4 ms·

That's actually not _that_ bad, if true. Depending on how generous the pension is, that might actually be quite low. I was expecting the tax rate to be much hig

That's actually not _that_ bad, if true. Depending on how generous the pension is, that might actually be quite low. I was expecting the tax rate to be much higher.

e12e 10y ago
Much higher? Most of Europe has income tax in this range (generally lower on the lower end of the earning scale) AFAIK. Eg. I'm currently paying around 30% income tax in Norway (but that'll probably ease up towards 40% as I move into a more reasonable income bracket - and one needs to remember 25% VAT here - I'm guessing it amounts to another 5%-10% points added on top of the income tax). This includes free health care, free education from primary school through college, subsidized pre-school etc. Even in states like Texas, AFAIK one doesn't typically come out much ahead in terms of taxes in the US - and in general get very little in return.
kybernetyk 10y ago
That's only the direct tax on income. Don't forget VAT, high petrol taxes, high electricity taxes. I'd say your total tax rate is somewhere around 70% if you take all that into account. Also the pensions aren't something to write home about really. (There's already politicians starting to talk that everyone should get a standard pension - no matter how much they paid into the system. Give it a few decades and we might arrive there).
- rubber_duck 10y ago
  This - if you're 20s or early 30s the chances you'll get to use the pension are slim to none, considering how the pension funds are structured, current state of work force/pension system and future trends, etc. there's going to be huge restructuring down the road and the chances of you getting out proportional to what you paid in are ~0 if you're above average income. You would do much better to invest that money either in your education/career/life standard or doing proper investing.
- MagnumOpus 10y ago
  > Also the pensions aren't something to write home about really State pensions are around 50% of your work income. Even if that is only €50k per year in the end, that would be equivalent to the annuity from a €1 million private pension pot. And it is backed not by a company which will go bankrupt twice over in the next forty years, but the taxation powers of the German government, which is famously good at balancing its books. TLDR: The pensions are better than most anywhere in the world - though you also pay the price for it.
  - kybernetyk 10y ago
    Yes, now they are planned to be 50%. But in 30 or 40 years? I'd rather put the money in a private saving plan than to hand it over to the government for a vague promise of "no worry, we'll pay you somehow back".

That's actually not _that_ bad, if true. Depending on how generous the pension is, that might actually be quite low. I was expecting the tax rate to be much higher.

e12e 10y ago

Much higher? Most of Europe has income tax in this range (generally lower on the lower end of the earning scale) AFAIK. Eg. I'm currently paying around 30% income tax in Norway (but that'll probably ease up towards 40% as I move into a more reasonable income bracket - and one needs to remember 25% VAT here - I'm guessing it amounts to another 5%-10% points added on top of the income tax). This includes free health care, free education from primary school through college, subsidized pre-school etc. Even in states like Texas, AFAIK one doesn't typically come out much ahead in terms of taxes in the US - and in general get very little in return.

kybernetyk 10y ago

That's only the direct tax on income. Don't forget VAT, high petrol taxes, high electricity taxes. I'd say your total tax rate is somewhere around 70% if you take all that into account. Also the pensions aren't something to write home about really. (There's already politicians starting to talk that everyone should get a standard pension - no matter how much they paid into the system. Give it a few decades and we might arrive there).

rubber_duck 10y ago
This - if you're 20s or early 30s the chances you'll get to use the pension are slim to none, considering how the pension funds are structured, current state of work force/pension system and future trends, etc. there's going to be huge restructuring down the road and the chances of you getting out proportional to what you paid in are ~0 if you're above average income. You would do much better to invest that money either in your education/career/life standard or doing proper investing.
MagnumOpus 10y ago
> Also the pensions aren't something to write home about really State pensions are around 50% of your work income. Even if that is only €50k per year in the end, that would be equivalent to the annuity from a €1 million private pension pot. And it is backed not by a company which will go bankrupt twice over in the next forty years, but the taxation powers of the German government, which is famously good at balancing its books. TLDR: The pensions are better than most anywhere in the world - though you also pay the price for it.
- kybernetyk 10y ago
  Yes, now they are planned to be 50%. But in 30 or 40 years? I'd rather put the money in a private saving plan than to hand it over to the government for a vague promise of "no worry, we'll pay you somehow back".