6 ms·

It's simply a replacement of informal barriers with formal ones, plus compensation of the lowering of travel and communication costs due to technology: someone

It's simply a replacement of informal barriers with formal ones, plus compensation of the lowering of travel and communication costs due to technology: someone who traveled abroad in the XIXth century was either well-off so he would pass any currently existing barriers easily, or really really needed it so he would do it, too. With international air ticket worth less than a good meal, some other barrier had to be constructed or all modern nations would be quickly razed by influx of billions destitute immigrants.

mynameislegion 10y ago
Even in modern times, international air tickets are more expensive and worldwide wages lower than you imagine.
- Symbiote 10y ago
  Perhaps, but there are other options -- international bus tickets are pretty cheap. So is the ferry between, for example, Morocco and Spain. Plenty of people could afford this, or have friends/relatives in wealthy countries who could pay for them.
  - goblin89 10y ago
    It is actually easier to visit some countries by air today. Visa on arrival, visa-free transit or stay—these options can be available only at airports. Passport control as immigration regulation/deterrent definitely rings true to me, and some countries see less need for it with richer travelers.
PhasmaFelis 10y ago
> With international air ticket worth less than a good meal Jesus Christ, where are you getting your lunch from?
- ghaff 10y ago
  Low-cost carrier airfares within Europe can be quite cheap. Obviously most international flights from, say, the US are going to be in at least the hundreds of dollars.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- frobozz 10y ago
  Ryanair, I guess. Verona to Brussels is 8 Euros. A "meal deal" on the plane is 10.
  - chrischen 10y ago
    Why doesn't the US have such fares?
    - Symbiote 10y ago
      These fares do require decent flexibility -- for tourist destinations, you won't be leaving on a Friday and returning on Sunday. The £4.49 flight between London and Romania is on a Wednesday, on a Friday it's £60-70. Ryanair use the low fares for marketing, pretty successfully. They probably expect many people to add luggage (£10-40, depending on route), or buy food on the plane (£10+) or be disorganized and end up paying more. In Western/Northern Europe they use out-of-the-way airports -- London Stansted is 47 minutes by the fastest train from London, or over an hour by car. They have a reputation for reducing the fees they pay the airport by threatening to move to alternative airports, unless they're given a very good deal. People walk to the plane, they don't use jet bridges. The whole plane is economy class, and the seats plasticy-fake-leather, which must speed up cleaning. At airports, they'll usually use the worst (farthest) gates. All the planes are the same, so maintenance is simplified and pilots easily moved around. As to why the US doesn't have them -- I don't know. Norwegian is a budget airline, and has fares like New York to Paris for $175 one way (Tuesday, no luggage, no food!).
      - 10y ago
abecedarius 10y ago
> or really really needed it so he would [pass barriers easily], too A lot of European Jews in the 1930s were trying and failing to emigrate, in a system pretty much like today's (plus the unusual bonus that their home state wanted them to leave). https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007455 https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007455

mynameislegion 10y ago

Even in modern times, international air tickets are more expensive and worldwide wages lower than you imagine.

Symbiote 10y ago
Perhaps, but there are other options -- international bus tickets are pretty cheap. So is the ferry between, for example, Morocco and Spain. Plenty of people could afford this, or have friends/relatives in wealthy countries who could pay for them.
- goblin89 10y ago
  It is actually easier to visit some countries by air today. Visa on arrival, visa-free transit or stay—these options can be available only at airports. Passport control as immigration regulation/deterrent definitely rings true to me, and some countries see less need for it with richer travelers.

PhasmaFelis 10y ago

> With international air ticket worth less than a good meal Jesus Christ, where are you getting your lunch from?

ghaff 10y ago
Low-cost carrier airfares within Europe can be quite cheap. Obviously most international flights from, say, the US are going to be in at least the hundreds of dollars.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
frobozz 10y ago
Ryanair, I guess. Verona to Brussels is 8 Euros. A "meal deal" on the plane is 10.
- chrischen 10y ago
  Why doesn't the US have such fares?
  - Symbiote 10y ago
    These fares do require decent flexibility -- for tourist destinations, you won't be leaving on a Friday and returning on Sunday. The £4.49 flight between London and Romania is on a Wednesday, on a Friday it's £60-70. Ryanair use the low fares for marketing, pretty successfully. They probably expect many people to add luggage (£10-40, depending on route), or buy food on the plane (£10+) or be disorganized and end up paying more. In Western/Northern Europe they use out-of-the-way airports -- London Stansted is 47 minutes by the fastest train from London, or over an hour by car. They have a reputation for reducing the fees they pay the airport by threatening to move to alternative airports, unless they're given a very good deal. People walk to the plane, they don't use jet bridges. The whole plane is economy class, and the seats plasticy-fake-leather, which must speed up cleaning. At airports, they'll usually use the worst (farthest) gates. All the planes are the same, so maintenance is simplified and pilots easily moved around. As to why the US doesn't have them -- I don't know. Norwegian is a budget airline, and has fares like New York to Paris for $175 one way (Tuesday, no luggage, no food!).
    - 10y ago

abecedarius 10y ago

> or really really needed it so he would [pass barriers easily], too A lot of European Jews in the 1930s were trying and failing to emigrate, in a system pretty much like today's (plus the unusual bonus that their home state wanted them to leave). https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007455 https://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007455