6 ms·

Same thing with the airline industry. People often say they'd pay more for extra few inches of leg room, but when they shop online, it's the cheapest price tha

Same thing with the airline industry. People often say they'd pay more for extra few inches of leg room, but when they shop online, it's the cheapest price that wins.

tracker1 10y ago
Speak for yourself... I almost always try to get a first class seat, unfortunately when I travel by plane, it's usually on short notice, and I'm generally stuck with whatever is available... worst yet is when the seat you select when buying your ticket isn't the one you're assigned when you checkin. First class is usually 3x the price, and yet I always look... as a fairly tall fat guy, comfort is something that I probably value more than someone who weighs in under 180# at 5'9 though.
- allemagne 10y ago
  Most consider flying first class a luxury reserved for the wealthy or those who don't fly very often. The majority of flyers could never consider a first class ticket a responsible purchase.
  - kylec 10y ago
    Usually because it's ridiculously expensive. Would I pay 20-50% more for a first class seat? Probably. Would I spend 2-3x more? No. I'm still going to be miserable, the flight is still going to take just as long, and once it's over I'll be out all that extra money.
  - jsprogrammer 10y ago
    Those who fly a lot may get frequent upgrades through an airline's loyalty program. Some programs will upgrade you automatically if there are any seats available.
- stuaxo 10y ago
  Last long distance flight I did we took economy premium, considering the amount of luggage we had, it was actually cheaper, and the leg room was very reasonable.
marssaxman 10y ago
I'd sort by legroom if the flight search engines offered that information, but it is not available: price is the only discriminator.
- x0x0 10y ago
  Exactly. Want +3in legroom? For each flight, go to a flight forum and punch in the route to figure out what plane they're flying. Google the airline and that plane to figure out how much legroom is available. Give up and just fly jetblue and/or southwest, and if they don't go, decline to travel.
  - mcbain 10y ago
    Or look up the seat/cabin details on Seat Guru.
  - WildUtah 10y ago
    Skip the forums. 1. Flightaware 2. Seatguru 3... 4. Comfortable flying (Step 3 is becoming a millionaire that flies business class.)
    - x0x0 10y ago
      thanks for the link to seatguru
  - HelloNurse 10y ago
    All airline seat selection pages I've ever seen show a map of the plane's seats, nobody needs a forum for that.
    - x0x0 10y ago
      And how much leg room do each of those seats have?
    - marssaxman 10y ago
      You have to select the airline and buy the ticket before you get that map, don't you? By then it's too late. I'm talking about the initial search process, where you decide which flight you're going to take. The only data present are the price, arrival & departure times, and the airline name.
joe_the_user 10y ago
Part of the reason that people go for the cheapest price is that all of the other variables in flight aren't really verifiable. Among a wide variety of industries, a large portion of revenues come from "upsales", pushing some impulse buys extra like insurance. Which is to say that the impulse buy extras are shitty ripoffs and consumers over time have grown to expect promises to be worthless and to only pay for things they can clearly verify. And that relates to selling cellphone with longer battery life - all the companies make unrealistic claims, how could someone feel safe giving up something that can see (like a feature or a smaller size) for something they can't see?
- ajmurmann 10y ago
  Discoverability of things like leg room is also practically zero when booking. Even if it was easier to see it, there are usually very few options anyways and they often differ hugely on other criteria like number of stops, departure time and price. I might be happy to pay fifty fiat extra for a free inch more leg room even more on a longer flight. Am I willing to have an extra stop for that out get out of bed at 4am instead of 6am or leave awkwardly in the middle of the day to arrive in the evening my vacation spot and effectively lose half a day at my vacation spot? No I think the airline market hardly ever offers real choices and many things that look like choices end up actually being the same flight sold by different carriers from the same alliance. Alliances are a huge pet peeve of mine anyways. There are certain (US based) airlines I strongly dislike and would like to avoid. However, it's almost impossible. Even if I book another carrier the flight often times end up being operated by them again. Sometimes it gets changed after I book. This is a dysfunctional market. I want Delta and United out of business and I've had the same from others. Yet we are all stuck flying them because we can't avoid it.
WildUtah 10y ago
Flyers routinely pay more for direct flights. International travelers often pay much more to avoid transiting unpleasant countries like the USA with its awful security procedures. Lots of people want to pay more for more width and recline in seats on long haul flights; no US carrier offers those but W class on foreign carriers is often their most profitable space. But few want to pay more for leg room. It's just not much of a benefit compared to the five things I mentioned (and several others like comfortable lounges at hubs -- but not apparently decent food). The airlines want to sell leg room because it's very easy to adjust.
- edanm 10y ago
  Do you have a source about international travelers avoiding the US? That sounds odd to me. Not that it's on the way to many other countries...
  - WildUtah 10y ago
    Try pricing tickets regularly between Latin America and Asia. My peer groups buys a lot of such tickets and the AeroMexico tickets that fly with a change of planes in MEX and go on to PVG and NRT with no USA transfer cost about US$500 more than tickets that change planes in LAX, SFO, DFW, and SEA. YVR is usually priced in between but sometimes Air Canada has deals. There are no other flights directly between Asia and Latin America (unless you count the EK GRU-DXB flight), though NH may be flying to MEX soon.
  - cesarb 10y ago
    I've read about it before, at https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Avoiding_travel_through_the_United_States https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Avoiding_travel_through_the_U... Basically, the problem seems to be that the USA does not have "sterile transit"; if your plane stops there in the way to somewhere else, you have to disembark and go through customs, and you need an expensive visa.
    - emp_zealoth 10y ago
      It's not the money but the abuse they can dish out at you. Even if you get a visa (which is a pain in the neck and a total time sink on it's own), customs can just tell you "You know what? Go f yourself." After you've landed...
eeeeeeeeeeeee 10y ago
It still depends on the price, though. Is the difference $10, $50, or $100? For $10 or $50 I might select more leg room, but not for $100.

