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The Remote Freelancer: A list of remote work alternatives to Upwork
- RonanTheGrey 10y agoAfter Shadi Paterson's post about his experience with Upwork (and my own floundering trying to find freelance and contract work) I decided to make this list. Please feel free to contribute and make a great community-curated list of remote working resources!
- sebisebi 10y agoThank you for the list. Someone also mentioned codementor.io in the other thread. If you don't include a license, it is protected by copyright fyi.
- RonanTheGrey 10y agoI'll add it! Funny I forgot, I have an account there ^_^
- pluma 10y agoThis is bikeshedding, but I think CC0 is more appropriate than the Unlicense. CC0 covers all copyrighted works, Unlicense was specifically written for software. As this is a text file, the Unlicense doesn't really apply. https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/ https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/
- omegote 10y agoCare to link that post you mentioned?
- 0xmohit 10y agoThe post [0]. Related HN discussion [1]. [0] https://medium.com/@AdShadlabs/why-you-should-never-use-upwork-ever-5c62848bdf46 https://medium.com/@AdShadlabs/why-you-should-never-use-upwo... [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12773282 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12773282
- grimsbylad 10y agoFor those that need more convincing about Upwork, there's also: - You’re good. Way too good to be on UpWork [http://dalsass.mobi/blog/your-good-upwork/ http://dalsass.mobi/blog/your-good-upwork/] - Upwork vs Freelancer.com: Why It’s a Battle YOU Won’t Win [http://launchastartup.com/odesk-vs-elance/ http://launchastartup.com/odesk-vs-elance/]
- tmikaeld 10y agoThank you very much for this. My company hire from UpWork but after reading that appalling behaviour, we are considering any alternative.
- penetrarthur 10y agohttp://konsus.com http://konsus.com
- kagaw 10y agohttp://www.outsourcely.com/ http://www.outsourcely.com/
- wkubiak 10y agoThanks for this list. Am in the process of looking for contract work. One interesting thing is that most sites target freelancers as single people. What if I have a team of coders/designers (ie. a small software house) looking for clients? That's my current problem. Maybe will start a new thread about this.
- dagw 10y agoA non-trivial number of the "freelancers" on Upworks are in fact project managers for larger teams. They'll act as the face of the project and handle communications, but the work will be done by others. But I agree it would be nice if this was made more explicit, and even touted as a feature. In many cases I might feel more comfortable hiring a team consisting of two developers a graphic designer and a UI/UX expert as opposed to one person claiming to be an expert in all those fields.
- k__ 10y agoThe first big thing I learned as software consultant was, don't charge per hour and now there are even portals that are called "People Per Hour" and "We Work Hourly". Funny.
- znebby 10y agoWhy? I do some work on upwork and I find working hourly much more convenient as I don't risk a bad estimate or changing requirements.
- k__ 10y agoAs far as I know, working hourly is one of the many steps that lead to commoditization.
- sharemywin 10y agoThe problem with fix bid is the formula is hours* rate * risk of bad/fuzzy requirements. If I assume the risk I'll get a project done less expensive. I do have to management the project though.
- Disruptive_Dave 10y agoI've been pretty much exclusively project-based with my Upwork fees. You're right in that it's usually a risk, and scope-creep is always a potential issue, but it's worked out relatively well in my experience. I usually go out of my way to provide the client with my own detailed task summary regardless of his/her job posting content, to ensure we're on the same page and to give us both a flag-in-the-sand as a reference. The more you work with a platform like Upwork, the better you get at quickly labeling and filtering clients/gigs, and the better you get at finding similar jobs to successful ones you've completed. That's when project-based fees are great because you can trim hours by creating a system and/or template that reduces your project hours over time.
