20 ms·

Edward Snowden’s Strangely Free Life as a Robot

228 points by robbiet480 10y ago

awesomerobot 10y ago
Couldn't the government punish the people who are facilitating this? In their eyes this would be akin to carrying around a camera for a Russian spy, no?
pavel_lishin 10y ago
We have a robot similar to this at work. It's broken right now - maybe the battery is dead, maybe there's a software issue - and nobody's particularly interested in fixing it, because it never worked too well. For one, on our model, there's zero peripheral vision. This makes it really hard to orient yourself in space - how far away is that wall? Did I scoot far enough past that doorway to swivel 90° to the right and go through it? Am I about to hit someone? The same problem occurs when you're trying to talk to people. You can really only see two people who are standing in front of you. I'm not even sure if there's stereo sound - as there appears to be on the Snowbot, since he swivels towards people who are addressing him. Other minor difficulties: * it was difficult to park it into its charging station, which meant that sometimes it would just go comatose in a hallway. * there's still a fair amount of lag, which makes it slightly annoying to have a conversation. Dialing someone over Skype/Hipchat/whatever-video is almost always the better option. * sometimes you'd remote in, and be in an unfamiliar location because the robot wasn't returned to its parking spot. Since the whole point is to be able to access remote locations, we typically weren't familiar with the office layout, and would have to wander around aimlessly trying to get someone to help us get to where we needed to go.
- riprowan 10y ago
  The camera on the bot should switch to wide-angle / fisheye view when it moves, then switch to a regular lens for faces when it's still / just rotating in position. The wide angle / fisheye view would provide a more typical FPS-like frame of reference, while the 20-35mm view makes faces appear realistic.
  - basch 10y ago
    that was my first thought as well. the main problem seems like something a tiny piece of curved glass could solve. If it could get almost 180 degree FOV, you could pan in software on the client end.
- j2bax 10y ago
  All of these issues sound like they should be fairly easy to resolve with the tech. The unit should have an internal map of the company and know where each employees desk is, you shouldn't have to manually drive it around an unknown office, thats just crazy! I'm sure the fact that it doesn't is a result of it still being in the novelty phase, but I would think the industry might get serious about this technology as teams become more and more distributed. Anything that simulates the effect of presence is going to be very valuable and detrimental to the communication of the future distributed workforce. I think VR/AR will ultimately take over this space, but these roving camera/screen's might be a good interim solution.
- blakeyrat 10y ago
  I've worked for 2 smallish tech companies that had robots like these sitting in corners collecting dust because they invariably turned out to be not very useful.
- monksy 10y ago
  > Skype/Hipchat/whatever-video Don't bother. Pied Piper video chat is so much better.
- mitchtbaum 10y ago
  It seems like a setup that gives remote users access to building-integrated CCTV feeds, microphones, and speakers for an intercom-like interface with a nice UI for navigating and directly connecting to a local user's devices (based on "where" they are in the space) would work much better than a "centralized" mobile machine. I would guess those whose culture already respects a presence of disembodied and remotely connected souls (transdimensional spirits, perhaps) would have an easy route to adopting this.
- ef4 10y ago
  We are on the cusp of solving the peripheral vision piece, because 360 degree camera rigs are getting cheap and popular. As soon as they can stream in realtime, you could have low-latency VR as if your head was really on top of the robot.
  - comex 10y ago
    But only rotational movement would be possible, no positional, like the DK1 / Gear VR... Not the end of the world but not pleasant either.
    - pavel_lishin 10y ago
      Given that most everyone operates telepresence robots from behind a desk, I think rotational-only would be a reasonable limitation.
    - ef4 10y ago
      There are already commercial VR camera rigs that can do translation within a sphere big enough for head motion. The camera makers want to be able to make content for use with things like Gear VR.
- comex 10y ago
  I haven't used one of these myself, but from my experience with regular video calls (and a mention in the article), a killer feature will be some way for the robot operator to maintain eye contact without having to fake it, i.e. looking at the camera instead of the screen. Googling brings up some rumors about devices with cameras hidden behind the screen, especially an Apple patent from 2009... but even if the tech doesn't pan out, I bet you could fake it pretty well in software if you have multiple cameras on different sides of the screen.
