7 ms·

Vvvv – a live-programming environment for easy prototyping and development

187 points by talles 10y ago

theon144 10y ago
Also see vvvv.js, a project that mimicks VVVV but uses the web as its platform, instead of Windows :) http://www.vvvvjs.com/ http://www.vvvvjs.com/
hk__2 10y ago
Not to be confused with VVVVVV, a puzzle platform game :) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VVVVVV https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VVVVVV
- psalz 10y ago
  Or VVV https://github.com/Varying-Vagrant-Vagrants/VVV https://github.com/Varying-Vagrant-Vagrants/VVV
  - georgestephanis 10y ago
    Or VV https://github.com/bradp/vv https://github.com/bradp/vv
    - chacha102 10y ago
      Now this is just starting to get ridiculous...
      - fungos 10y ago
        No, we can go further, like: "Or v the letter".
        marxidad 10y ago
        or V the television show
        psquid 10y ago
        or V for Vendetta
        MrBra 10y ago
        Or V the sign.
    - bencollier49 10y ago
      Or VVVVV https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vi_veri_universum_vivus_vici https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vi_veri_universum_vivus_vici
Pinkertron 10y ago
Another powerful program along the same lines is touch designer https://www.derivative.ca https://www.derivative.ca It's an offshoot of Houdini. It is exceptional at working with external hardware controllers and networking.
- CyberDildonics 10y ago
  Really have to give it to touch designer, it is a fantastic piece of software that seems underrated with the current state of input devices and graphics power.
  - sdwisely 10y ago
    also worth mentioning: http://vuo.org http://vuo.org - intended as a replacement to quartz composer and cross platform later on. http://www.bigfug.com/software/fugio/ http://www.bigfug.com/software/fugio/ - cross platform and came out this week. "Fugio is an open visual programming application with support for Oculus Rift, timeline based media playback, OpenGL, OSC, MIDI, Arduino, and much more!"
barcoder 10y ago
It's a visual programming language similar to Max msp, but focused on visuals and sensors. Windows only (DX9/DX11). Free download, only pay if using commercially.
almost 10y ago
I've worked with a few people who use vvvv and written (is that the right verb when it's graphical language) a bunch of of vvvv nodes to integrate with other stuff I was writing for them. It's a a powerful system and seems to really fit the minds of some very talented and creative people. As seems to be common with graphical programming things abstraction can be a little hard unless it fits into the node-with-fixed-inputs-and-outputs mold but this isn't a huge problem for the sizes of projects I saw. The really cool thing in my opinion is the live nature, coding and runtime are the same so you can see it all running as you change thing. Fantastic for both exploratory coding and performance coding. I used it once as a front end for playing with some head tracking code I was working in in C++ and it was a fun experience, pity it's Windows only!
- catnaroek 10y ago
  > As seems to be common with graphical programming things abstraction can be a little hard unless it fits into the node-with-fixed-inputs-and-outputs mold In other words, you're trapped in a first-order box: http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5157#comment-85605 http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5157#comment-85605
  - almost 10y ago
    Yes, that's about it. Sometimes that really matters and sometimes it doesn't matter at all. It seems like a lot of the time for the sort of things people do in vvvv it's not so important. I certainly found it a limitation but it's hard to know how much that's an actual need and how much it's just me thinking in the languages I'm used to.
    - catnaroek 10y ago
      > It seems like a lot of the time for the sort of things people do in vvvv it's not so important. It's not so important until it turns out it is. Say, because the project, while initially small, has grown to a size that demands using abstraction. Or because, while the original programmer unwittingly reimplemented the same patterns over and over, the next programmer is less willing to put up with so much duplication. Every attempt to lower the craft of programming to the level of those who aren't willing to learn it has resulted has resulted in: (0) An eventual admission that this approach doesn't work, e.g., how JavaScript was originally supposed to be easy for non-programmers to learn, but eventually grew programming patterns and practices that require programming knowledge to understand and put into practice, while keeping the gotchas and rough edges that were supposed not to matter. (1) Half-assed attempts to retrofit means of abstraction into languages with too much bad legacy code, e.g., generics in Java or modules in JavaScript. (2) Yet another attempt to lower the craft of programming, this time by someone else. Loop.
kimburgess 10y ago
For people wanting to get play with visual programming, Pure Data is another beautiful, open source option. https://puredata.info/ https://puredata.info/
- MrBra 10y ago
  Among this, vvvv, Max/MSP/Jitterm, derivative.ca and other software of this kind: which one is more powerful, more performing and the more mature in terms of deployment of the final product?
  - tebjan 10y ago
    I think it depends on your skills. If you need maximum flexibility on every level (from multi screen setup to bit operations) then definitively vvvv since it's the most general.
vonklaus 10y ago
I really wanted something like scratch for api design. I can't load vvvv right niw for some reason, but i was hoping/looking for something like a cross between scratch & balsamiq to design programs. For example a crud app, you could visually design the routing, db structure auth flow ect. is vvvv like this?
- almost 10y ago
  vvvv is probably not what you're looking for. It's pretty painful (but still possible) to do standard crud things. That's understandable because that's really not what it's for.
teemwerk 10y ago
Love vvvv and use it for all my graphics nonsense. The graphics is all DX9/DX11, that might be a little bit of a turnoff for the hacker news crowd, but the ability to string together and debug shaders in real-time and just generate gobs of data for visualization and interaction is unbeatable.
whatever_dude 10y ago
Love VVVV. A purely dataflow programming language that you create "code" while it is already running. It's great for experimentation.
vvvv 10y ago
I had no idea my initials might be popular.
yahyaheee 10y ago
Looks like we crashed the site
davydka 10y ago
Someone should at least add Max/MSP/Jitter to the list. Visual programming is really fun. https://cycling74.com https://cycling74.com
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
MrNoir 10y ago
My two cents... when you know vvvv you simply don't need anything else...
000graphics 10y ago
vvvv and vvvv.js is what i work with everyday here is a showreel of some projects i did with it (little self promo but good examples for anyone interested) https://vimeo.com/160009182 https://vimeo.com/160009182 The power is that you are super quick with setting up your cpu based part of the programm and then you can focus on shaders. Currently I am developing on a 3d game engine implementation for vvvv.js with webgl. a vvvv server is procuedurally generating tons of assets and data-structures for the engine. it can compile crossplatform on mobile devices, desktop apps and in browsers of course for me vvvv -> vvvv.js developement framework and production pipeline is the most mind blowing thing i ever encountered

