5 ms·

It's an admirable goal, but it would seem to violate the second law of thermodynamics. There is almost always waste. Even if we could create some reversible pro

It's an admirable goal, but it would seem to violate the second law of thermodynamics. There is almost always waste. Even if we could create some reversible processes, adhering to these would require a lot of behavioral enforcement since there would be consumptive alternatives that were easier or cheaper. Our current regime is hardly panglossian, but there are always costs to idealistic schemes that the designers of such fail to anticipate.

noonespecial 10y ago
I think the idea is to use energy input collected from the sun to push our material resources in a circle instead of the way we do it now, which is to use previously stored sun energy to push our natural resources in a line from a more useful place/form to a less useful place/form. This linear method leaves us with both less useful material and less easily collected energy when we're done. We will have to change over sooner or later and it gets harder if we wait until later. The thermodynamics of it is simple. The energy input of a nearby star means its not a "closed system". There's plenty of energy input to keep it all going. How to use it is the choice. Eventually the costs of idealistic schemes will balance out, probably with interest, at the point where there is no longer a choice; the stored energy collected and spent, and our material wealth buried in landfills after being reduced to its least useful form.
- jackcosgrove 10y ago
  That is a viable strategy. If, however, solar energy is eventually cheaper than fossil fuels there will be less incentive to be efficient.
- marcosdumay 10y ago
  If that is indeed the idea, isn't it much better to push for renewable energy instead of focusing on the use of carbon polymers? Eventually we can just burn all that trash down, and reassemble the carbon the way we want. It's is not the bottleneck for decades already.

noonespecial 10y ago

I think the idea is to use energy input collected from the sun to push our material resources in a circle instead of the way we do it now, which is to use previously stored sun energy to push our natural resources in a line from a more useful place/form to a less useful place/form. This linear method leaves us with both less useful material and less easily collected energy when we're done. We will have to change over sooner or later and it gets harder if we wait until later. The thermodynamics of it is simple. The energy input of a nearby star means its not a "closed system". There's plenty of energy input to keep it all going. How to use it is the choice. Eventually the costs of idealistic schemes will balance out, probably with interest, at the point where there is no longer a choice; the stored energy collected and spent, and our material wealth buried in landfills after being reduced to its least useful form.

jackcosgrove 10y ago
That is a viable strategy. If, however, solar energy is eventually cheaper than fossil fuels there will be less incentive to be efficient.
marcosdumay 10y ago
If that is indeed the idea, isn't it much better to push for renewable energy instead of focusing on the use of carbon polymers? Eventually we can just burn all that trash down, and reassemble the carbon the way we want. It's is not the bottleneck for decades already.