9 ms·

On one hand, Garmin probably got what they wanted. Moving a whole office from San Francisco to Kansas seems like a passive aggresive way of downsizing. On the

by tbgvi 17y ago

On one hand, Garmin probably got what they wanted. Moving a whole office from San Francisco to Kansas seems like a passive aggresive way of downsizing. On the other hand, they probably weren't exactly expecting this reaction. And I have a feeling they aren't gonna like this. Well played ex-Garmin team, well played.

cookiecaper 17y ago
My hometown is Olathe, Kansas, Garmin's world headquarters. It is a really, really great town. These people are missing out on a very good opportunity. :)
- kordless 17y ago
  Yeah, your winters blow though. I should know, I lived in Oklahoma for 40 years. I'd much rather be out here with the mild weather, and computer nerds (of which I'm one).
- gridspy 17y ago
  To be separated from their friends, family and networks?
  - cookiecaper 17y ago
    More like they're missing an opportunity to make a whole new network of friends and family. If you work at Garmin, you'll meet a lot of smart people, so you'll have smart friends. Olathe is a much better place to raise children than San Francisco imo. Olathe is recognized as a pretty dope place; see http://www.olatheks.org/Council/Awards http://www.olatheks.org/Council/Awards , notably "Money Magazine ranked Olathe as America's 11th Best Place to Live noting the city's growth and major employers." I recognize that it's difficult to leave old friends and acquaintances, but it's also a great positive opportunity to make new, geographically-distributed networks. People relocate all the time. My family was brought to Kansas by a relocation from Florida and it was a very good thing for us, though of course when someone says "hey buddy why don't you come move to Kansas" it doesn't sound that attractive. Frankly, that's part of the reason it's important to go; these people have some prejudice against the place, but they haven't tried going there. It's a good place with just as many modern accouterments as any other. It's in one of the richest counties in the nation but has a pretty low cost of living. It is not the rural farm-town Kansas of lore. Obviously some people have compelling personal reasons to stay in SF, and that's fine. But it's highly unlikely that all of them have such reasons, most are probably just Kansas haters. :(
    - runT1ME 17y ago
      So someone in the software industry, if things didn't work out at Garmin, there are many other high paying software jobs in Olathe?
      - cookiecaper 17y ago
        There are a lot of software jobs in the area, yeah. Not many "hot startups", and it's not Silicon Valley, but there's a good market there imo. There are a lot of other big companies HQ'd in the area, including Sprint, which is probably most relevant to ex-Garminers what with GPS and mobile devices and all, Allied Signal, H&R Block, Hallmark, and many more. There are at least two military installations within a commuting distance. There's stuff out there and there's no need to assume the place is barren.
        mikebo 17y ago
        You had me at Sprint, but Hallmark and H&R Block really brought it home. I'm moving!
        cookiecaper 17y ago
        Heh, like I said, there's not a lot out there in the way of startups, but H&R Block, Hallmark, Cerner, and most other big companies need computers and programs too. There's a good contingent of hardware builders out there, too. It is not a tech hotspot, don't get me wrong there. But the question isn't "Does KC rival Silicon Valley for tech jobs", just "Does KC have work for me if I get laid off from Garmin". I would say yes.
        pyre 17y ago
