8 ms·

Here's one of my favorite sport highlight videos. https://youtu.be/072IsGDEpTc https://youtu.be/072IsGDEpTc His speed, footwork, and power is just incredible.

danso 10y ago
Damn...whenever I watch boxing movies like Rocky, I always think the action and power look so fake compared to what you normally see when watching broadcast boxing fights. But I guess if you grew up watching videos of Ali, you'd have a higher expectation of razzle-dazzle.
- daveguy 10y ago
  I wonder if is now ingrained in boxing training to move like that -- no one notices a big difference like they did with Ali because everyone is trained to move like that. Looking back through the videos I have to think that none of the heavyweight boxers move like that today. I wonder if there will be a renaissance in boxing where you have a whole generation of boxers moving like Ali. Does anyone follow boxing? Can anyone comment on how Ali influenced the state of boxing generations later?
  - elcapitan 10y ago
    I would imagine it's something that worked at the time, because it successfully exploited the slow, static movement of his opponents, but today it's probably "priced in" as a possibility with known correct countering, so that people don't actually use it anymore. Like a rare chess opening that was once used successfully until people figured out how to deal with it later in the game.
  - unclebucknasty 10y ago
    Sadly, boxing as a sport has much declined since Ali's day, and especially in recent years. In particular, the heavyweight division has been found most acutely lacking for some time. However, you are correct that heavyweights don't and have not typically "moved like that". Even those who were relatively fast and defensively gifted (e.g. a young Tyson) didn't move as poetically. He moved like a boxer of a much lower weight class and, beyond even that, he moved like Ali. Graceful. Fluid. Quick. Rhythmic. Instinctive. Check out some of his highlights on YouTube. There are entire sequences during which he defied opponents to hit him through head/upper body movement alone. Hands are low and movement is so fast and well-timed that it seems to predict his opponent's next move. It's as if he is training his opponent to punch wherever he moves his head, and his opponent is reacting to him vs. the other way around. And, this is to say nothing of his footwork. He glided without effort and the mechansim by which he changed direction was almost imperceptible. It seemed that he was being guided on a wire versus using his legs. Back then, it was amazing to see a man his size (or any) move like that, and it would be just as much so today.
    - Double_Cast 10y ago
      At 1:21 and 1:35, Ali does this shuffle thing with his feet. How does one do that? I just tried it, and I can't imagine how I would move my feet that rapidly even with extensive training. I'm pretty lanky. Would it be easier to foot-shuffle if I had Ali's build? Or would it be even harder because of his mass. And does this maneuver have a name? It seems like he does it when he's winding up for a jab combo. To make his punches unpredictable. Am I reading his movements correctly?
      - kasey_junk 10y ago
        One thing people underestimate about boxing is how much training goes into the feet movement. Any boxer at that level can do things with their feet that is pretty baffling. Training your feet and calfs in boxing is extensive. That said one of the things that made Ali so astounding is that for a big guy he was super light on his feet. That foot shuffle doesn't have a name, and he isn't doing it for a tactical advantage. He's showing off. Nearly anyone else on the planet who tried it would have a coach in there ear ripping them a new one. But you know, the greatest of all time gets to do things others can't.
        unclebucknasty 10y ago
        Oh, I do think the shuffle had tactical advantages beyond showing off. It's demoralizing to the opponent, it serves as a distraction, and it's so unorthodox that it momentarily leaves opponents wondering what's coming next. He frequently threw (and landed) off of a shuffle, even if not to devastating effect. But, I agree that it would drive most trainers nuts for any other boxer. And, yeah, Ali's gifts and confidence made it possible for him to get away with a lot of the kind of stuff that would drive trainers crazy (including Dundee early on). For, instance, consistently carrying his hands so low violated a Golden Rule of boxing and keeping the hands up is one of the first things kids are taught about the sport. Later, he fashioned the rope a dope and other techniques to compensate for his then diminished speed. Kind of reminds me of Bruce Lee. Improvise. Create. Take what your opponent gives you.
