17 ms·

> They blocked the enabling of a setting which allows Linux to see the hard disk. Or, alternatively, they removed a firmware setting that makes their hardware

by mjg59 10y ago

> They blocked the enabling of a setting which allows Linux to see the hard disk. Or, alternatively, they removed a firmware setting that makes their hardware work less well and didn't think about Linux at all.

pbhjpbhj 10y ago
Well really you need to say "didn't think users would install any operating system ever" to fit with the information here. Pre-installed Win10 being the only option doesn't seem to fit with the idea that Lenovo would want to sell more PCs. I guess switching modes, a la progressive enhancement, is impossible with disk access then??
seba_dos1 10y ago
Removed the option from BIOS menu? Okay, stupid and annoying, but well, there's always EFI shell where you can edit variables by yourself... Writing a piece of code that resets that one particular variable on each boot? Sorry, but that's just nasty. There is no reason to do that if the goal is just to provide best experience on supported OS. Although I agree that it's unlikely this was targetted specifically against GNU/Linux and other OSes. The most important thing would be that Windows 7, 8 and older won't boot anymore.
- Whitestrake 10y ago
  > There is no reason to do that if the goal is just to provide best experience on supported OS. I don't believe it's accurate to say there's "no real reason", it seems like enforcing this behaviour is very much aligned with the goal you've posited. This is under the assumption that this was indeed done for the purpose of ensuring Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes.
  - seba_dos1 10y ago
    There is no real reason to write code that goes out of its way to prevent you from switching into AHCI mode even if you know what you're doing (like in EFI shell). Hiding the option from BIOS menu is absolutely enough to "ensure Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes". It would be annoying, but workaroundable. There is no real reason for anything more, aside of being able to get months of complains about not releasing a one line fix allowing your customers to use your hardware.
    - rlpb 10y ago
      > Hiding the option from BIOS menu is absolutely enough to "ensure Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes". It absolutely is not enough, because I can come up with a single contrary case. If this change was made in a BIOS update, simply hiding the option would leave some users stuck in the "wrong" setting forever. So one might write some code to flip it back at the same time. This is the simplest way of fixing the problem. It doesn't need any assumption of maliciousness or incompetence. It's just unfortunate for Linux users, since they clearly didn't get any consideration when this fix was written, that's all.
      - seba_dos1 10y ago
        The change wasn't made in BIOS update, only newer physical models had this change applied and they shipped right away being blocked. Aside of that, this couldn't even be a change made in BIOS update, because every OS installed earlier, including preinstalled Windows, would stop booting without being provided with Intel driver.
farcical_tinpot 10y ago
> Or, alternatively, they removed a firmware setting that makes their hardware work less well Why would they remove it? Removing it requires effort, which hardware companies are loath to do. Leave the system in its actual supported state and change the default. Easy. There's only so many ways you can slip and slide on this Matthew ;-).
- hdra 10y ago
  Hardware that works better = better sales, more money, less support cost? There's only so many ways you can slip and slide on this ;-).
  - farcical_tinpot 10y ago
    > Hardware that works better = better sales, more money, less support cost? Utter bullshit. The hardware doesn't work better - it works in the same way that AHCI systems with a single disk have done in the past. This is not going to increase sales, as is obvious to anyone with half an ounce of sense, it won't make more money as a result and it will be lovely to see their support when people clone disks and realise the on-disk RAID format isn't compatible ;-). But you know, slip and slide ;-).
vidarh 10y ago
There a lots of settings in a typical BIOS menu that will make a system misbehave or outright not boot. If they were so concerned, they could have added a warning.
Esau 10y ago
I suspect this is the real answer. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it turns out that they only tested Windows internally.

by mjg59 10y ago

pbhjpbhj 10y ago

Well really you need to say "didn't think users would install any operating system ever" to fit with the information here. Pre-installed Win10 being the only option doesn't seem to fit with the idea that Lenovo would want to sell more PCs. I guess switching modes, a la progressive enhancement, is impossible with disk access then??

seba_dos1 10y ago

Removed the option from BIOS menu? Okay, stupid and annoying, but well, there's always EFI shell where you can edit variables by yourself... Writing a piece of code that resets that one particular variable on each boot? Sorry, but that's just nasty. There is no reason to do that if the goal is just to provide best experience on supported OS. Although I agree that it's unlikely this was targetted specifically against GNU/Linux and other OSes. The most important thing would be that Windows 7, 8 and older won't boot anymore.

Whitestrake 10y ago
> There is no reason to do that if the goal is just to provide best experience on supported OS. I don't believe it's accurate to say there's "no real reason", it seems like enforcing this behaviour is very much aligned with the goal you've posited. This is under the assumption that this was indeed done for the purpose of ensuring Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes.
- seba_dos1 10y ago
  There is no real reason to write code that goes out of its way to prevent you from switching into AHCI mode even if you know what you're doing (like in EFI shell). Hiding the option from BIOS menu is absolutely enough to "ensure Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes". It would be annoying, but workaroundable. There is no real reason for anything more, aside of being able to get months of complains about not releasing a one line fix allowing your customers to use your hardware.
  - rlpb 10y ago
    > Hiding the option from BIOS menu is absolutely enough to "ensure Intel specific drivers are used for power management purposes". It absolutely is not enough, because I can come up with a single contrary case. If this change was made in a BIOS update, simply hiding the option would leave some users stuck in the "wrong" setting forever. So one might write some code to flip it back at the same time. This is the simplest way of fixing the problem. It doesn't need any assumption of maliciousness or incompetence. It's just unfortunate for Linux users, since they clearly didn't get any consideration when this fix was written, that's all.
    - seba_dos1 10y ago
      The change wasn't made in BIOS update, only newer physical models had this change applied and they shipped right away being blocked. Aside of that, this couldn't even be a change made in BIOS update, because every OS installed earlier, including preinstalled Windows, would stop booting without being provided with Intel driver.

farcical_tinpot 10y ago

> Or, alternatively, they removed a firmware setting that makes their hardware work less well Why would they remove it? Removing it requires effort, which hardware companies are loath to do. Leave the system in its actual supported state and change the default. Easy. There's only so many ways you can slip and slide on this Matthew ;-).

hdra 10y ago
Hardware that works better = better sales, more money, less support cost? There's only so many ways you can slip and slide on this ;-).
- farcical_tinpot 10y ago
  > Hardware that works better = better sales, more money, less support cost? Utter bullshit. The hardware doesn't work better - it works in the same way that AHCI systems with a single disk have done in the past. This is not going to increase sales, as is obvious to anyone with half an ounce of sense, it won't make more money as a result and it will be lovely to see their support when people clone disks and realise the on-disk RAID format isn't compatible ;-). But you know, slip and slide ;-).

vidarh 10y ago

There a lots of settings in a typical BIOS menu that will make a system misbehave or outright not boot. If they were so concerned, they could have added a warning.

Esau 10y ago

I suspect this is the real answer. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it turns out that they only tested Windows internally.