187 points by talles 10y ago

Also see vvvv.js, a project that mimicks VVVV but uses the web as its platform, instead of Windows :) http://www.vvvvjs.com/ http://www.vvvvjs.com/

hk__2 10y ago

Not to be confused with VVVVVV, a puzzle platform game :) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VVVVVV https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VVVVVV

psalz 10y ago
Or VVV https://github.com/Varying-Vagrant-Vagrants/VVV https://github.com/Varying-Vagrant-Vagrants/VVV
- georgestephanis 10y ago
  Or VV https://github.com/bradp/vv https://github.com/bradp/vv
  - chacha102 10y ago
    Now this is just starting to get ridiculous...
    - fungos 10y ago
      No, we can go further, like: "Or v the letter".
      - marxidad 10y ago
        or V the television show
        psquid 10y ago
        or V for Vendetta
      - MrBra 10y ago
        Or V the sign.
  - bencollier49 10y ago
    Or VVVVV https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vi_veri_universum_vivus_vici https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vi_veri_universum_vivus_vici

Pinkertron 10y ago

Another powerful program along the same lines is touch designer https://www.derivative.ca https://www.derivative.ca It's an offshoot of Houdini. It is exceptional at working with external hardware controllers and networking.

CyberDildonics 10y ago
Really have to give it to touch designer, it is a fantastic piece of software that seems underrated with the current state of input devices and graphics power.
- sdwisely 10y ago
  also worth mentioning: http://vuo.org http://vuo.org - intended as a replacement to quartz composer and cross platform later on. http://www.bigfug.com/software/fugio/ http://www.bigfug.com/software/fugio/ - cross platform and came out this week. "Fugio is an open visual programming application with support for Oculus Rift, timeline based media playback, OpenGL, OSC, MIDI, Arduino, and much more!"

barcoder 10y ago

It's a visual programming language similar to Max msp, but focused on visuals and sensors. Windows only (DX9/DX11). Free download, only pay if using commercially.