- CaptSpify 10y ago
  Can I ask what problem this solves that something like skype/hipchat/whatever doesn't solve? I guess to me it just feels like a step backwards. I'm not saying that these bots are bad, but I feel like there's a benefit that I'm not seeing.
r00fus 10y ago
Weird, I remember running into (an earlier version of) one of these devices at a club in Hermosa Beach, CA around 1997. I'm guessing that one was locally manned by someone nearby. It's possible that device did not have a videocam feed back either but that local person had LOS on the robot.
infinity0 10y ago
Tell me Mr Smith, how can you put me to prison if I don't have ... a body?
- stephengillie 10y ago
  Good point - and also like arresting Ultron - "Don't mind me, Officer. While you arrest me, I'll just be downloading myself out of this robot and into another robot across the city."
  - mietek 10y ago
    Which is, of course, entirely absurd. Why would Ultron need to be “present” in only a single robot at a time, if not for the sake of plot?
    - phasmantistes 10y ago
      Because even Ultron doesn't want to `git merge` those personalities, memories, and experiences back together.
      - infinity0 10y ago
        well played, sir.
      - Angostura 10y ago
        An idea that Iain M Banks plays around with quite a lot in some Culture books.
      - mietek 10y ago
        Think on another level of abstraction. Mere humans are already perfectly capable of operating more than one remotely-controlled drone at a time.
      - jessaustin 10y ago
        Ultron just isn't as sophisticated as e.g. Project 2501, is he?
bobsil1 10y ago
Snowden's making up to $1.25M/yr on speaking fees plus script consulting for Oliver Stone. Nice bump from gov't payscale. Though not enough to compensate for being under 24/7 FSB watch.
- linkregister 10y ago
  That's fascinating! Can you share some resources for me to learn more about the subject? I haven't seen any quotes for his speaking fees or script consulting revenues.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - jrowley 10y ago
    Well in the article linked they state the following: > He is scheduled to make more than 50 such appearances around the world this year, earning speaking fees that can reach more than $25,000 per appearance, though many speeches are pro bono.
    - belorn 10y ago
      "Earnings in a casino can reach more than $X per day". How informative is such statement? Is the $25,000 based on the maximum fee that any speaker has earned? Is it the average fee? Is it the highest fee that Snowden or someone representing him has said he have earned?
      - bobsil1 10y ago
        > In 2013, $10,000 was considered a lower limit for speakers brokered by speakers bureaus, $40,000 a regular fee for well-known authors, and famous politicians were reported to charge about $100,000 and more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_fee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_fee
        deleted 10y ago
Jerry2 10y ago
I know this question might sound silly but can FBI "arrest"/confiscate/disable the robot itself because it's aiding a fugitive? And the person/company that owns the robot, can they by charged with aiding a fugitive? IANAL but would love to hear what some more informed have to say about this. The law is constantly catching up to technology....
- galdosdi 10y ago
  IANAL either but I would naively expect the gimmickry to be irrelevant and for this to be treated no different than having a telephone call with Snowden.
- CamperBob2 10y ago
  It definitely raises interesting questions about mind-body duality. If a telepresence robot is a physical manifestation of Snowden's self, then it would seem to be fair game for the FBI to arrest it. If it isn't, then we have to ask how a sufficiently-advanced version of the robot would really differ from one's physical body. To make the question meaningful, I suppose you'd have to stipulate that the robot is somehow irreplaceable. Meaning it's the only one of its kind that's capable of representing itself as the body of Ed Snowden, and that it's the only means at his disposal for interacting with the outside world. On the other hand, it's no stretch at all to say that the company who provided the robot is liable under US law for aiding and abetting him, especially if Snowden has to use their servers to communicate with it. (Well, OK, it's a stretch, but it's a stretch that the US judicial system has had no qualms about making in the past.) Our Federal courtrooms aren't often mistaken for philosophy classrooms.
  - tlrobinson 10y ago
    I think if my robot is arrested then it's only fair for it to be allowed to serve my jail time for me...
  - jandrese 10y ago
    How are they going to waterboard a telepresence robot?
winxp5421 10y ago
Much respect toward Snowden. Sacrificed his birthright as a US citizen to bring an injustice to light.
