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There is an entire industry dedicated to making you feel inadequate and unhappy: advertising. We are bombarded with messages telling us we are not good enough a
by karma_vaccum123 10y ago
There is an entire industry dedicated to making you feel inadequate and unhappy: advertising. We are bombarded with messages telling us we are not good enough as we are, but certain products and services can make it so.
Don't worry though, it will all be better once you sit down with your Bay Area Mercedes Benz dealer to talk about financing options on the fantastic new S series featuring blah blah blah.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- Domenic_S 10y agoRight. To put a finer point on it, the insidious part is that advertising teaches us not what to want, but how to want. It doesn't say "a Mercedes makes you worth something", it says "only the things you buy can [make you valuable|entertain you|satisfy you|make life worth living]", which ingrains certain behaviors. It's like the Dark Side version of the "...teach them to long for the endless immensity of the sea" quote. Edit: and it really goes even deeper than that, teaching us that being constantly entertained or totally satisfied is the state of being everyone else is in (so why aren't you?) --> only buying things can get you there --> here, buy this.
- aianus 10y agoUntil it becomes socially acceptable to bring a tax return and 401k statement on a first date, nice clothes and a nice car are going to remain the only way to demonstrate success to a stranger.
- bsou 10y agothere is also the possibility of talking to them about their life
- aianus 10y agoThe guy with the suit, house, and car is doing that too.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- coldtea 10y agoSo? If they're that shallow to prefer the fancier suit and car over the more appropriate soul mate, let them fucking have them...
- wyager 10y agoAccusing someone of being "shallow" because they have evolutionarily sensible sexual preferences is incredibly puerile. Any evolutionarily rational person would place substantial value on a partner who can provide for themselves and their offspring.
- coldtea 10y ago>Accusing someone of being "shallow" because they have evolutionarily sensible sexual preferences is incredibly puerile. Being shallow is exactly that: being "evolutionarily sensible". Unlike animals, that can be only (or mostly) "evolutionarily sensible", we have critical and self-critical faculties, and can see beyond what's "evolutionarily sensible". And of course, billions of people don't give a rats arse about whether the person they'll fall in love with has a fast car and a fancy suit, or the body type that signals "I'll have plenty of milk for our offspring". >Any evolutionarily rational person would place substantial value on a partner who can provide for themselves and their offspring. If they see the world as some kind of jungle where what matters is a partner who can "provide for themselves and their offspring" then they're not just shallow, but also regressive.
- wyager 10y agoYou are allowed to have more than one factor in your preferences. > And of course, billions of people don't give a rats arse about whether the person they'll fall in love with has ... the body type that signals "I'll have plenty of milk for our offspring". Which billions of people? Females? Yeah, they're typically not looking for milk production in a mate. On the other hand, breasts are a huge component of male attraction in most cultures. As for fancy cars, it's not the car itself; it's what it signifies. (Although personally, I would place substantial value on a mate driving fast cars! I love driving.) In what way is it "regressive" to seek a mate who can provide for one's children?
- randomgyatwork 10y agoIf you care to prove you are 'successful'
- brightsize 10y agoAnd if you think that having money == "success".
- onetwotree 10y agoYou're really missing the point.
- snerbles 10y agoConvincing him otherwise is like telling a snowflake not to join in on an avalanche.
- onetwotree 10y agoSadly you're probably right. But you can always hope to have planted a seed.
- mod 10y agoYou've really pinpointed your definition of success there. It's not the same as mine.
- bunderbunder 10y agoA couple thoughts there. First, not everyone defines success in such material terms. If you don't, you probably also aren't interested in attracting a mate who does. Second, in a society as laden in consumer debt as the USA in the early 21st century, the nature of the correlation between financial wellbeing and ownership of nice things is far from certain. To put it in its most basic terms, the $40k someone spent on their BMW is, by definition, money they didn't stick in their 401k.
- aianus 10y agoHaving money is a pretty good heuristic for a lot of positive traits that women generally look for in a mate. It's pretty damn hard to buy a new luxury car with below-average intelligence, social skills, discipline, determination, etc. And unfortunately unless you're a doctor, lawyer, or CEO, 'having nice things' is the only socially appropriate way to signal that. I don't like it, but it works really well and sexual selection is what sells luxury cars in general, not advertising. Not to mention, 'compatible value systems' are not necessary to bring a girl home after a first date and have some fun...
