15 ms·

I wrote this on a previously buried thread: Naming their system "autopilot" goes beyond the marketing dept overstepping and into the territory of irresponsibil

• ethanbond 10y ago
  I'd like to see a survey of how many Tesla drivers think Tesla advocates complete cession of control to Autopilot. My suspicion is zero.
  • yladiz 10y ago
    It doesn't matter what they advocate for, it matters the perception of the technology. Just because Tesla doesn't explicitly say that it's a perfect system and says that the driver has to be aware at all times doesn't mean that actually happens, and with a lenient time frame without hands on the wheel it's not surprising that drivers would essentially give control to the car.
    • ethanbond 10y ago
      What I'm saying is I don't think it has anything to do with calling it autopilot, and even less to do with it not meeting the technical definition of autopilot. People are using it in this way because they're able to, and they'll continue to do so until they're not able to. I think we agree here actually. The name isn't the problem really the issue.
      • kirrent 10y ago
        I couldn't agree more. Autopilots of any kind have always required supervision. Tesla doesn't call its car self driving and there are many warnings that it isn't. Ultimately, the system would be called Boris and people would still use it irresponsibly.
  • messick 10y ago
    Based on the times I've seen people staring down at their phones on the 280, it's definitely much higher than 0.
  • Twisell 10y ago
    Well sadly the first casualties was a man that made 3 millions view on YouTube with a video called "Autopilot saves Model S" months before his fatal accident... http://youtu.be/9I5rraWJq6E http://youtu.be/9I5rraWJq6E At that time I don't recall that Tesla made any statement about how dangerous it was to deliberately push the limit of the system to entertains viewers. This might have contributed to make him overconfident about autopilot. RIP
    • studentrob 10y ago
      > At that time I don't recall that Tesla made any statement about how dangerous it was to deliberately push the limit of the system to entertains viewers. Yeah who knows. I think Musk retweeted his video. Hindsight is 20/20. Tesla can still move forward and learn from this.
      • Scarblac 10y ago
        That's going to hurt in the lawsuit, isn't it?
        • studentrob 10y ago
          I'm not a lawyer, so, I don't know
• lucb1e 10y ago
  > They should change the name to "driver assist" or something more accurate given that mis-interpreting the system's function can lead to death of the driver or others. While I definitely agree on the name change, it should be accompanied by a feature change. In its current mode, and especially if people know it has been renamed, the same stuff will happen. When you take your hands off the wheel, it turn on warning lights, break increasingly hard (depending on what it detects behind it) and sound loud warnings in the car. If it's truly an assistive feature where you can't be inattentive, the only scenario in which you stop steering is when you fell asleep.
  • heurist 10y ago
    That's what it does - it alerts drivers, and when their hands are off for some amount of time the car will pull off to the shoulder and stop until your hands are back on the wheel (IIRC).
    • lucb1e 10y ago
      Ah okay, I don't own a Tesla and this wasn't covered in news articles. In that case, it sounds like it might actually work more or less as it should. It's just a bit useless in its current form.
    • studentrob 10y ago
      What's the interval between when you take your hands off and it decides to pull over? From what I've seen in discussions and videos, it's pretty long. Other car manufacturers seem to only allow a few seconds.
      • cpncrunch 10y ago
        The article seems to imply that the warning is given if driving conditions become "uncertain" and the driver's hands are off the wheel. Perhaps the time interval between warning and the car automatically stopping should be lower. What's the point of the car continuing on autopilot if it's uncertain of where it's headed?
• Chathamization 10y ago
  Is it even useful if it's merely assisting the driver, though? I haven't used it, but actively steering a car while someone else is also actively steering it sounds pretty terrible. If you're not actively steering it but just waiting to take over if things go poorly, things also seem like they'd be difficult. Other than getting in an accident, how is a person supposed to know when autopilot is doing it's thing correctly, and when it isn't?
  • the_mitsuhiko 10y ago
    > but actively steering a car while someone else is also actively steering it sounds pretty terrible. My passat has most assist systems and I like how it steers. It tries very hard to get my attention and get my hands back on the steering wheel. It barely lets me keep my hands 15 seconds of the wheel but this is perfect for what it's designed to do: keep you in the lane if you are being distracted by something (eg: baby). Even more it has various modes to get your attention back including detecting tiredness and inability to hold the steering wheel on the lane.