- jsn117 10y ago
  and his only reward was international celebrity
  - Cyph0n 10y ago
    And living out the rest of his life as a fugitive in exile. Sounds like a good deal.
  - ludamad 10y ago
    This is the ideal result if we want more like him to step forward.
  - cdmckay 10y ago
    And a high chance that one day they'll lock him up and throw away the key, Chelsea Manning-style.
    - jsn117 10y ago
      never said that celebrity doesn't have a cost (a high one in this case) but there is an upside to his actions. Acknowledging so doesn't commit you to supporting one side or the other.
    - s_q_b 10y ago
      That's the problem with defecting to a country without the rule of law. You're always a bargaining chip. As soon as there is a sufficiently high value trade on the table, Putin will put him on a plane to the United States, without a moment's hesitation.
      - ska 10y ago
        What makes you believe things would be any different in a symmetric situation?
marze 10y ago
Someone should crowdfund the development of an awesome new robot for Mr Snowden's use, and those with similar needs.
jackfoxy 10y ago
We have 3 Beams at 2 offices. Everyone assumed the first one would be just a Silicon Valley start-up novelty, but they are surprisingly useful and personal for someone out of the office to have a presence. They can drive right up to your desk and it's like having a conversation with a live person.
- CaptSpify 10y ago
  I asked this elsewhere in this thread but... Can I ask what problem this solves that something like skype/hipchat/whatever doesn't solve? I guess to me it just feels like a step backwards. I'm not saying that these bots are bad, but I feel like there's a benefit that I'm not seeing.
  - jackfoxy 10y ago
    Somehow the telecom connection (when it does not go completely down) is better. The voice from the machine to the people in the office is clearer, and the beam driver seems to pick things up with the microphone better (although) I have never been on that end to experience it. It's totally at the discretion of the Beam driver get online drive over to your desk and start a conversation. Much more like having someone in the office. It also has a very personal feel talking to your colleague next to you. You have to experience it to understand. The full-scale Beam is a much nicer experience, we also have the cheaper model, which also works well.
gavinpc 10y ago
To add to the irony, "robot" comes from the Czech word "robotnik," meaning "slave." http://etymonline.com/index.php?search=robot http://etymonline.com/index.php?search=robot
- betaby 10y ago
  'Robotnik' is Russian and Polish for 'worker'. Etymologically [in Czech, Russian, Polish] it's closer to 'worker' and 'servant' than to 'slave'.
  - czechdeveloper 10y ago
    Well, the work was created by Karel Capek. In Czech language `robota` means forced labor for your lord. Robotnik is just guy performing it, it is not used in other way in Czech language.
    - betaby 10y ago
      Forced labor as work for feudal [medieval taxation] not like forced labor of slaves.
  - czechdeveloper 10y ago
    Fun fact, words 'slave' and 'Slav' comes from same word.
  - egeozcan 10y ago
    The word came from Czech, first use being from Karel Capek (checked some more sources, including the work from Sevan Nişanyan[1], an Armenian-Turkish language researcher, who would probably be unbiased in this matter). Another language with the same word used with a closer meaning does not always mean there is a connection. Etymology usually discovers connections which aren't intuitive at all. [1]: (Turkish) http://www.nisanyansozluk.com/?k=robot&x=0&y=0 http://www.nisanyansozluk.com/?k=robot&x=0&y=0
  - gavinpc 10y ago
    Yeah, actually this is how I remembered it from Webster's Third International many years ago, which I don't have anymore. Since then, I've become reliant on etymonline, which is handy, but somebody's hobby project[0]. A good reminder to trust the memory over the internet once in a while. [0] http://etymonline.com/bio.php http://etymonline.com/bio.php
strait 10y ago
Wheelie Boy is next!
spc476 10y ago
Edward Snowden as a real life Max Headroom. We live in weird times.
mtgx 10y ago
Some say he still lives in the machines.
tripzilch 10y ago
> He recently collaborated on a track with a French musician, delivering a spoken-word monologue on surveillance over an electronic beat, and recommended the title: “Exit.” A little bit off-topic, I was quite surprised when I clicked the link, to find that the unnamed "French musician" is, in fact, synthesizer legend Jean-Michel Jarre. Why not mention his name? It kind of sounds like it's some random dude on youtube, but he's right up there with Kraftwerk and not even a little obscure :) On another note, I think it's funny how many similarities this music video has with the intro-theme of TV-series "Person of Interest" :) The imagery and especially the vocal effects on Snowden's voice in the second half :)