      - unclebucknasty 10y ago
  - kasey_junk 10y ago
    Boxing is in a bit of a vicious cycle and has been for some time. During Ali's prime boxing was more popular generally. It was a mainstream sport that lots of people watched. It was also going through a golden era with regard to talent especially at the heavy weight level. There was Ali, Frazier, Foreman, Liston all fighting at the same time which of course amplified the popularity. Now boxing doesn't have any of the all time greats boxing and its less popular, meaning its unlikely to have greats start boxing again. Add in how much less acceptable head injuries are in sports, the decline of youth boxing in the USA and the rise of MMA and it is unlikely we will see boxing be anything more than it is now, an occasional big fight for a couple of top contenders and not a lot else that makes it into the general mainstream. As for moving like that, part of it is that bigger guys more generally move better than they used to so the difference isn't as pronounced but its also Ali being special.
    - BashiBazouk 10y ago
      I wonder if the drop in popularity has to do with title bouts moving to pay per view. I've never been interested enough to pay to watch but if it was on network, I probably would have...
- bjourne 10y ago
  Steroids were legal and veeery prevalent during these days. They increase athletes endurance and ability to take blows immensely. Boxers could get flash knocked down multiple times and still come back and win the fight. Fights like Ali vs Foreman and a lot of other fights considered best of the century are just impossible without steroids.
Jommi 10y ago
and even after his retirement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9OlmPyjsNU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9OlmPyjsNU
koenbok 10y ago
I like this one even better. It gets real dark through some of his setbacks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2v-izDj5n7c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2v-izDj5n7c
tempestn 10y ago
This one's good too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI
- typon 10y ago
  Can any boxing expert explain how he can be that fast? Is it a practice + muscle memory + probablistic decision or is his reaction time that good? Is he anticipating the punches or reacting to them individually?
  - louthy 10y ago
    I'm not a boxing expert, so take this with a pinch of salt. But I expect he uses the same techniques that Bruce Lee advocated in Jeet Kune Do [1], which is about looking for the tiny trigger movements of your opponent and reacting before they've even started really moving (if you look in that video, he sometimes moves out of the way of a punch that doesn't come); probably combined with selling the opponent a 'dummy' to tempt them into making a known move. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do
  - fear91 10y ago
    If you are relaxed and trained you can dodge the punches because it takes time for them to reach you. You really have to be aware of what is happening though, it's hard to learn not to flinch/close your eyes when the hand is flying to you. But if you are completely relaxed and see it coming, with good footwork and balance you can dodge many of them. You don't actually have to move your head that much, it's just the tiniest distance that will take you away from the trajectory of the punch. The thing with punches is that once you throw a punch, you can't really change its direction or it will lose most of the momentum and speed... That's why it's possible to dodge them, because they fly into particular spot and you can just move away. It's important because it lets you counter instantly. You can only really hit somebody when they are exposed, meaning not holding the guard - so when they are punching. If you were to block the punch with your hands, you couldn't react as quickly because your hands wouldn't be in the ready position. It's really good skill to have but takes years and years of practice to develop.

