web based. A similar project is: https://www.shotgunsoftware.com/ https://www.shotgunsoftware.com/ * Our payroll systems are all web based * Similarly all our media management also has dedicated servers to fascilitate creation and acquisition of media. There's always room to move departments too and many people have as well once they get more hands on in the studio.

brachi 10y ago

> Additionally, it’s important to note that the film industry uses Python 2.7 and not Python 3. There has been significant code developed with Python 2 and it’s not easy to switch forward yet, It's worth mentioning that Blender has adopted Python 3 as its scripting language since 2.5 (2011), but maybe represents a small set of 'the industry', with smaller studios.

dr_zoidberg 10y ago
While I'm guilty of staying with an "aging" 2.7 codebase (due to lack of time, and my employer not being really sure about Py3), with 3.6 I've been looking more and more into porting and it doesn't look that complicated. Am I missing something when people say that "it's not easy to switch"?
- anewhnaccount 10y ago
  My guess is people are afraid they're going to end up with difficult to debug edge case type bugs and have to sink loads of time into it beyond the standard porting steps.
- auxym 10y ago
  From my limited experience, the code that needs the most work is that involving reading text files -- the whole unicode vs bytes thing. For the rest, the 2to3 tool does the vast majority of the job.
  - singularity2001 10y ago
    just tried 2to3 on a small code-base and it seriously BROKE logic, i.e. introduced bugs!
    - dekhn 10y ago
      could you be more specific
- dagmx 10y ago