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They've had them in Google News for ages. I've been using them for a while, work great (I'm on Android). So well in fact even though I am on the 0.1% of the pop

by oneloop 10y ago

They've had them in Google News for ages. I've been using them for a while, work great (I'm on Android). So well in fact even though I am on the 0.1% of the population that's consciously aware of their tactics, they have already trained me to subconsciously prefer clicking on websites that have their AMP logo, compared to the rest, because I subconsciously know they load much faster.

MBCook 10y ago
When I first saw it (in the 'News' section of results) I was happy to see it. After clicking 2 or 3 of the links I quickly learned to avoid it and either go to another site or find the non-AMP link in the results below. I really wish sites (AMP isn't the only thing to do this) would stop deciding they know how to implement scrolling better than my browser/OS does it. Here's a hint: YOU DON'T. Let the user have what they're used to. Sudden behavior changes for tenuous-at-best benefits ("It scrolls faster!") are obnoxious.
- Mister_Snuggles 10y ago
  It would be so nice if there was a knob to disable whatever JavaScript API (or part thereof) enables this yet keep everything else. Of course, it would have to work seamlessly without breaking anything, so it might be asking a little much.
  - oxguy3 10y ago
    Unfortunately, blocking that API (listening for 'wheel' events) will entirely break large portions of many sites -- any element where they've manually implemented the scrollbar or have fancy stuff or whatever won't work. I tried writing a Greasemonkey script that killed smooth scrolling, but it broke way too many sites. One thing that does work though, at least in a lot of cases, is using an adblocker to block the URLs of common smooth scroll scripts. My adblock filter rules are in a comment in this gist if you want them (actually, this gist is my aforementioned Greasemonkey script): https://gist.github.com/oxguy3/ebd9fe692518c7f7a1e9 https://gist.github.com/oxguy3/ebd9fe692518c7f7a1e9
- cramforce 10y ago
  AMP doesn't implement scrolling in software. It is native GPU accelerated scrolling. iOS does have 2 modes and it might be that AMP hits the one some people don't like. Edit: Filed https://github.com/ampproject/amphtml/issues/5125 https://github.com/ampproject/amphtml/issues/5125 to see if AMP can switch to other GPU scrolling mode.
  - Touche 10y ago
    Why does AMP do anything with scrolling at all?
    - JohnDotAwesome 10y ago
      Knowing where the viewport is relative to the document is pretty valuable; It means that AMP can defer loading potentially sluggish content until the viewport lands on a particular position.
      - Touche 10y ago
        Sounds like a premature optimization to me. The websites I tried did not have such requirements but the scrolling was just as janky nonetheless.
        stonogo 10y ago
        It's not premature optimization. It's optimization for ad revenue; they can charge more if they can prove an advertisement is visible on screen.
      - deleted 10y ago
        [deleted]
    - cramforce 10y ago
      This is just CSS which exists for unrelated reasons.
    - idlewords 10y ago
- bsimpson 10y ago
  Wow, you've complained about scrolling in a lot of different threads on this page.
  - CaptSpify 10y ago
    so? That just means he's right multiple times
tedmiston 10y ago
They do not work as well on iOS. Two examples of this are "scroll to top" by tapping the title bar is completely broken under AMP. The other is that Safari Reader is mostly broken under AMP. That said, the experience with super fast, virtually instant loads, is great, and I think these are definitely kinks that can be worked out. I'm just confused why they made it through to consumer release without someone else questioning them. These are major features of the most popular browser on [one of the two] most popular mobile OS that Google is choosing to break. Edit: Added "[one of the two]"
- spot 10y ago
  " the most popular mobile OS " iOS at 23% and falling... http://bgr.com/2016/06/02/apples-mobile-market-share-sees-big-drop-in-may-as-android-skyrockets/ http://bgr.com/2016/06/02/apples-mobile-market-share-sees-bi...
  - tedmiston 10y ago
    I just edited it to say one of the two most popular to avoid going there. I don't think it changes my point.
    - oneloop 10y ago
      Doesn't it? I think it straight up answers your question.
      - tedmiston 10y ago
        The point I was trying to make was that iOS, and Safari on iOS, has a massive, massive user base. Throwing #1 vs #2 into the mix is distracting from that point.
  - npunt 10y ago
    A cursory look at those stats should tell you they're bogus. Going from 32% to 23% market share (about a 30% decline) in two months is not even remotely likely.