- dragontamer 10y ago> It's pretty damn hard to buy a new luxury car with below-average intelligence, social skills, discipline, determination, etc. Yeah. That's why they lease those cars. ------------ Its rather easy today to borrow money and get things that are completely unsustainable. Nothing against people who actually like leasing cars (some people MUST have a new car every 2 years, so its cheaper to lease than to buy). But a huge number of people who are leasing cars simply can't afford the car. So instead, they go for a "low cost monthly plan" that doesn't build any wealth at all.
- aianus 10y agoHaving $500/mo in free cash flow for the lease payment already shows that you're richer than the majority of twenty-something males. It's just a heuristic, of course, but it does establish a bare minimum of financial success.
- karma_vaccum123 10y agoIf that is what it takes for you to demonstrate attractiveness to a prospective mate...maybe you should hit the gym more. "I liked her because she liked me because of my car" said no one ever?
- sliverstorm 10y agoThe idea isn't that you have a nice car and that makes you attractive. It just gets simplified to that for caricature. The idea is, no matter who you are as a person, the version of you that is healthy, fit, and clearly never has to worry about money, is one of the more attractive versions of you. She's not a gold digger, she just wants to be with someone who is financially secure.
- freshhawk 10y agoEven "she wants to be with someone who is financially secure" seems to get taken the wrong way. One relationship has more fun/fulfilling lifestyle options available and the other has fewer. This applies to anyone regardless of gender, although a lot of people have hangups about traditional roles and money.
- jazzyk 10y agoThe context here is "first date". There are far more important things to think about on first date such as "Do I like this guy?", not how expensive his car is.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- wyager 10y agoRight, it makes a lot more sense to judge people on their adherence to a particular muscular profile than on their wealth. Fitness is an indicator of physical health and ability to defend from predators and fancy cars and clothes are indicators of mental/social prowess and ability to garner resources. They're both valid, if imperfect, criteria by which to judge someone for reproductive fitness.
- freshhawk 10y agoBut once you see this for what it is, that changes things doesn't it? It certainly does for your personal life where you are going to feel less inclined to impress people who are impressed in this way. Of course sometimes you want to impress people who don't see this anyway, most obviously the job interview or the business meeting. Well in that case: it's incredibly easy to fake these signals, especially when you see them for what they are. But you still went to tax return/401K, so defining success as owning a lot of the medium of exchange. Not that you have exchanged it for the correct things or gotten them some other way. So you got past viewing nice clothes and cars as and end in themselves but not past viewing money as an end in itself. There is another step you can take, another narrative that has been built to motivate you to act in another group's interest you can abandon.
- jazzyk 10y agoI made it a point to use public transportation and not drive a car when dating my (now) wife, at least for the first several dates. I wanted to make sure she liked me for what I am, not my possessions (owning a car at my age was quite rare back then). Luckily, she turned out to not care and life has been good :-)
- nostrademons 10y agoMy wife's told me that if I'd showed up in a BMW she probably would've cut the date short. (I walked to the Caltrain station and we Caltrained up together.) Dating's a way to get a read on someone's value system and find someone who shares your values. It's a mistake to think that everyone shares mainstream American cultural values, even in America. There are plenty of people who don't buy into consumerism or advertising messages.
- taurath 10y agoIts funny that nowadays the idea that you live in a place where you can walk to a caltrain station makes you more likely to be a millionaire than driving a BMW 7 series.
- coldtea 10y agoFor one, who said success is "nice clothes and a nice car"? And why "demonstrate success" on a date? What is the other person supposed to be? Whore/Gigolo?
- wyager 10y agoNice clothes and a nice car indicate financial wellbeing, which is a desirable characteristic in a mate. Why demonstrate success on a date? What do you think the purpose of a date is? It's a courtship ritual where you try to demonstrate your reproductive value to a potential mate. There are many components to this; appearance, wealth, personality, etc. I think you have this mixed up; a prostitute is precisely the person you don't need to indicate your value to. You just pay them.
- jazzyk 10y ago>you try to demonstrate your reproductive value to a potential mate Gosh, you are quite the romantic, aren't you... ;-)
- coldtea 10y ago>What do you think the purpose of a date is? I thought it was to get to know the person, build a relationship and maybe bed them (if you're too horny). But now I've learned its purpose is to show your bling and evolutionary advantages to send the right primitive signals to the other hardly developed monkey-human. >I think you have this mixed up; a prostitute is precisely the person you don't need to indicate your value to. You just pay them. The distance between a whore and a golddigger is not that wide.
