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Again, though, it doesn't need to be the best idea, it just needs ONE civilization somewhere in the galaxy to have done it ONCE. We can't be the only species wi

by mrec 10y ago

Again, though, it doesn't need to be the best idea, it just needs ONE civilization somewhere in the galaxy to have done it ONCE. We can't be the only species with a tendency to derp on occasion.

p_zakharov 10y ago
Not a bad objection then. Of course it depends on probabilities and assumptions we have no real way of assessing.
joe_the_user 10y ago
But present day human civilization on earth would in fact be entirely invisible to a human-level civilization even one star over. To be surprised that radio transmission is not ubiquitous, you have to say that "louder" civilization should evolve but we so-far have no real proof such civilization are possible at all, since we are not at such a level - and indeed the idea that civilizations would take this trajectory is entirely hypothetical.
- p_zakharov 10y ago
  "But present day human civilization on earth would in fact be entirely invisible to a human-level civilization even one star over." Really? I find that surprising. On a related note: http://www.lightyear.fm/ http://www.lightyear.fm/
  - joe_the_user 10y ago
    Radio energy dissipates by square of the distance to a location - essentially as a transmission expands, the same amount of energy is spread evenly around a sphere of increasing area. Area of a sphere centered at the sun and encompassing the nearest star is vast.
    - p_zakharov 10y ago
      Oh yeah, true that, I thought the signal would be faint several light years out for omnidirectional signals, like FM radio and TV, I just didn't think it would be undetectable. I mean I assume that Contact was pretty scientifically tenable and that had aliens sending back transmissions of Adolf Hitler on television and that was over a much greater distance, but I'm willing to change this belief. This, BTW, is why I am strongly in favor of optical SETI.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - goodcanadian 10y ago
    I'm too lazy to google a source right now, but actually, yes, we could detect Earth out to a few tens of lightyears. Not far in the scale of things, and the only thing we'd really be able to detect are the most powerful radars, but it is theoretically possible to detect ourselves at nearby stars.

by mrec 10y ago

Again, though, it doesn't need to be the best idea, it just needs ONE civilization somewhere in the galaxy to have done it ONCE. We can't be the only species with a tendency to derp on occasion.

p_zakharov 10y ago

Not a bad objection then. Of course it depends on probabilities and assumptions we have no real way of assessing.

joe_the_user 10y ago

But present day human civilization on earth would in fact be entirely invisible to a human-level civilization even one star over. To be surprised that radio transmission is not ubiquitous, you have to say that "louder" civilization should evolve but we so-far have no real proof such civilization are possible at all, since we are not at such a level - and indeed the idea that civilizations would take this trajectory is entirely hypothetical.

p_zakharov 10y ago
"But present day human civilization on earth would in fact be entirely invisible to a human-level civilization even one star over." Really? I find that surprising. On a related note: http://www.lightyear.fm/ http://www.lightyear.fm/
- joe_the_user 10y ago
  Radio energy dissipates by square of the distance to a location - essentially as a transmission expands, the same amount of energy is spread evenly around a sphere of increasing area. Area of a sphere centered at the sun and encompassing the nearest star is vast.
  - p_zakharov 10y ago
    Oh yeah, true that, I thought the signal would be faint several light years out for omnidirectional signals, like FM radio and TV, I just didn't think it would be undetectable. I mean I assume that Contact was pretty scientifically tenable and that had aliens sending back transmissions of Adolf Hitler on television and that was over a much greater distance, but I'm willing to change this belief. This, BTW, is why I am strongly in favor of optical SETI.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- goodcanadian 10y ago
  I'm too lazy to google a source right now, but actually, yes, we could detect Earth out to a few tens of lightyears. Not far in the scale of things, and the only thing we'd really be able to detect are the most powerful radars, but it is theoretically possible to detect ourselves at nearby stars.