almost 10y ago

I've worked with a few people who use vvvv and written (is that the right verb when it's graphical language) a bunch of of vvvv nodes to integrate with other stuff I was writing for them. It's a a powerful system and seems to really fit the minds of some very talented and creative people. As seems to be common with graphical programming things abstraction can be a little hard unless it fits into the node-with-fixed-inputs-and-outputs mold but this isn't a huge problem for the sizes of projects I saw. The really cool thing in my opinion is the live nature, coding and runtime are the same so you can see it all running as you change thing. Fantastic for both exploratory coding and performance coding. I used it once as a front end for playing with some head tracking code I was working in in C++ and it was a fun experience, pity it's Windows only!

catnaroek 10y ago
> As seems to be common with graphical programming things abstraction can be a little hard unless it fits into the node-with-fixed-inputs-and-outputs mold In other words, you're trapped in a first-order box: http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5157#comment-85605 http://lambda-the-ultimate.org/node/5157#comment-85605
- almost 10y ago
  Yes, that's about it. Sometimes that really matters and sometimes it doesn't matter at all. It seems like a lot of the time for the sort of things people do in vvvv it's not so important. I certainly found it a limitation but it's hard to know how much that's an actual need and how much it's just me thinking in the languages I'm used to.
  - catnaroek 10y ago
    > It seems like a lot of the time for the sort of things people do in vvvv it's not so important. It's not so important until it turns out it is. Say, because the project, while initially small, has grown to a size that demands using abstraction. Or because, while the original programmer unwittingly reimplemented the same patterns over and over, the next programmer is less willing to put up with so much duplication. Every attempt to lower the craft of programming to the level of those who aren't willing to learn it has resulted has resulted in: (0) An eventual admission that this approach doesn't work, e.g., how JavaScript was originally supposed to be easy for non-programmers to learn, but eventually grew programming patterns and practices that require programming knowledge to understand and put into practice, while keeping the gotchas and rough edges that were supposed not to matter. (1) Half-assed attempts to retrofit means of abstraction into languages with too much bad legacy code, e.g., generics in Java or modules in JavaScript. (2) Yet another attempt to lower the craft of programming, this time by someone else. Loop.

kimburgess 10y ago

For people wanting to get play with visual programming, Pure Data is another beautiful, open source option. https://puredata.info/ https://puredata.info/

MrBra 10y ago
Among this, vvvv, Max/MSP/Jitterm, derivative.ca and other software of this kind: which one is more powerful, more performing and the more mature in terms of deployment of the final product?
- tebjan 10y ago
  I think it depends on your skills. If you need maximum flexibility on every level (from multi screen setup to bit operations) then definitively vvvv since it's the most general.

vonklaus 10y ago

I really wanted something like scratch for api design. I can't load vvvv right niw for some reason, but i was hoping/looking for something like a cross between scratch & balsamiq to design programs. For example a crud app, you could visually design the routing, db structure auth flow ect. is vvvv like this?

almost 10y ago
vvvv is probably not what you're looking for. It's pretty painful (but still possible) to do standard crud things. That's understandable because that's really not what it's for.

teemwerk 10y ago

Love vvvv and use it for all my graphics nonsense. The graphics is all DX9/DX11, that might be a little bit of a turnoff for the hacker news crowd, but the ability to string together and debug shaders in real-time and just generate gobs of data for visualization and interaction is unbeatable.

whatever_dude 10y ago

Love VVVV. A purely dataflow programming language that you create "code" while it is already running. It's great for experimentation.

vvvv 10y ago

I had no idea my initials might be popular.

yahyaheee 10y ago

Looks like we crashed the site

davydka 10y ago

Someone should at least add Max/MSP/Jitter to the list. Visual programming is really fun. https://cycling74.com https://cycling74.com

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

MrNoir 10y ago

My two cents... when you know vvvv you simply don't need anything else...

000graphics 10y ago

vvvv and vvvv.js is what i work with everyday here is a showreel of some projects i did with it (little self promo but good examples for anyone interested) https://vimeo.com/160009182 https://vimeo.com/160009182 The power is that you are super quick with setting up your cpu based part of the programm and then you can focus on shaders. Currently I am developing on a 3d game engine implementation for vvvv.js with webgl. a vvvv server is procuedurally generating tons of assets and data-structures for the engine. it can compile crossplatform on mobile devices, desktop apps and in browsers of course for me vvvv -> vvvv.js developement framework and production pipeline is the most mind blowing thing i ever encountered