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I am hoping that with cross platform Swift we can start seeing more libraries to help us port Mac apps to Linux. I am a Mac developer but I'd love to make stuff

I am hoping that with cross platform Swift we can start seeing more libraries to help us port Mac apps to Linux. I am a Mac developer but I'd love to make stuff available on Linux. I really like Linux as a backup plan, in case Apple totally drops the ball on professionals on the Mac. The Linux desktop is getting pretty good, but it lacks well designed high quality GUI applications. If porting to Linux was done easier that could change.

hashkb 10y ago
> I really like Linux as a backup plan, in case Apple totally drops the ball on professionals on the Mac. Is this a joke, referencing the new MBP releases? Personally, I've been saying we're there already. I haven't bought a Mac in years. (employers keep giving them to me and I install Ubuntu on them.)
- Calamitous 10y ago
  How well does that work? I love the hardware, but I'd love to run ubuntu on my MBP even more.
  - AsyncAwait 10y ago
    Not sure about Ubuntu, but https://antergos.com https://antergos.com works very well on my 15" MBP out of the box.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
zanny 10y ago
> it lacks well designed high quality GUI applications. If porting to Linux was done easier that could change. Fundamental to most peoples complaints about desktop Linux applications is the lack of look and feel cohesion across all permutations of distro, desktop, and toolkit. Wine applications using the Windows APIs look like complete garbage and fit in nowhere. The same would be true of OSX Cocoa apps - they wouldn't mesh well at all, and it would be practically impossible to skin them with toolkit theming. That, and recent efforts by Gnome and KDE have been producing tons of good new applications with modern GUI. They just aren't all the applications yet.
- Brakenshire 10y ago
  I suppose it's useful when almost everything works, but that one thing that you absolutely need isn't otherwise available.
  - riprowan 10y ago
    This is my problem. Audio editing on Linux is a joke. For everything else I do, Linux can get me there. So I need a Mac or a PC as an audio editor? Might as well just get a Mac or a PC. I'll have to maintain it anyway, and it can do everything Linux can do, plus probably be better supported.
    - hexscrews 10y ago
      Would like to point out, unless you are running on non-x86 hardware or a tablet, the term pc still applies to linux based hardware.
      - mmanfrin 10y ago
        It technically also applies to Macs -- but in practice it means Windows-based desktops and laptops.
    - babuskov 10y ago
      What about video editing? I mean, I can live with Audacity for my basic needs, but I can't find anything simple as iMovie. Or should I just bite the bullet and learn Blender? Does it have preset screen transitions and stuff like that?
      - ollyfg 10y ago
        Have you tried openshot[1]? I haven't played much with it recently, but when it came out it was the most stable, simple video editor for linux. [1] http://openshot.org/ http://openshot.org/
hapless 10y ago
If you're interested in porting code, many of the OSX core libraries are available as part of the GNUstep project: https://www.gnu.org/software/gnustep/ https://www.gnu.org/software/gnustep/ Most of "cocoa" came from the OPENSTEP specification, and GNUstep offers quite a complete implementation.
- roblabla 10y ago
  Is there a list of things missing ? A guide on how to contribute ? I'd love to port my favorite OSX apps to linux (ITerm 2, I miss you so much ;_;) but that website makes it almost a point to be as useless as possible. Also, reading through http://wiki.gnustep.org/index.php/User_Guides http://wiki.gnustep.org/index.php/User_Guides , why does it talk about FileSystem Layout. Is GNUStep an OS ? I thought it was just a library. The whole thing feels a bit messy :|.
  - bandrami 10y ago
    why does it talk about FileSystem Layout. Is GNUStep an OS ? I thought it was just a library. Pretty much the first thing a desktop environment has to do is establish an abstraction layer for filesystems, so that desktop-enabled applications can have a consistent way to talk about files. Both Gnome and KDE have a VFS layer (GVFS and KIO, respectively).
    - Mister_Snuggles 10y ago
      I really wish they wouldn't. A good portion of what KIO and GVFS do should be done at a lower level. Instead we get this weird situation where I can "see" a file in KWrite, but I can't see it the shell or in a non-KIO-enabled program.
  - babuskov 10y ago
    > ITerm 2, I miss you so much Interesting, when I'm using Mac and I miss KDE's Konsole, which is superior IMHO. Which features are you missing from ITerm2?
lmm 10y ago
Objective-C has been crossplatform for decades. The issue isn't the programming language, it's the GUI toolkits. Probably the best way to get cross-platform apps would be to improve Qt on Mac to the point where Mac apps were willing to use it.
- pcwalton 10y ago
  > Probably the best way to get cross-platform apps would be to improve Qt on Mac to the point where Mac apps were willing to use it. I predict this won't ever happen. Whether fairly or not, Qt has a reputation for not feeling native, and this is extremely difficult to shake. And with Swift becoming the language of choice for Mac development, the use of C++ (not even standard C++: C++ with the moc preprocessor) is becoming more and more of a liability.
  - kccqzy 10y ago
    On the other hand, in the JavaScript world we are piling more and more transpilers/preprocessors/postprocessors. I think the use of moc won't contribute much to the liability.
fit2rule 10y ago
Why wait for Swift? You can already do what you want with something like Lua. The only issue is that you have to be willing to build a platform around your Lua code-base, and not just have it handed to you ..
rimantas 10y ago
To have high quality GUI Swift is not enough. You'd need to have AppKit ported, and a bunch of Core* (CoreImage, etc.) stuff. In short—not going to happen.
progman 10y ago
FYI macbuntu: Howto make Ubuntu look like OSX http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/macbuntu-transform-ubuntu-1604-to-mac-os-x http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/macbuntu-transform-ubuntu...
niutech 10y ago
Linux has a lot of high quality apps, e.g. Krita, LibreOffice, Lightworks, Blender. Which programs from OSX don't have their Linux counterpart? With Qt/GTK/GNUstep you can make almost any app cross-platform.

hashkb 10y ago

> I really like Linux as a backup plan, in case Apple totally drops the ball on professionals on the Mac. Is this a joke, referencing the new MBP releases? Personally, I've been saying we're there already. I haven't bought a Mac in years. (employers keep giving them to me and I install Ubuntu on them.)