Same thing with the airline industry. People often say they'd pay more for extra few inches of leg room, but when they shop online, it's the cheapest price that wins.

tracker1 10y ago

Speak for yourself... I almost always try to get a first class seat, unfortunately when I travel by plane, it's usually on short notice, and I'm generally stuck with whatever is available... worst yet is when the seat you select when buying your ticket isn't the one you're assigned when you checkin. First class is usually 3x the price, and yet I always look... as a fairly tall fat guy, comfort is something that I probably value more than someone who weighs in under 180# at 5'9 though.

allemagne 10y ago
Most consider flying first class a luxury reserved for the wealthy or those who don't fly very often. The majority of flyers could never consider a first class ticket a responsible purchase.
- kylec 10y ago
  Usually because it's ridiculously expensive. Would I pay 20-50% more for a first class seat? Probably. Would I spend 2-3x more? No. I'm still going to be miserable, the flight is still going to take just as long, and once it's over I'll be out all that extra money.
- jsprogrammer 10y ago
  Those who fly a lot may get frequent upgrades through an airline's loyalty program. Some programs will upgrade you automatically if there are any seats available.
stuaxo 10y ago
Last long distance flight I did we took economy premium, considering the amount of luggage we had, it was actually cheaper, and the leg room was very reasonable.

marssaxman 10y ago

I'd sort by legroom if the flight search engines offered that information, but it is not available: price is the only discriminator.