danso 10y ago

Damn...whenever I watch boxing movies like Rocky, I always think the action and power look so fake compared to what you normally see when watching broadcast boxing fights. But I guess if you grew up watching videos of Ali, you'd have a higher expectation of razzle-dazzle.

daveguy 10y ago
I wonder if is now ingrained in boxing training to move like that -- no one notices a big difference like they did with Ali because everyone is trained to move like that. Looking back through the videos I have to think that none of the heavyweight boxers move like that today. I wonder if there will be a renaissance in boxing where you have a whole generation of boxers moving like Ali. Does anyone follow boxing? Can anyone comment on how Ali influenced the state of boxing generations later?
- elcapitan 10y ago
  I would imagine it's something that worked at the time, because it successfully exploited the slow, static movement of his opponents, but today it's probably "priced in" as a possibility with known correct countering, so that people don't actually use it anymore. Like a rare chess opening that was once used successfully until people figured out how to deal with it later in the game.
- unclebucknasty 10y ago
  Sadly, boxing as a sport has much declined since Ali's day, and especially in recent years. In particular, the heavyweight division has been found most acutely lacking for some time. However, you are correct that heavyweights don't and have not typically "moved like that". Even those who were relatively fast and defensively gifted (e.g. a young Tyson) didn't move as poetically. He moved like a boxer of a much lower weight class and, beyond even that, he moved like Ali. Graceful. Fluid. Quick. Rhythmic. Instinctive. Check out some of his highlights on YouTube. There are entire sequences during which he defied opponents to hit him through head/upper body movement alone. Hands are low and movement is so fast and well-timed that it seems to predict his opponent's next move. It's as if he is training his opponent to punch wherever he moves his head, and his opponent is reacting to him vs. the other way around. And, this is to say nothing of his footwork. He glided without effort and the mechansim by which he changed direction was almost imperceptible. It seemed that he was being guided on a wire versus using his legs. Back then, it was amazing to see a man his size (or any) move like that, and it would be just as much so today.
  - Double_Cast 10y ago
    At 1:21 and 1:35, Ali does this shuffle thing with his feet. How does one do that? I just tried it, and I can't imagine how I would move my feet that rapidly even with extensive training. I'm pretty lanky. Would it be easier to foot-shuffle if I had Ali's build? Or would it be even harder because of his mass. And does this maneuver have a name? It seems like he does it when he's winding up for a jab combo. To make his punches unpredictable. Am I reading his movements correctly?
    - kasey_junk 10y ago
      One thing people underestimate about boxing is how much training goes into the feet movement. Any boxer at that level can do things with their feet that is pretty baffling. Training your feet and calfs in boxing is extensive. That said one of the things that made Ali so astounding is that for a big guy he was super light on his feet. That foot shuffle doesn't have a name, and he isn't doing it for a tactical advantage. He's showing off. Nearly anyone else on the planet who tried it would have a coach in there ear ripping them a new one. But you know, the greatest of all time gets to do things others can't.
      - unclebucknasty 10y ago
        Oh, I do think the shuffle had tactical advantages beyond showing off. It's demoralizing to the opponent, it serves as a distraction, and it's so unorthodox that it momentarily leaves opponents wondering what's coming next. He frequently threw (and landed) off of a shuffle, even if not to devastating effect. But, I agree that it would drive most trainers nuts for any other boxer. And, yeah, Ali's gifts and confidence made it possible for him to get away with a lot of the kind of stuff that would drive trainers crazy (including Dundee early on). For, instance, consistently carrying his hands so low violated a Golden Rule of boxing and keeping the hands up is one of the first things kids are taught about the sport. Later, he fashioned the rope a dope and other techniques to compensate for his then diminished speed. Kind of reminds me of Bruce Lee. Improvise. Create. Take what your opponent gives you.
    - unclebucknasty 10y ago
- kasey_junk 10y ago
  Boxing is in a bit of a vicious cycle and has been for some time. During Ali's prime boxing was more popular generally. It was a mainstream sport that lots of people watched. It was also going through a golden era with regard to talent especially at the heavy weight level. There was Ali, Frazier, Foreman, Liston all fighting at the same time which of course amplified the popularity. Now boxing doesn't have any of the all time greats boxing and its less popular, meaning its unlikely to have greats start boxing again. Add in how much less acceptable head injuries are in sports, the decline of youth boxing in the USA and the rise of MMA and it is unlikely we will see boxing be anything more than it is now, an occasional big fight for a couple of top contenders and not a lot else that makes it into the general mainstream. As for moving like that, part of it is that bigger guys more generally move better than they used to so the difference isn't as pronounced but its also Ali being special.
  - BashiBazouk 10y ago
    I wonder if the drop in popularity has to do with title bouts moving to pay per view. I've never been interested enough to pay to watch but if it was on network, I probably would have...
bjourne 10y ago
Steroids were legal and veeery prevalent during these days. They increase athletes endurance and ability to take blows immensely. Boxers could get flash knocked down multiple times and still come back and win the fight. Fights like Ali vs Foreman and a lot of other fights considered best of the century are just impossible without steroids.

Jommi 10y ago

and even after his retirement: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9OlmPyjsNU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9OlmPyjsNU

koenbok 10y ago

I like this one even better. It gets real dark through some of his setbacks: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2v-izDj5n7c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2v-izDj5n7c

tempestn 10y ago

This one's good too: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkhpZoPOfZI

typon 10y ago
Can any boxing expert explain how he can be that fast? Is it a practice + muscle memory + probablistic decision or is his reaction time that good? Is he anticipating the punches or reacting to them individually?
- louthy 10y ago
  I'm not a boxing expert, so take this with a pinch of salt. But I expect he uses the same techniques that Bruce Lee advocated in Jeet Kune Do [1], which is about looking for the tiny trigger movements of your opponent and reacting before they've even started really moving (if you look in that video, he sometimes moves out of the way of a punch that doesn't come); probably combined with selling the opponent a 'dummy' to tempt them into making a known move. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeet_Kune_Do
- fear91 10y ago
  If you are relaxed and trained you can dodge the punches because it takes time for them to reach you. You really have to be aware of what is happening though, it's hard to learn not to flinch/close your eyes when the hand is flying to you. But if you are completely relaxed and see it coming, with good footwork and balance you can dodge many of them. You don't actually have to move your head that much, it's just the tiniest distance that will take you away from the trajectory of the punch. The thing with punches is that once you throw a punch, you can't really change its direction or it will lose most of the momentum and speed... That's why it's possible to dodge them, because they fly into particular spot and you can just move away. It's important because it lets you counter instantly. You can only really hit somebody when they are exposed, meaning not holding the guard - so when they are punching. If you were to block the punch with your hands, you couldn't react as quickly because your hands wouldn't be in the ready position. It's really good skill to have but takes years and years of practice to develop.