        You say that, but you've only listed off a handful of companies. If I get laid off, I want more than a dozen companies as my only potential employers. What happens if none of those dozen companies needs someone with my skill set at the time I'm laid off?
        17y ago
- raganwald 17y ago
  I think it's entirely possible for one person to love Olathe, another to love S.F., and for both people to be right. Arguing about which town is better when the two are so dramatically different is about as productive as trying to decide whether Billie Holiday or Eric Clapton is the better musician. So go Olathe! And go S.F. And hey... If you aren't in Toronto, Canada you're missing a third great opportunity ;-)
  - davidw 17y ago
    SF: too expensive, too trendy/hipster. Olathe: where is the nearest mountain? Sorry, too flat. Toronto: too cold, too flat.
    - raganwald 17y ago
      For your reading pleasure: “Considered Harmful” Essays Considered Harmful: http://meyerweb.com/eric/comment/chech.html http://meyerweb.com/eric/comment/chech.html Three blog posts I'd love to read (and one that I wouldn't): http://weblog.raganwald.com/2007/10/three-blog-posts-id-love-to-read-and.html http://weblog.raganwald.com/2007/10/three-blog-posts-id-love...
- csuper 17y ago
  I worked in Olathe, Kansas for about eight years before moving to Portland, Oregon. I wouldn't personally move back, but I sure do miss the BBQ and significantly lower cost of living. Assuming they would have kept their SF salaries - they would have felt like they got a pretty sweet raise. On the flip side, Kansas doesn't offer anywhere near the culture or available activities. They way they choose to handle this was pretty cool though, good for them!
- joe_the_user 17y ago
  It's not so much a statement about Olathe's virtues as a statement of not wanting your life disrupted by someone else's business plan.
- Chickencha 17y ago
  I live and work in Olathe. It is a great town, no doubt, although I'm likely biased by the fact that I grew up nearby in Overland Park and have lived in this area for most of my life. Nobody on the Garmin Connect team or here on Hacker News needs to give me a reason for not wanting to relocate here. In a way, the place where you want to live is a very personal thing. Different people have different reasons for what they do and they don't need to justify their choices to me, just as I feel no need to justify my choice to them. That said, I definitely think there are people blindly saying "Kansas sucks" without having lived there or even traveled there. I sympathize with the Garmin Connect team, as I would not want my employer to try to force me to move anywhere. However, I also resent the attitude that they seem to have taken toward Kansas and the implication that no one would choose to live there. (I admit that perhaps I'm reading too far into it.) To me, it would be enough to say that Garmin asked them to move and they didn't want to.
eds 17y ago
I think it's nice of Garmin to let them use the company's property like that.
- houseabsolute 17y ago
  The one thing that gave me pause about this site is that someone might be confused between it and sites owned by Garmin, which would seem to open the team up to trade dress liability.
  - isleyaardvark 17y ago
    I don't see how that would apply. They're not offering a competing product with similar trade dress. They've also made it quite clear what the website is about ("We built Garmin Connect. We're for hire.")
- benwerd 17y ago
  Yeah; unfortunately, this seems like it might not end well.
gqwu 17y ago
This. My roommate is one of the Garmin Connect members that are leaving. There has been a lot of drama between Garmin HQ and their SF office lately. I told him to login and tell his side of the story.

