4 ms·

Honest question here: Why tech community is so hard with Windows mandatory updates, and kind of flexible with other companies? Maybe its just me, but the ratio

Honest question here: Why tech community is so hard with Windows mandatory updates, and kind of flexible with other companies? Maybe its just me, but the ratio of posts and articles blaming Microsoft for this practice seems to be disproportional. I mean, my Mac asked me 875 times about accepting something about iTunes. No matter how many times i click on decline, it keeps appearing there all the time. Same thing with Chrome: It got silently updated (just figured it with last update that brought Material Design to the interface). If avoiding updates to a system is kind of a user right, then it would be fair to have an option to stop updates in cloud based systems as well (IE: My email service).

mitm2mitm 10y ago
IMO it does not matter what other people are doing. I'm paying for this software so I want control (over my own hardware). Mobile is a lost cause but I literally can't afford to fight my desktop OS. It must work and be reliable. Maybe I would accept forced security updates if they allowed live updates. Having to restart your computer is awful. But that's not even the worse problem. It reset settings, install things you removed, services you don't want, remove features you had before for no reason. Not to mention drivers and all the update problems people are reporting. If there's a chance to break, I must be able to choose when I want to upgrade. I'm willing to pay more for not having to worry about telemetry, MS account and all that bs.
- kminehart 10y ago
  Right? That's something about Windows that I hate; having to restart for an update. Microsoft, with it's endless supply of money, is somehow completely incapable of live OS updates? Hell, Linux has live updates; I don't even have to restart to update my kernel! I would expect Microsoft to somehow take this existing technology, cater it to their system and call it a brand new feature like they did with the resizable command prompt. "Look at this revolutionary thing we're doing in Windows 10!" Obviously I'm generalizing or assuming that they would be able to do it; I know nothing of how Windows works. It could be impossible without completely rewriting the entire thing. It's just my ultimate pet peeve about Windows.
  - xorblurb 10y ago
    Windows can't even do live updates of its userspace, so don't even start to dream about the kernel...
  - supernovae 10y ago
    Restarting a modern windows PC these days just takes a few seconds, its not a big problem. Updating my mac still requires restarts and hell, even ubuntu requires reboots. Not everyone ksplices their system and even ksplice warns you a reboot is the best option. If you think the resizable window is all they did with windows10, you're sorely mistaken :) Windows is moving to a shared kernel (minwin) that works on servers, pcs, desktops, phones, consoles and hololens. If you write an app for UWP it can be installed on all of these devices and has interfaces to operate natively on them. UWP is sandboxed too so its more secure than Win32. MS is moving to a quick release cadence where the patches aren't just bug fixes, but they're actually pumping out feature after feature and fixing bugs / requests submitted through the insider program. They're adding / fixing html issues in edge, plugins for edge, increasing features to UWP apis, adding support for devices/cpus, streamlining gaming support. It takes my surface pro 4 about 3 seconds to go from off to logged in using my face. Each update has improved the experience from what was "Cool" but barely worked to now just working all the time and now supporting biometric authentication for web apps and other features - because they have updated and patched the OS to integrate such. anywho.. i love computers.. i run windows, i'm typing this on my macbook and i'm playking pokemon on my iphone and my day job is running thousands of centos and ubuntu workstations. tired of this misguided rage and jumping to assumptions. we as a community should be better than this.
    - Senji 10y ago
      Nice shilling. Nobody uses language like >"MS is moving to a quick release cadence where the patches aren't just bug fixes, but they're actually pumping out feature after feature and fixing bugs"
      - supernovae 10y ago
        Since when did actually knowing what you're talking about become shilling? MS has moved to a release cadence that pushes out new features annually in major updates (anniversary updates) - and on patch tuesdays for other updates. These other updates can include new drivers, new firmwares, fixes to windows runtime, new windows runtime apis (they're always adding to the bluetooth stack so on and so forth), updates to browser, updates to store, updates to services/tooling. They've been working on docker support, built in linux support (ubuntu bash is awesome), they have been optimizing how store apps are packages/compiled/distributed/updated.. if shilling means calling you out as an ignorant hater, i'll happily shill away.
ColinDabritz 10y ago
Your Mac updates are indefinitely truly avoidable despite the constant nagging. You declined 875 times, and you can decline 875 times more, and forever after that. Windows 10, in home edition, only lets you delay a limited time. There is a finite amount of possible total time before windows will no longer operate without applying the update. It will apply the updates on restart, or forcibly restart your computer to apply them. This is not the case on any other OS that I am aware of. You are correct that Chrome applies updates when it is restarted, which is similar, but subtly different behavior. Chrome does not destroy my running context to forcibly restart. I've had the "red" about tag indicating critically out of date for a few weeks on a laptop, with no issues. http://www.howtogeek.com/219166/you-won%E2%80%99t-be-able-to-disable-or-delay-windows-updates-on-windows-10-home/ http://www.howtogeek.com/219166/you-won%E2%80%99t-be-able-to...
- hendersoon 10y ago
  Yes; also Chrome is a browser not an operating system. (I know, ChromeOS. That's not what I meant!)
CommanderData 10y ago
I think comparing OS updates to something like browser updates isn't really fair. My Mac does the same but I still have control. More control than Windows 10's new reality.
CaptSpify 10y ago
I have no idea, but your right. This outrages me on any platform. I don't allow my phone to auto-update, not any of my PCs, nor any of my apps. If they did, I'd stop using that product.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
winteriscoming 10y ago
I think it is a combination of both the reputation that Microsoft has in tech community and also the fact that unlike other softwares you noted, Windows OS is used by a lot of people, even those who don't like using it (you'll see lot of posts where people have installed it for their family members because those family members find it easier to use it)