x0x0 10y ago
Exactly. Want +3in legroom? For each flight, go to a flight forum and punch in the route to figure out what plane they're flying. Google the airline and that plane to figure out how much legroom is available. Give up and just fly jetblue and/or southwest, and if they don't go, decline to travel.
- mcbain 10y ago
  Or look up the seat/cabin details on Seat Guru.
- WildUtah 10y ago
  Skip the forums. 1. Flightaware 2. Seatguru 3... 4. Comfortable flying (Step 3 is becoming a millionaire that flies business class.)
  - x0x0 10y ago
    thanks for the link to seatguru
- HelloNurse 10y ago
  All airline seat selection pages I've ever seen show a map of the plane's seats, nobody needs a forum for that.
  - x0x0 10y ago
    And how much leg room do each of those seats have?
  - marssaxman 10y ago
    You have to select the airline and buy the ticket before you get that map, don't you? By then it's too late. I'm talking about the initial search process, where you decide which flight you're going to take. The only data present are the price, arrival & departure times, and the airline name.

joe_the_user 10y ago

Part of the reason that people go for the cheapest price is that all of the other variables in flight aren't really verifiable. Among a wide variety of industries, a large portion of revenues come from "upsales", pushing some impulse buys extra like insurance. Which is to say that the impulse buy extras are shitty ripoffs and consumers over time have grown to expect promises to be worthless and to only pay for things they can clearly verify. And that relates to selling cellphone with longer battery life - all the companies make unrealistic claims, how could someone feel safe giving up something that can see (like a feature or a smaller size) for something they can't see?

ajmurmann 10y ago
Discoverability of things like leg room is also practically zero when booking. Even if it was easier to see it, there are usually very few options anyways and they often differ hugely on other criteria like number of stops, departure time and price. I might be happy to pay fifty fiat extra for a free inch more leg room even more on a longer flight. Am I willing to have an extra stop for that out get out of bed at 4am instead of 6am or leave awkwardly in the middle of the day to arrive in the evening my vacation spot and effectively lose half a day at my vacation spot? No I think the airline market hardly ever offers real choices and many things that look like choices end up actually being the same flight sold by different carriers from the same alliance. Alliances are a huge pet peeve of mine anyways. There are certain (US based) airlines I strongly dislike and would like to avoid. However, it's almost impossible. Even if I book another carrier the flight often times end up being operated by them again. Sometimes it gets changed after I book. This is a dysfunctional market. I want Delta and United out of business and I've had the same from others. Yet we are all stuck flying them because we can't avoid it.

WildUtah 10y ago

Flyers routinely pay more for direct flights. International travelers often pay much more to avoid transiting unpleasant countries like the USA with its awful security procedures. Lots of people want to pay more for more width and recline in seats on long haul flights; no US carrier offers those but W class on foreign carriers is often their most profitable space. But few want to pay more for leg room. It's just not much of a benefit compared to the five things I mentioned (and several others like comfortable lounges at hubs -- but not apparently decent food). The airlines want to sell leg room because it's very easy to adjust.

edanm 10y ago
Do you have a source about international travelers avoiding the US? That sounds odd to me. Not that it's on the way to many other countries...
- WildUtah 10y ago
  Try pricing tickets regularly between Latin America and Asia. My peer groups buys a lot of such tickets and the AeroMexico tickets that fly with a change of planes in MEX and go on to PVG and NRT with no USA transfer cost about US$500 more than tickets that change planes in LAX, SFO, DFW, and SEA. YVR is usually priced in between but sometimes Air Canada has deals. There are no other flights directly between Asia and Latin America (unless you count the EK GRU-DXB flight), though NH may be flying to MEX soon.
- cesarb 10y ago
  I've read about it before, at https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Avoiding_travel_through_the_United_States https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Avoiding_travel_through_the_U... Basically, the problem seems to be that the USA does not have "sterile transit"; if your plane stops there in the way to somewhere else, you have to disembark and go through customs, and you need an expensive visa.
  - emp_zealoth 10y ago
    It's not the money but the abuse they can dish out at you. Even if you get a visa (which is a pain in the neck and a total time sink on it's own), customs can just tell you "You know what? Go f yourself." After you've landed...

eeeeeeeeeeeee 10y ago

It still depends on the price, though. Is the difference $10, $50, or $100? For $10 or $50 I might select more leg room, but not for $100.