- k__ 10y ago
- throwaway047 10y agoBeen using Upwork a bit more intensely over the last 2 years to supplement my earnings while growing a startup. I can confidently say that 85% of my activity on Upwork is lead generation, meaning the project specifics and payment is done off the platform. I know that's violating their terms (hence the throwaway) but as others have pointed out, Upwork isn't exactly a great friend to the freelancer. I've had great success with this approach, so it certainly can be done.
- larrymcp 10y agoWould love to get some tips on this! My top questions are: (1) how to evade detection of this by Upwork? (2) how to ensure payment from the client without the escrow service?
- throwaway047 10y agoI've been admittedly cavalier about the whole thing and have not had any issues yet. The process typically looks like this: 1. I bid on the project and in my opening message I write that I'd love to learn more about the project/client and am available for phone/Skype call. I'm finding more and more jobs that already request a quick Skype "interview" so that's fine by me. I've never been flagged (to my knowledge) by Upwork for providing my email or Skype name in Upwork messages. 2. 9 times out of 10 I end up redefining the project scope based on my conversation w/ the client. As an action item coming out of the call, I always tell the client I'll send them a 1-pager task summary with anticipated fees and timeline via email (which takes our communication off Upwork). 3. In that 1-pager, I have a standard payment section which includes non-Upwork services like paypal, venmo, etc. At this point it's about feeling the client out. I'm not actively trying to screw Upwork, but their new pricing is just ridiculous, so I'm also not too concerned about ethics here either. I've yet to have a client get offended at the thought of completing our transaction off Upwork's platform, but I also don't push the issue if I feel hesitation. 4. Also as part of my standard payment policy is 50% payment upfront with 50% upon completion. To this day I've only been left out to dry by a client once and it was only about $650. For projects with very large fees, I'll sometimes split the final 50% up into 25% at a certain mile marker and then 25% upon completion. I should mention that I only work with growth/marketing/content jobs, typically strategy > execution. I also put a lot of stock into my ability to suss out job owners, though I'm fully aware that instincts can bite you in your ass.
- orangewin 10y agoA few more resources here for remote work options can be found here: http://nodesk.co/remote-work/ http://nodesk.co/remote-work/
- rossriley 10y agoThanks for the list, there's a couple I hadn't come across before. Domino and TopTal look like they may be more suitable for more experienced developers. What is everyone else's experience for finding work at the higher end of the market ($600 - $900 / day)? From my experience I know the demand is out there but currently all of my work comes via traditional recruitment agencies which seems a shame for the companies doing the hiring, since agencies charge fairly big fees. I have in the past tried eLance, Upwork, People Per Hour, and they all seem to end up overrun with low-end work and low-end clients and whilst there may be some gems in there it ends up not being worth your time to sift through / send propsals because 95% of clients will choke if you mention your hourly rate.
- thibaut_barrere 10y agoFor higher end market (north of $900 for 7 hours of work), 100% remote, no agencies/only direct, no fixed price projects, I apply the advice I outlined here: https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you-rather-than-you-chasing-them https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you.... EDIT: I've been freelancing since 2005, and 100% remote since 2010. Happy to answer questions!
- k__ 10y agoNice, thanks for the infos :) I also liked the infos of Brennan Dunn, but these seem mostly related to keeping customers and appearing "professional".
- asimuvPR 10y agoThe content of that post is amazingly on point. Anyone looking to build a clientele should follow it.
- bbrazil 10y agoI run a consulting/support business around Prometheus. I've found that giving talks and weekly writing blog posts (https://www.robustperception.io/blog/ https://www.robustperception.io/blog/) are great for acquiring customers. Beware though it's often at least 6-9 months before any of it directly bears fruit.
- mosburger 10y agoHere's a similar list on GitHub for Remote Work (with less of a Freelancer bent than the OP)... it's not maintained by me, I just stumbled upon it once a while back: https://github.com/lukasz-madon/awesome-remote-job/blob/master/README.md#job-boards https://github.com/lukasz-madon/awesome-remote-job/blob/mast...
- mamarjan 10y agoAnybody knows how/where to find clients from Europe? As a software developer?