mitm2mitm 10y ago

IMO it does not matter what other people are doing. I'm paying for this software so I want control (over my own hardware). Mobile is a lost cause but I literally can't afford to fight my desktop OS. It must work and be reliable. Maybe I would accept forced security updates if they allowed live updates. Having to restart your computer is awful. But that's not even the worse problem. It reset settings, install things you removed, services you don't want, remove features you had before for no reason. Not to mention drivers and all the update problems people are reporting. If there's a chance to break, I must be able to choose when I want to upgrade. I'm willing to pay more for not having to worry about telemetry, MS account and all that bs.

kminehart 10y ago
Right? That's something about Windows that I hate; having to restart for an update. Microsoft, with it's endless supply of money, is somehow completely incapable of live OS updates? Hell, Linux has live updates; I don't even have to restart to update my kernel! I would expect Microsoft to somehow take this existing technology, cater it to their system and call it a brand new feature like they did with the resizable command prompt. "Look at this revolutionary thing we're doing in Windows 10!" Obviously I'm generalizing or assuming that they would be able to do it; I know nothing of how Windows works. It could be impossible without completely rewriting the entire thing. It's just my ultimate pet peeve about Windows.
- xorblurb 10y ago
  Windows can't even do live updates of its userspace, so don't even start to dream about the kernel...
- supernovae 10y ago
  Restarting a modern windows PC these days just takes a few seconds, its not a big problem. Updating my mac still requires restarts and hell, even ubuntu requires reboots. Not everyone ksplices their system and even ksplice warns you a reboot is the best option. If you think the resizable window is all they did with windows10, you're sorely mistaken :) Windows is moving to a shared kernel (minwin) that works on servers, pcs, desktops, phones, consoles and hololens. If you write an app for UWP it can be installed on all of these devices and has interfaces to operate natively on them. UWP is sandboxed too so its more secure than Win32. MS is moving to a quick release cadence where the patches aren't just bug fixes, but they're actually pumping out feature after feature and fixing bugs / requests submitted through the insider program. They're adding / fixing html issues in edge, plugins for edge, increasing features to UWP apis, adding support for devices/cpus, streamlining gaming support. It takes my surface pro 4 about 3 seconds to go from off to logged in using my face. Each update has improved the experience from what was "Cool" but barely worked to now just working all the time and now supporting biometric authentication for web apps and other features - because they have updated and patched the OS to integrate such. anywho.. i love computers.. i run windows, i'm typing this on my macbook and i'm playking pokemon on my iphone and my day job is running thousands of centos and ubuntu workstations. tired of this misguided rage and jumping to assumptions. we as a community should be better than this.
  - Senji 10y ago
    Nice shilling. Nobody uses language like >"MS is moving to a quick release cadence where the patches aren't just bug fixes, but they're actually pumping out feature after feature and fixing bugs"
    - supernovae 10y ago
      Since when did actually knowing what you're talking about become shilling? MS has moved to a release cadence that pushes out new features annually in major updates (anniversary updates) - and on patch tuesdays for other updates. These other updates can include new drivers, new firmwares, fixes to windows runtime, new windows runtime apis (they're always adding to the bluetooth stack so on and so forth), updates to browser, updates to store, updates to services/tooling. They've been working on docker support, built in linux support (ubuntu bash is awesome), they have been optimizing how store apps are packages/compiled/distributed/updated.. if shilling means calling you out as an ignorant hater, i'll happily shill away.

ColinDabritz 10y ago

Your Mac updates are indefinitely truly avoidable despite the constant nagging. You declined 875 times, and you can decline 875 times more, and forever after that. Windows 10, in home edition, only lets you delay a limited time. There is a finite amount of possible total time before windows will no longer operate without applying the update. It will apply the updates on restart, or forcibly restart your computer to apply them. This is not the case on any other OS that I am aware of. You are correct that Chrome applies updates when it is restarted, which is similar, but subtly different behavior. Chrome does not destroy my running context to forcibly restart. I've had the "red" about tag indicating critically out of date for a few weeks on a laptop, with no issues. http://www.howtogeek.com/219166/you-won%E2%80%99t-be-able-to-disable-or-delay-windows-updates-on-windows-10-home/ http://www.howtogeek.com/219166/you-won%E2%80%99t-be-able-to...

hendersoon 10y ago
Yes; also Chrome is a browser not an operating system. (I know, ChromeOS. That's not what I meant!)

CommanderData 10y ago

I think comparing OS updates to something like browser updates isn't really fair. My Mac does the same but I still have control. More control than Windows 10's new reality.

CaptSpify 10y ago

I have no idea, but your right. This outrages me on any platform. I don't allow my phone to auto-update, not any of my PCs, nor any of my apps. If they did, I'd stop using that product.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

winteriscoming 10y ago

I think it is a combination of both the reputation that Microsoft has in tech community and also the fact that unlike other softwares you noted, Windows OS is used by a lot of people, even those who don't like using it (you'll see lot of posts where people have installed it for their family members because those family members find it easier to use it)