- wyager 10y agoThe things in your first paragraph are, for the most part, euphemisms for "evaluate the person's reproductive fitness". What do you think "getting to know someone" entails? You literally mention sex in the same sentence; this is the fundamental evolutionary (not teleological) purpose of courtship, regardless of how you dress it up.
- wolfpwner 10y agoDid you try www.edmunds.com/price-promise.html?
- bunderbunder 10y agoThis book is worth a read: https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/high-price-materialism https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/high-price-materialism Tim Kasser, The High Price of Materialism It discusses studies on how materialistic desires relate to one's emotional well-being (all correlative, as I recall), and then goes from there into a thoughtful analysis of how materialism alters a person's priorities in a variety not-so-healthy ways. I found it to be a pretty good reality check.
- nimbix 10y agoWhat you said has been repeated so many times everyone just accepts it as true. But if you look at the new age hippies, they're playing the same game, but having a better car is replaced by having a nicer 30 yr old van, or nicer dreadlocks, or being more spiritual, etc. People will always want to be better than other people; having that S class you mentioned is just one of the methods of achieving that. Advertising is just one of many sources which feed you ideas on how to demonstrate your higher value over fellow human beings.
- ErikAugust 10y agoOh, so perhaps you have been to Boulder, Colorado? http://stayoutofmynamastespace.com/ http://stayoutofmynamastespace.com/
- omginternets 10y agoHalf of these are people missing sarcasm and attempts at humor. The other half are downright terrifying...
- ErikAugust 10y ago"Stay out of my Namaste space" is totally frightening.
- omginternets 10y ago> There are two types of people, ones who like avocados, and ones that are wrong. This isn't frightening. It's funny (because it's true). > I would rather have the aspartame that causes cancer than the sugar that causes diabetes. This, on the other hand, is frightening.
- ErikAugust 10y agoYeah, exactly. Some are actually just funny. Some are crazy.
- retro64 10y agoWhen I find that I am falling into the trap of emotional highs from buying crap I don't need, I just remind myself that I grew up with only the essentials and I don’t need more toys. If we (my siblings and I) wanted anything, we made due with homemade cardboard props (for the USS Enterprise (NCC-1701)), sticks for swords, or paper men for armies. It sounds embarrassingly crude, but it has served as an internal equalizer when I feel like desiring or whining. I have tried to demonstrate to my kids that contentment (happiness) is really best obtained and empowering when you realize you don’t need to buy it, you can just make or generate it yourself.
- jazzyk 10y agoNothing crude about it. My kids usually had more fun with the boxes that the toys came in than the actual toys!
- bbradley406 10y agoA toy typically has a few ways to play associated with it. A cardboard box, on the other hand, now that's where the creative fun begins! If anyone needs a primer, I suggest starting with the existing literature, namely Calvin and Hobbes. http://www.gocomics.com/calvinandhobbes/2012/05/28 http://www.gocomics.com/calvinandhobbes/2012/05/28 https://riteshjsr.wordpress.com/2010/05/22/recurring-motifs-in-calvin-hobbes-the-cardboard-box-2/ https://riteshjsr.wordpress.com/2010/05/22/recurring-motifs-...
- hammock 10y agoYou chose a funny example because car commercials are as much speaking to recent car buyers as they are to car shoppers. Half of what they're intended to do is reduce "buyer's remorse," to make owners feel good and want to buy the same make again. Source: I do this for a living
- freshhawk 10y agoAlso, those re-targeting ads for that thing you have already bought? Following you around the internet. Those aren't because of a mistake in the targeting criteria like a lot of people think. You will be so pleased with a purchase that has no buyer's remorse, which you accept as normal, that you will go buy some more stuff from that store. Clearly it is a special rare deal you have discovered.
- DominikR 10y agoIn the article the following solution is given: > The problem is that detachment – solitude, quietly taking responsibility for your own actions – is inimical to modern life ... Top comment here: > It is the fault of advertising!! I'd say that is the polar opposite of taking responsibility for your own actions.
- technobabble 10y agoWe don't live in a vacuum. Our lives are still dictated by things we need, such as food, shelter, fulfilling relationships, and meaningful activities. Some people fine actual enjoyment in cars, so they do genuinely become happy when they purchase that new S Series. The bigger issue is that media tries to say that they know what we want better than ourselves, so we should listen to the car dealer/parent/professor/etc.
- 6stringmerc 10y agoPoint well received. I think there's some kind of correlative regarding even bringing such an attitude into one's home...as in, the Echo. Yes it serves many purposes but I think it's germane to point out the origin and, ahem, probably preferred use in a consumer context.