- RonanTheGrey 10y agoHi mamarjan, if you check the list a contribution was made that included a couple of French lists - I'm sure there are more!
- ivm 10y agoMore alternatives, I haven't tried any of them: - https://coworks.com/ https://coworks.com/ - https://crew.co/ https://crew.co/ - http://dreamlance.io/ http://dreamlance.io/ - https://www.freelancer.com/ https://www.freelancer.com/ - https://gigster.com/ https://gigster.com/ - https://gun.io/ https://gun.io/ - http://www.guru.com/ http://www.guru.com/ - https://www.workana.com/ https://www.workana.com/
- drusepth 10y agoI use Freelancer.com a lot (both as a freelancer and employer) and it's very comparable to Upwork in terms of quality. You can land slightly cheaper projects (as an employer), and the Powers That Be behind the site tend to favor freelancers more than employers in mediation (contrary to Upwork's employers-first paradigm).
- inputcoffee 10y agoI applaud this but I think if its just a large list of alternatives, it actually encourages people to try UpWork because the sites are indistinguishable in a list. Best to add: 1. How many people are on this site? 2. Does it specialize in something? It would be even better to have some proxy of quality (eg. 3. average hourly rate or something), but that is a lot more work.
- kaizensoze 10y agoAlso: https://github.com/kaizensoze/remote-freelance-jobs https://github.com/kaizensoze/remote-freelance-jobs
- harrisonmalone 10y agoHeard good things about Speedlancer http://speedlancer.com/ http://speedlancer.com/ especially for Australian freelancers
- mrcactu5 10y agowhat happens if you're not in the top 3% of freelance talent. what happens if you're actually not that good? I am not kidding. By design that site eliminates 97% of applicants -- be it front-end or mobile development or Python or Java or Go language. Can people who are learning still do remote freelancing?
- RickS 10y agoNot sure what you mean. Surely more than 3% of the freelance talent pool is being used by companies at any one time. In fact, I'd say my issues with sites like these is that most of them are exclusively for people who aren't that good. I don't know about top 3%, but I'd say I'm in the top 25% for what I do and I have a hard as hell time finding top 25% clients. I did the most remote freelancing at the earliest point in my career, while still learning, and given the cost sensitivity of most companies that hire freelancers, I'd say it works real well for that. Just send the emails. You'd be surprised how crappy your competition is.
- bartvk 10y agoAs noted elsewhere, that top 3% is just the gimmick of TopTal. They filter based on Codility tests. You can prepare for the tests there as well: https://codility.com/programmers/ https://codility.com/programmers/
- neurotixz 10y agoAnyone in the security field has used any of these sites and can give feedback? I am looking for short/remote gigs to supplement my work now, could be interesting. I was a full-time consultant for a while but decided to go back being a full time employee due to a new baby in the house.
- RonanTheGrey 10y agoWow this actually got some activity, thank you guys :) There have been a bunch more resources mentioned here - I'm working on including them all! If someone wants to help me go through and actually qualify each of the items - that would be amazing. Probably needs an actual site now, a standard MD file is a little hard to read when it gets complex.
- wodow 10y agoA relevant but brief plug for the now much neglected http://www.lancelist.com http://www.lancelist.com
- sdiq 10y agoI am not seeing anyone mention https://www.crossover.com https://www.crossover.com. Anyone here with any experience about them?
- GFischer 10y agoThe only thing I personally can testify is that they spam LinkedIn and other channels with job ads. I've read some spanish-language forums and read about very different experiences - some good, some pretty bad.
- hollaur 10y agoI created an invite-only marketplace that offers 31 pre-packaged marketing-related gigs. https://freelanship.com https://freelanship.com You can read why I created it here: https://medium.com/@laurenholliday_/10-reasons-i-created-my-own-marketplace-2c5ef9a2ca3f https://medium.com/@laurenholliday_/10-reasons-i-created-my-...