by tbgvi 17y ago

cookiecaper 17y ago

My hometown is Olathe, Kansas, Garmin's world headquarters. It is a really, really great town. These people are missing out on a very good opportunity. :)

kordless 17y ago
Yeah, your winters blow though. I should know, I lived in Oklahoma for 40 years. I'd much rather be out here with the mild weather, and computer nerds (of which I'm one).
gridspy 17y ago
To be separated from their friends, family and networks?
- cookiecaper 17y ago
  More like they're missing an opportunity to make a whole new network of friends and family. If you work at Garmin, you'll meet a lot of smart people, so you'll have smart friends. Olathe is a much better place to raise children than San Francisco imo. Olathe is recognized as a pretty dope place; see http://www.olatheks.org/Council/Awards http://www.olatheks.org/Council/Awards , notably "Money Magazine ranked Olathe as America's 11th Best Place to Live noting the city's growth and major employers." I recognize that it's difficult to leave old friends and acquaintances, but it's also a great positive opportunity to make new, geographically-distributed networks. People relocate all the time. My family was brought to Kansas by a relocation from Florida and it was a very good thing for us, though of course when someone says "hey buddy why don't you come move to Kansas" it doesn't sound that attractive. Frankly, that's part of the reason it's important to go; these people have some prejudice against the place, but they haven't tried going there. It's a good place with just as many modern accouterments as any other. It's in one of the richest counties in the nation but has a pretty low cost of living. It is not the rural farm-town Kansas of lore. Obviously some people have compelling personal reasons to stay in SF, and that's fine. But it's highly unlikely that all of them have such reasons, most are probably just Kansas haters. :(
  - runT1ME 17y ago
    So someone in the software industry, if things didn't work out at Garmin, there are many other high paying software jobs in Olathe?
    - cookiecaper 17y ago
      There are a lot of software jobs in the area, yeah. Not many "hot startups", and it's not Silicon Valley, but there's a good market there imo. There are a lot of other big companies HQ'd in the area, including Sprint, which is probably most relevant to ex-Garminers what with GPS and mobile devices and all, Allied Signal, H&R Block, Hallmark, and many more. There are at least two military installations within a commuting distance. There's stuff out there and there's no need to assume the place is barren.
      - mikebo 17y ago
        You had me at Sprint, but Hallmark and H&R Block really brought it home. I'm moving!
        cookiecaper 17y ago
        Heh, like I said, there's not a lot out there in the way of startups, but H&R Block, Hallmark, Cerner, and most other big companies need computers and programs too. There's a good contingent of hardware builders out there, too. It is not a tech hotspot, don't get me wrong there. But the question isn't "Does KC rival Silicon Valley for tech jobs", just "Does KC have work for me if I get laid off from Garmin". I would say yes.
        pyre 17y ago
        You say that, but you've only listed off a handful of companies. If I get laid off, I want more than a dozen companies as my only potential employers. What happens if none of those dozen companies needs someone with my skill set at the time I'm laid off?
        17y ago
raganwald 17y ago
I think it's entirely possible for one person to love Olathe, another to love S.F., and for both people to be right. Arguing about which town is better when the two are so dramatically different is about as productive as trying to decide whether Billie Holiday or Eric Clapton is the better musician. So go Olathe! And go S.F. And hey... If you aren't in Toronto, Canada you're missing a third great opportunity ;-)
- davidw 17y ago
  SF: too expensive, too trendy/hipster. Olathe: where is the nearest mountain? Sorry, too flat. Toronto: too cold, too flat.
  - raganwald 17y ago
    For your reading pleasure: “Considered Harmful” Essays Considered Harmful: http://meyerweb.com/eric/comment/chech.html http://meyerweb.com/eric/comment/chech.html Three blog posts I'd love to read (and one that I wouldn't): http://weblog.raganwald.com/2007/10/three-blog-posts-id-love-to-read-and.html http://weblog.raganwald.com/2007/10/three-blog-posts-id-love...
csuper 17y ago
I worked in Olathe, Kansas for about eight years before moving to Portland, Oregon. I wouldn't personally move back, but I sure do miss the BBQ and significantly lower cost of living. Assuming they would have kept their SF salaries - they would have felt like they got a pretty sweet raise. On the flip side, Kansas doesn't offer anywhere near the culture or available activities. They way they choose to handle this was pretty cool though, good for them!
joe_the_user 17y ago
It's not so much a statement about Olathe's virtues as a statement of not wanting your life disrupted by someone else's business plan.
Chickencha 17y ago
I live and work in Olathe. It is a great town, no doubt, although I'm likely biased by the fact that I grew up nearby in Overland Park and have lived in this area for most of my life. Nobody on the Garmin Connect team or here on Hacker News needs to give me a reason for not wanting to relocate here. In a way, the place where you want to live is a very personal thing. Different people have different reasons for what they do and they don't need to justify their choices to me, just as I feel no need to justify my choice to them. That said, I definitely think there are people blindly saying "Kansas sucks" without having lived there or even traveled there. I sympathize with the Garmin Connect team, as I would not want my employer to try to force me to move anywhere. However, I also resent the attitude that they seem to have taken toward Kansas and the implication that no one would choose to live there. (I admit that perhaps I'm reading too far into it.) To me, it would be enough to say that Garmin asked them to move and they didn't want to.

eds 17y ago

I think it's nice of Garmin to let them use the company's property like that.

houseabsolute 17y ago
The one thing that gave me pause about this site is that someone might be confused between it and sites owned by Garmin, which would seem to open the team up to trade dress liability.
- isleyaardvark 17y ago
  I don't see how that would apply. They're not offering a competing product with similar trade dress. They've also made it quite clear what the website is about ("We built Garmin Connect. We're for hire.")
benwerd 17y ago
Yeah; unfortunately, this seems like it might not end well.

gqwu 17y ago

This. My roommate is one of the Garmin Connect members that are leaving. There has been a lot of drama between Garmin HQ and their SF office lately. I told him to login and tell his side of the story.