Calamitous 10y ago
How well does that work? I love the hardware, but I'd love to run ubuntu on my MBP even more.
- AsyncAwait 10y ago
  Not sure about Ubuntu, but https://antergos.com https://antergos.com works very well on my 15" MBP out of the box.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

zanny 10y ago

> it lacks well designed high quality GUI applications. If porting to Linux was done easier that could change. Fundamental to most peoples complaints about desktop Linux applications is the lack of look and feel cohesion across all permutations of distro, desktop, and toolkit. Wine applications using the Windows APIs look like complete garbage and fit in nowhere. The same would be true of OSX Cocoa apps - they wouldn't mesh well at all, and it would be practically impossible to skin them with toolkit theming. That, and recent efforts by Gnome and KDE have been producing tons of good new applications with modern GUI. They just aren't all the applications yet.

Brakenshire 10y ago
I suppose it's useful when almost everything works, but that one thing that you absolutely need isn't otherwise available.
- riprowan 10y ago
  This is my problem. Audio editing on Linux is a joke. For everything else I do, Linux can get me there. So I need a Mac or a PC as an audio editor? Might as well just get a Mac or a PC. I'll have to maintain it anyway, and it can do everything Linux can do, plus probably be better supported.
  - hexscrews 10y ago
    Would like to point out, unless you are running on non-x86 hardware or a tablet, the term pc still applies to linux based hardware.
    - mmanfrin 10y ago
      It technically also applies to Macs -- but in practice it means Windows-based desktops and laptops.
  - babuskov 10y ago
    What about video editing? I mean, I can live with Audacity for my basic needs, but I can't find anything simple as iMovie. Or should I just bite the bullet and learn Blender? Does it have preset screen transitions and stuff like that?
    - ollyfg 10y ago
      Have you tried openshot[1]? I haven't played much with it recently, but when it came out it was the most stable, simple video editor for linux. [1] http://openshot.org/ http://openshot.org/

hapless 10y ago

If you're interested in porting code, many of the OSX core libraries are available as part of the GNUstep project: https://www.gnu.org/software/gnustep/ https://www.gnu.org/software/gnustep/ Most of "cocoa" came from the OPENSTEP specification, and GNUstep offers quite a complete implementation.

roblabla 10y ago
Is there a list of things missing ? A guide on how to contribute ? I'd love to port my favorite OSX apps to linux (ITerm 2, I miss you so much ;_;) but that website makes it almost a point to be as useless as possible. Also, reading through http://wiki.gnustep.org/index.php/User_Guides http://wiki.gnustep.org/index.php/User_Guides , why does it talk about FileSystem Layout. Is GNUStep an OS ? I thought it was just a library. The whole thing feels a bit messy :|.
- bandrami 10y ago
  why does it talk about FileSystem Layout. Is GNUStep an OS ? I thought it was just a library. Pretty much the first thing a desktop environment has to do is establish an abstraction layer for filesystems, so that desktop-enabled applications can have a consistent way to talk about files. Both Gnome and KDE have a VFS layer (GVFS and KIO, respectively).
  - Mister_Snuggles 10y ago
    I really wish they wouldn't. A good portion of what KIO and GVFS do should be done at a lower level. Instead we get this weird situation where I can "see" a file in KWrite, but I can't see it the shell or in a non-KIO-enabled program.
- babuskov 10y ago
  > ITerm 2, I miss you so much Interesting, when I'm using Mac and I miss KDE's Konsole, which is superior IMHO. Which features are you missing from ITerm2?

lmm 10y ago

Objective-C has been crossplatform for decades. The issue isn't the programming language, it's the GUI toolkits. Probably the best way to get cross-platform apps would be to improve Qt on Mac to the point where Mac apps were willing to use it.

pcwalton 10y ago
> Probably the best way to get cross-platform apps would be to improve Qt on Mac to the point where Mac apps were willing to use it. I predict this won't ever happen. Whether fairly or not, Qt has a reputation for not feeling native, and this is extremely difficult to shake. And with Swift becoming the language of choice for Mac development, the use of C++ (not even standard C++: C++ with the moc preprocessor) is becoming more and more of a liability.
- kccqzy 10y ago
  On the other hand, in the JavaScript world we are piling more and more transpilers/preprocessors/postprocessors. I think the use of moc won't contribute much to the liability.

fit2rule 10y ago

Why wait for Swift? You can already do what you want with something like Lua. The only issue is that you have to be willing to build a platform around your Lua code-base, and not just have it handed to you ..

rimantas 10y ago

To have high quality GUI Swift is not enough. You'd need to have AppKit ported, and a bunch of Core* (CoreImage, etc.) stuff. In short—not going to happen.

progman 10y ago

FYI macbuntu: Howto make Ubuntu look like OSX http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/macbuntu-transform-ubuntu-1604-to-mac-os-x http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/macbuntu-transform-ubuntu...

niutech 10y ago

Linux has a lot of high quality apps, e.g. Krita, LibreOffice, Lightworks, Blender. Which programs from OSX don't have their Linux counterpart? With Qt/GTK/GNUstep you can make almost any app cross-platform.