228 points by robbiet480 10y ago

Couldn't the government punish the people who are facilitating this? In their eyes this would be akin to carrying around a camera for a Russian spy, no?

pavel_lishin 10y ago

We have a robot similar to this at work. It's broken right now - maybe the battery is dead, maybe there's a software issue - and nobody's particularly interested in fixing it, because it never worked too well. For one, on our model, there's zero peripheral vision. This makes it really hard to orient yourself in space - how far away is that wall? Did I scoot far enough past that doorway to swivel 90° to the right and go through it? Am I about to hit someone? The same problem occurs when you're trying to talk to people. You can really only see two people who are standing in front of you. I'm not even sure if there's stereo sound - as there appears to be on the Snowbot, since he swivels towards people who are addressing him. Other minor difficulties: * it was difficult to park it into its charging station, which meant that sometimes it would just go comatose in a hallway. * there's still a fair amount of lag, which makes it slightly annoying to have a conversation. Dialing someone over Skype/Hipchat/whatever-video is almost always the better option. * sometimes you'd remote in, and be in an unfamiliar location because the robot wasn't returned to its parking spot. Since the whole point is to be able to access remote locations, we typically weren't familiar with the office layout, and would have to wander around aimlessly trying to get someone to help us get to where we needed to go.

riprowan 10y ago
The camera on the bot should switch to wide-angle / fisheye view when it moves, then switch to a regular lens for faces when it's still / just rotating in position. The wide angle / fisheye view would provide a more typical FPS-like frame of reference, while the 20-35mm view makes faces appear realistic.
- basch 10y ago
  that was my first thought as well. the main problem seems like something a tiny piece of curved glass could solve. If it could get almost 180 degree FOV, you could pan in software on the client end.
j2bax 10y ago
All of these issues sound like they should be fairly easy to resolve with the tech. The unit should have an internal map of the company and know where each employees desk is, you shouldn't have to manually drive it around an unknown office, thats just crazy! I'm sure the fact that it doesn't is a result of it still being in the novelty phase, but I would think the industry might get serious about this technology as teams become more and more distributed. Anything that simulates the effect of presence is going to be very valuable and detrimental to the communication of the future distributed workforce. I think VR/AR will ultimately take over this space, but these roving camera/screen's might be a good interim solution.
blakeyrat 10y ago
I've worked for 2 smallish tech companies that had robots like these sitting in corners collecting dust because they invariably turned out to be not very useful.
monksy 10y ago
> Skype/Hipchat/whatever-video Don't bother. Pied Piper video chat is so much better.
mitchtbaum 10y ago
It seems like a setup that gives remote users access to building-integrated CCTV feeds, microphones, and speakers for an intercom-like interface with a nice UI for navigating and directly connecting to a local user's devices (based on "where" they are in the space) would work much better than a "centralized" mobile machine. I would guess those whose culture already respects a presence of disembodied and remotely connected souls (transdimensional spirits, perhaps) would have an easy route to adopting this.
ef4 10y ago
We are on the cusp of solving the peripheral vision piece, because 360 degree camera rigs are getting cheap and popular. As soon as they can stream in realtime, you could have low-latency VR as if your head was really on top of the robot.
- comex 10y ago
  But only rotational movement would be possible, no positional, like the DK1 / Gear VR... Not the end of the world but not pleasant either.
  - pavel_lishin 10y ago
    Given that most everyone operates telepresence robots from behind a desk, I think rotational-only would be a reasonable limitation.
  - ef4 10y ago
    There are already commercial VR camera rigs that can do translation within a sphere big enough for head motion. The camera makers want to be able to make content for use with things like Gear VR.
comex 10y ago
I haven't used one of these myself, but from my experience with regular video calls (and a mention in the article), a killer feature will be some way for the robot operator to maintain eye contact without having to fake it, i.e. looking at the camera instead of the screen. Googling brings up some rumors about devices with cameras hidden behind the screen, especially an Apple patent from 2009... but even if the tech doesn't pan out, I bet you could fake it pretty well in software if you have multiple cameras on different sides of the screen.
CaptSpify 10y ago
Can I ask what problem this solves that something like skype/hipchat/whatever doesn't solve? I guess to me it just feels like a step backwards. I'm not saying that these bots are bad, but I feel like there's a benefit that I'm not seeing.