by oneloop 10y ago

MBCook 10y ago

When I first saw it (in the 'News' section of results) I was happy to see it. After clicking 2 or 3 of the links I quickly learned to avoid it and either go to another site or find the non-AMP link in the results below. I really wish sites (AMP isn't the only thing to do this) would stop deciding they know how to implement scrolling better than my browser/OS does it. Here's a hint: YOU DON'T. Let the user have what they're used to. Sudden behavior changes for tenuous-at-best benefits ("It scrolls faster!") are obnoxious.

Mister_Snuggles 10y ago
It would be so nice if there was a knob to disable whatever JavaScript API (or part thereof) enables this yet keep everything else. Of course, it would have to work seamlessly without breaking anything, so it might be asking a little much.
- oxguy3 10y ago
  Unfortunately, blocking that API (listening for 'wheel' events) will entirely break large portions of many sites -- any element where they've manually implemented the scrollbar or have fancy stuff or whatever won't work. I tried writing a Greasemonkey script that killed smooth scrolling, but it broke way too many sites. One thing that does work though, at least in a lot of cases, is using an adblocker to block the URLs of common smooth scroll scripts. My adblock filter rules are in a comment in this gist if you want them (actually, this gist is my aforementioned Greasemonkey script): https://gist.github.com/oxguy3/ebd9fe692518c7f7a1e9 https://gist.github.com/oxguy3/ebd9fe692518c7f7a1e9
cramforce 10y ago
AMP doesn't implement scrolling in software. It is native GPU accelerated scrolling. iOS does have 2 modes and it might be that AMP hits the one some people don't like. Edit: Filed https://github.com/ampproject/amphtml/issues/5125 https://github.com/ampproject/amphtml/issues/5125 to see if AMP can switch to other GPU scrolling mode.
- Touche 10y ago
  Why does AMP do anything with scrolling at all?
  - JohnDotAwesome 10y ago
    Knowing where the viewport is relative to the document is pretty valuable; It means that AMP can defer loading potentially sluggish content until the viewport lands on a particular position.
    - Touche 10y ago
      Sounds like a premature optimization to me. The websites I tried did not have such requirements but the scrolling was just as janky nonetheless.
      - stonogo 10y ago
        It's not premature optimization. It's optimization for ad revenue; they can charge more if they can prove an advertisement is visible on screen.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
  - cramforce 10y ago
    This is just CSS which exists for unrelated reasons.
  - idlewords 10y ago
bsimpson 10y ago
Wow, you've complained about scrolling in a lot of different threads on this page.
- CaptSpify 10y ago
  so? That just means he's right multiple times

tedmiston 10y ago

They do not work as well on iOS. Two examples of this are "scroll to top" by tapping the title bar is completely broken under AMP. The other is that Safari Reader is mostly broken under AMP. That said, the experience with super fast, virtually instant loads, is great, and I think these are definitely kinks that can be worked out. I'm just confused why they made it through to consumer release without someone else questioning them. These are major features of the most popular browser on [one of the two] most popular mobile OS that Google is choosing to break. Edit: Added "[one of the two]"

spot 10y ago
" the most popular mobile OS " iOS at 23% and falling... http://bgr.com/2016/06/02/apples-mobile-market-share-sees-big-drop-in-may-as-android-skyrockets/ http://bgr.com/2016/06/02/apples-mobile-market-share-sees-bi...
- tedmiston 10y ago
  I just edited it to say one of the two most popular to avoid going there. I don't think it changes my point.
  - oneloop 10y ago
    Doesn't it? I think it straight up answers your question.
    - tedmiston 10y ago
      The point I was trying to make was that iOS, and Safari on iOS, has a massive, massive user base. Throwing #1 vs #2 into the mix is distracting from that point.
- npunt 10y ago
  A cursory look at those stats should tell you they're bogus. Going from 32% to 23% market share (about a 30% decline) in two months is not even remotely likely.