5 ms·

Yeah, the whole has thing become a sham. "Not for profit" except for the CEO making 400k a year, while everyone else gets minimum wage or volunteers and asks f

by theklub 10y ago

Yeah, the whole has thing become a sham. "Not for profit" except for the CEO making 400k a year, while everyone else gets minimum wage or volunteers and asks for donations to make ends meet.

lintiness 10y ago
the same people who gripe about these organizations praise the public and non-profit university / school system --- rife with the same exact compensation abuse.
- drabiega 10y ago
  Yeah, and we don't like it when it happens there either.
- GrinningFool 10y ago
  > the same people who gripe about these organizations praise the public and non-profit university / school system They do? All of them or just some? I feel like it's more likely that the same people would have issues with the university abuse too.
wnevets 10y ago
If the organization is large enough why shouldn't the CEO make that much? Just because its a non-profit doesn't mean the large organization is any easier to manage.
- douche 10y ago
  Is the tail wagging the dog, though? Seeing so many charities, with lofty, worthwhile goals (at least as indicated by their names...) that spend upwards of three-quarters of their donations on overhead, administration, and fundraising, makes you wonder.
  - sliverstorm 10y ago
    That's really the key that pisses people off I think, nobody will worry much about high six figure executive compensation if the administration overhead is a tiny portion of revenue. Kidney & Urology Foundation of America is a great example: Total Overhead: 91.9% Management & General Expenses: 38.8% Fundraising Expenses: 53.1% CEO Compensation: $132,642 (31.7% of revenue)
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
    > Seeing so many charities, with lofty, worthwhile goals (at least as indicated by their names...) that spend upwards of three-quarters of their donations on overhead, administration, and fundraising, makes you wonder. While some of those extreme cases may be problematic, I think that there is a risk of putting too much weight on administrative cost ratio (with low ratios being "good") as a metric. Its easy to reduce administrative costs by simply not putting effort into making sure that the way funds are spent is effective at achieving the nominal goals of the organization, but I don't think anyone who thinks things through would think that makes a charity "better". You need better metrics to answer questions of charity quality.
    - throwaway729 10y ago
      Spending time on hiring, code quality analyses (code reviews, performance reviews, etc), refactoring, developer training are all examples of administrative overhead. Software shops that don't invest in any of these things end up producing crap. Software shops that over-invest in these things end up navel gazing instead of getting shit done. The line between reasonable and unreasonable will shift from context to context and from organization to organization. There's no silver bullet or magic metric. Ditto for charities. Running a survey that costs more than your actual charity work in order to determine if some strategy is working might be a complete waste of resources. But it might also make a lot of sense. E.g., before dumping 10x the initial investment into that strategy, or before convincing 5 other large charitable organizations to double down on the new strategy. But sometimes it's the tail wagging the dog and/or a failure of leadership. It's impossible to tell from dollar amounts alone.
- zardo 10y ago
  To ask people to give to a cause, while you seek to increase your fortune, is dishonest. I do not feel compelled to donate to charities run by hypocrites.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > If the organization is large enough why shouldn't the CEO make that much? If the a non-profit organization is the size and complexity of the US government, than a salary equal to the salary of the Chief Executive of the US government is quite appropriate, sure.
- maxxxxx 10y ago
  If you look at the Red Cross you have a lot of volunteers working for free so I would expect management to also make less. Seems being CEO of a non-profit gives you a good image because you are "giving back" while still making good money.

by theklub 10y ago

Yeah, the whole has thing become a sham. "Not for profit" except for the CEO making 400k a year, while everyone else gets minimum wage or volunteers and asks for donations to make ends meet.

lintiness 10y ago

the same people who gripe about these organizations praise the public and non-profit university / school system --- rife with the same exact compensation abuse.

drabiega 10y ago
Yeah, and we don't like it when it happens there either.
GrinningFool 10y ago
> the same people who gripe about these organizations praise the public and non-profit university / school system They do? All of them or just some? I feel like it's more likely that the same people would have issues with the university abuse too.

wnevets 10y ago

If the organization is large enough why shouldn't the CEO make that much? Just because its a non-profit doesn't mean the large organization is any easier to manage.

douche 10y ago
Is the tail wagging the dog, though? Seeing so many charities, with lofty, worthwhile goals (at least as indicated by their names...) that spend upwards of three-quarters of their donations on overhead, administration, and fundraising, makes you wonder.
- sliverstorm 10y ago
  That's really the key that pisses people off I think, nobody will worry much about high six figure executive compensation if the administration overhead is a tiny portion of revenue. Kidney & Urology Foundation of America is a great example: Total Overhead: 91.9% Management & General Expenses: 38.8% Fundraising Expenses: 53.1% CEO Compensation: $132,642 (31.7% of revenue)
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > Seeing so many charities, with lofty, worthwhile goals (at least as indicated by their names...) that spend upwards of three-quarters of their donations on overhead, administration, and fundraising, makes you wonder. While some of those extreme cases may be problematic, I think that there is a risk of putting too much weight on administrative cost ratio (with low ratios being "good") as a metric. Its easy to reduce administrative costs by simply not putting effort into making sure that the way funds are spent is effective at achieving the nominal goals of the organization, but I don't think anyone who thinks things through would think that makes a charity "better". You need better metrics to answer questions of charity quality.
  - throwaway729 10y ago
    Spending time on hiring, code quality analyses (code reviews, performance reviews, etc), refactoring, developer training are all examples of administrative overhead. Software shops that don't invest in any of these things end up producing crap. Software shops that over-invest in these things end up navel gazing instead of getting shit done. The line between reasonable and unreasonable will shift from context to context and from organization to organization. There's no silver bullet or magic metric. Ditto for charities. Running a survey that costs more than your actual charity work in order to determine if some strategy is working might be a complete waste of resources. But it might also make a lot of sense. E.g., before dumping 10x the initial investment into that strategy, or before convincing 5 other large charitable organizations to double down on the new strategy. But sometimes it's the tail wagging the dog and/or a failure of leadership. It's impossible to tell from dollar amounts alone.
zardo 10y ago
To ask people to give to a cause, while you seek to increase your fortune, is dishonest. I do not feel compelled to donate to charities run by hypocrites.
dragonwriter 10y ago
> If the organization is large enough why shouldn't the CEO make that much? If the a non-profit organization is the size and complexity of the US government, than a salary equal to the salary of the Chief Executive of the US government is quite appropriate, sure.
maxxxxx 10y ago
If you look at the Red Cross you have a lot of volunteers working for free so I would expect management to also make less. Seems being CEO of a non-profit gives you a good image because you are "giving back" while still making good money.