r00fus 10y ago

Weird, I remember running into (an earlier version of) one of these devices at a club in Hermosa Beach, CA around 1997. I'm guessing that one was locally manned by someone nearby. It's possible that device did not have a videocam feed back either but that local person had LOS on the robot.

infinity0 10y ago

Tell me Mr Smith, how can you put me to prison if I don't have ... a body?

stephengillie 10y ago
Good point - and also like arresting Ultron - "Don't mind me, Officer. While you arrest me, I'll just be downloading myself out of this robot and into another robot across the city."
- mietek 10y ago
  Which is, of course, entirely absurd. Why would Ultron need to be “present” in only a single robot at a time, if not for the sake of plot?
  - phasmantistes 10y ago
    Because even Ultron doesn't want to `git merge` those personalities, memories, and experiences back together.
    - infinity0 10y ago
      well played, sir.
    - Angostura 10y ago
      An idea that Iain M Banks plays around with quite a lot in some Culture books.
    - mietek 10y ago
      Think on another level of abstraction. Mere humans are already perfectly capable of operating more than one remotely-controlled drone at a time.
    - jessaustin 10y ago
      Ultron just isn't as sophisticated as e.g. Project 2501, is he?

bobsil1 10y ago

Snowden's making up to $1.25M/yr on speaking fees plus script consulting for Oliver Stone. Nice bump from gov't payscale. Though not enough to compensate for being under 24/7 FSB watch.

linkregister 10y ago
That's fascinating! Can you share some resources for me to learn more about the subject? I haven't seen any quotes for his speaking fees or script consulting revenues.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- jrowley 10y ago
  Well in the article linked they state the following: > He is scheduled to make more than 50 such appearances around the world this year, earning speaking fees that can reach more than $25,000 per appearance, though many speeches are pro bono.
  - belorn 10y ago
    "Earnings in a casino can reach more than $X per day". How informative is such statement? Is the $25,000 based on the maximum fee that any speaker has earned? Is it the average fee? Is it the highest fee that Snowden or someone representing him has said he have earned?
    - bobsil1 10y ago
      > In 2013, $10,000 was considered a lower limit for speakers brokered by speakers bureaus, $40,000 a regular fee for well-known authors, and famous politicians were reported to charge about $100,000 and more. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_fee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speaking_fee
      - deleted 10y ago

Jerry2 10y ago

I know this question might sound silly but can FBI "arrest"/confiscate/disable the robot itself because it's aiding a fugitive? And the person/company that owns the robot, can they by charged with aiding a fugitive? IANAL but would love to hear what some more informed have to say about this. The law is constantly catching up to technology....

galdosdi 10y ago
IANAL either but I would naively expect the gimmickry to be irrelevant and for this to be treated no different than having a telephone call with Snowden.
CamperBob2 10y ago
It definitely raises interesting questions about mind-body duality. If a telepresence robot is a physical manifestation of Snowden's self, then it would seem to be fair game for the FBI to arrest it. If it isn't, then we have to ask how a sufficiently-advanced version of the robot would really differ from one's physical body. To make the question meaningful, I suppose you'd have to stipulate that the robot is somehow irreplaceable. Meaning it's the only one of its kind that's capable of representing itself as the body of Ed Snowden, and that it's the only means at his disposal for interacting with the outside world. On the other hand, it's no stretch at all to say that the company who provided the robot is liable under US law for aiding and abetting him, especially if Snowden has to use their servers to communicate with it. (Well, OK, it's a stretch, but it's a stretch that the US judicial system has had no qualms about making in the past.) Our Federal courtrooms aren't often mistaken for philosophy classrooms.
- tlrobinson 10y ago
  I think if my robot is arrested then it's only fair for it to be allowed to serve my jail time for me...
- jandrese 10y ago
  How are they going to waterboard a telepresence robot?

winxp5421 10y ago

Much respect toward Snowden. Sacrificed his birthright as a US citizen to bring an injustice to light.