    • jacquesm 10y ago
      > keep you in the lane if you are being distracted by something (eg: baby). If you can't drive responsibly with a baby on board lane assist isn't going to save your ass. If something happens to your baby which distracts you ask someone else in the car to take care of it, if there is nobody to help pull over at the earliest opportunity. Lane assist will not save you from anything else but lane departure and there are a lot of other things that can go wrong while you allow yourself to be distracted because you rely on lane assist to keep you safe. That's not the intended use of this feature.
      • newjersey 10y ago
        I can't imagine the gymnastics involved in this feat either. A baby doesn't belong on the front seat without some modifications to the car as far as I know. I absolutely agree. There is absolutely no excuse for the driver to take their eyes off the road to assist a baby in the car. How would you assist a baby in the back seat while driving with a seat belt on anyway? As I read about people using these features, I'm convinced they shouldn't exist. Yes, crazies will apply eyeliner while going sixty on a highway but I doubt driver assist is an adequate solution for such stupidity should a driver poke themselves in the eye.
• iabacu 10y ago
  Given how many deaths happen due to car accidents, one would think that any car feature that decreases safety should be considered a bug (UX bugs included). The sad thing is that Tesla has been repeatedly blaming the driver, instead of improving its technology in an openly earnest manner -- an approach that eventually made air travel the safest. With so many sensors, car travel can eventually become safer than air travel in the future. If Tesla attitude improves, that future will arrive faster.
  • tenebrity 10y ago
    Of course they're going to blame the driver. Admitting anything else tends to lead to class action lawsuits. They're a business, not a lifestyle.
  • alogray 10y ago
    Has this feature decreased safety? Tesla's first fatality came after 130 million autopilot miles whereas traditions in the US, we have one fatality every 90 million miles. If that continues to hold, this seems to be significantly safer with it's own set of caveats. Not altogether different than getting stuck in a burning car due to your seatbelt.
    • iabacu 10y ago
      That's 90 million miles among all cars. I'd wager that if you compare it with cars at Tesla price point -- mostly luxury cars -- Tesla would look pretty bad.
      • Gustomaximus 10y ago
        Really? Bringing guesses to a fact game. We can do better.
      • slavik81 10y ago
        Why do you think the accident rate is lower among luxury cars as compared to more common vehicles? I would suspect the opposite. My hypothesis is that the people who seek out and buy cars that go 0 to 60 in 3.2 seconds probably drive faster and more aggressively than average. They therefore are more likely to have an accident.
• staunch 10y ago
  If it's a good enough name for airplanes, it's a good enough names for cars. Both require users to be ready to take control at any moment.
  • foota 10y ago
    Yes but one has a much higher barrier to entry.
  • witty_username 10y ago
    Pilots (require certification and extensive training) are different from car drivers.
    • wvenable 10y ago
      Flying a plane is more difficult, therefore requires more training. But driving a car requires licensing (certification) and training.
      • cmurf 10y ago
        Meaningful training is not required to get a driver's license in the U.S. In most states it is completely adequate for a parent to teach you to drive, with no minimum number of hours in a classroom, public or private. Pilots also receive ongoing currency training. This doesn't exist for automobile drivers. Maybe some states require a written test every few years? But in the three states I've lived in, no written, oral, or in-car test it recurrency training required since the original was issued when I was 15 or whenever.
      • darpa_escapee 10y ago
        I had to pass a 20 question multiple choice test, drive at 15mph on a short course and parallel park to get my license at 17 years old. That was my only certification process. Unless laws change, I will never have to go through a training or certification process again in my life. Comparing pilot certification to that of a driver's is disingenuous.
• Retra 10y ago
  Do you have any evidence at all that any accidents have been caused by misinterpreting the functions name? Do you think if it were called something different these accident wouldn't have happened? I see little reason seriously to believe that.
• slaunchwise 10y ago
  This. It's like they want marketing credit for the engineering feat of creating 'autopilot' while maintaining the narrow legal position that the system isn't actually automatic or a pilot.
• kirkbauer 10y ago
  I can see how the name could be misleading to some people. However, I think the term is quite accurate. In an aircraft, Autopilot takes care of the basics of flying the plane while the pilot is fully responsible for what is happening, watching out for traffic, and ready to take over if necessary. This is exactly what it means for Tesla as well. In any case, as somebody who has used it off and on for 6 months in all kinds of situations it is clear that it has limitations but it is also easy to know when to be worried. Its best use is in stop-and-go freeway traffic. Its worse use is on smaller curvy surface streets. It is also really nice for distance driving on freeways.