jsn117 10y ago
and his only reward was international celebrity
- Cyph0n 10y ago
  And living out the rest of his life as a fugitive in exile. Sounds like a good deal.
- ludamad 10y ago
  This is the ideal result if we want more like him to step forward.
- cdmckay 10y ago
  And a high chance that one day they'll lock him up and throw away the key, Chelsea Manning-style.
  - jsn117 10y ago
    never said that celebrity doesn't have a cost (a high one in this case) but there is an upside to his actions. Acknowledging so doesn't commit you to supporting one side or the other.
  - s_q_b 10y ago
    That's the problem with defecting to a country without the rule of law. You're always a bargaining chip. As soon as there is a sufficiently high value trade on the table, Putin will put him on a plane to the United States, without a moment's hesitation.
    - ska 10y ago
      What makes you believe things would be any different in a symmetric situation?

marze 10y ago

Someone should crowdfund the development of an awesome new robot for Mr Snowden's use, and those with similar needs.

jackfoxy 10y ago

We have 3 Beams at 2 offices. Everyone assumed the first one would be just a Silicon Valley start-up novelty, but they are surprisingly useful and personal for someone out of the office to have a presence. They can drive right up to your desk and it's like having a conversation with a live person.

CaptSpify 10y ago
I asked this elsewhere in this thread but... Can I ask what problem this solves that something like skype/hipchat/whatever doesn't solve? I guess to me it just feels like a step backwards. I'm not saying that these bots are bad, but I feel like there's a benefit that I'm not seeing.
- jackfoxy 10y ago
  Somehow the telecom connection (when it does not go completely down) is better. The voice from the machine to the people in the office is clearer, and the beam driver seems to pick things up with the microphone better (although) I have never been on that end to experience it. It's totally at the discretion of the Beam driver get online drive over to your desk and start a conversation. Much more like having someone in the office. It also has a very personal feel talking to your colleague next to you. You have to experience it to understand. The full-scale Beam is a much nicer experience, we also have the cheaper model, which also works well.

gavinpc 10y ago

To add to the irony, "robot" comes from the Czech word "robotnik," meaning "slave." http://etymonline.com/index.php?search=robot http://etymonline.com/index.php?search=robot

betaby 10y ago
'Robotnik' is Russian and Polish for 'worker'. Etymologically [in Czech, Russian, Polish] it's closer to 'worker' and 'servant' than to 'slave'.
- czechdeveloper 10y ago
  Well, the work was created by Karel Capek. In Czech language `robota` means forced labor for your lord. Robotnik is just guy performing it, it is not used in other way in Czech language.
  - betaby 10y ago
    Forced labor as work for feudal [medieval taxation] not like forced labor of slaves.
- czechdeveloper 10y ago
  Fun fact, words 'slave' and 'Slav' comes from same word.
- egeozcan 10y ago
  The word came from Czech, first use being from Karel Capek (checked some more sources, including the work from Sevan Nişanyan[1], an Armenian-Turkish language researcher, who would probably be unbiased in this matter). Another language with the same word used with a closer meaning does not always mean there is a connection. Etymology usually discovers connections which aren't intuitive at all. [1]: (Turkish) http://www.nisanyansozluk.com/?k=robot&x=0&y=0 http://www.nisanyansozluk.com/?k=robot&x=0&y=0
- gavinpc 10y ago
  Yeah, actually this is how I remembered it from Webster's Third International many years ago, which I don't have anymore. Since then, I've become reliant on etymonline, which is handy, but somebody's hobby project[0]. A good reminder to trust the memory over the internet once in a while. [0] http://etymonline.com/bio.php http://etymonline.com/bio.php

strait 10y ago

Wheelie Boy is next!

spc476 10y ago

Edward Snowden as a real life Max Headroom. We live in weird times.

mtgx 10y ago

Some say he still lives in the machines.

tripzilch 10y ago

> He recently collaborated on a track with a French musician, delivering a spoken-word monologue on surveillance over an electronic beat, and recommended the title: “Exit.” A little bit off-topic, I was quite surprised when I clicked the link, to find that the unnamed "French musician" is, in fact, synthesizer legend Jean-Michel Jarre. Why not mention his name? It kind of sounds like it's some random dude on youtube, but he's right up there with Kraftwerk and not even a little obscure :) On another note, I think it's funny how many similarities this music video has with the intro-theme of TV-series "Person of Interest" :) The imagery and especially the vocal effects on Snowden's voice in the second half :)