4 ms·

>>Don't be a good parent. Nice to see where this is going. >>Get this law to treat women the same as men. Wrt to parental leave, that's what I've been advoca

>>Don't be a good parent. Nice to see where this is going. >>Get this law to treat women the same as men. Wrt to parental leave, that's what I've been advocating for throughout this thread. I think that the social and legal status quo sets up women as the caregiver defaults, which is harmful to women. >>Women can play point guards when they start having families with deadbeats. Or, men could leave their jobs and let women return to work at a more reasonable rate. You're again assuming that the male has to be the provider. Why can't a man sacrifice his current career path while his partner continues hers? >>You can have men sitting at home taking care of the kid, but I don't see many women married to men like that. Care to set an example? I think you've missed the point. This is exactly what I did. Both my partner and I have CS degrees from a top 10 university, and we decided that her career looked more promising.

NTDF9 10y ago
>> I think you've missed the point. This is exactly what I did. Both my partner and I have CS degrees from a top 10 university, and we decided that her career looked more promising. This. You come from educated backgrounds. Most common folks don't agree with this. A non-working husband will be called a loser.
rimantas 10y ago
> I think that the social and legal status quo sets up women > as the caregiver defaults, which is harmful to women. That's quite sexist claim.
- NTDF9 10y ago
  Not really. Laws in the US default to women as caregivers. - Women get maternity, men don't - Women get default custody of child in divorce, men don't - Women get to adopt easier than men - Domestic violence on men is ignored/laughed upon, presumably because men are not caregivers but violators by default - Women don't have mandatory military conscription, men do (presumably because men have to be fighters and women have to be caregivers by default)
  - dragonwriter 10y ago
    > Laws in the US default to women as caregivers. Mostly, they don't. > Women get maternity, men don't Well, by definition, its only "maternity" when the mother gets it, but the federal requirement for unpaid, job-protected family leave in FMLA applies equally to parents of both genders, as does (for one example) the California state requirements for job-protected unpaid family (CFRA) and paid family leave (PFL) > Women get default custody of child in divorce, men don't There is no legally-specified default custody in divorce; women get custody in divorce more often because they are more likely to request it. Men get custody more often when it is contested between the parties. > Women get to adopt easier than men AFAIK, that's true for single women vs. single men in practice, but not an example of a default in the law, since its a result of the practices of private adoption agencies, not a result of a difference in legal requirements. > Domestic violence on men is ignored/laughed upon, presumably because men are not caregivers but violators by default Again, to the extent that's true, that's not an example of the law treating them differently; as a matter of law, domestic violence is equally prohibited when a male is the victim. > Women don't have mandatory military conscription, men do Well, no, since the draft ended and the all-volunteer force was established, no one has had mandatory military conscription in the US. Men are required to register in preparation for any potential change in that policy, though, so while overstated, this seems to be the single valid example of a legal preference in the direction you suggest on your list.
    - NTDF9 10y ago
      > There is no legally-specified default custody in divorce; women get custody in divorce more often because they are more likely to request it. Men get custody more often when it is contested between the parties. > Again, to the extent that's true, that's not an example of the law treating them differently; as a matter of law, domestic violence is equally prohibited when a male is the victim. You are onto something. The laws seem to treat men and women the same. So why is there a need for an organizations like "Women who code"? The law, on paper, treats both men and women the same right? If your answer is that the laws are unfair towards a particular gender, then you yourself contradict the above mentioned points. else if your answer is that "in practice" women get treated unfairly despite equal on-paper laws, that is exactly what I meant by "US laws default to women as caregivers". Men get treated unfairly in domestic and family issues. Written law and law as it is enforced and practiced is very very different when it comes to gender issues.

NTDF9 10y ago

>> I think you've missed the point. This is exactly what I did. Both my partner and I have CS degrees from a top 10 university, and we decided that her career looked more promising. This. You come from educated backgrounds. Most common folks don't agree with this. A non-working husband will be called a loser.

rimantas 10y ago

> I think that the social and legal status quo sets up women > as the caregiver defaults, which is harmful to women. That's quite sexist claim.

NTDF9 10y ago
Not really. Laws in the US default to women as caregivers. - Women get maternity, men don't - Women get default custody of child in divorce, men don't - Women get to adopt easier than men - Domestic violence on men is ignored/laughed upon, presumably because men are not caregivers but violators by default - Women don't have mandatory military conscription, men do (presumably because men have to be fighters and women have to be caregivers by default)
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  > Laws in the US default to women as caregivers. Mostly, they don't. > Women get maternity, men don't Well, by definition, its only "maternity" when the mother gets it, but the federal requirement for unpaid, job-protected family leave in FMLA applies equally to parents of both genders, as does (for one example) the California state requirements for job-protected unpaid family (CFRA) and paid family leave (PFL) > Women get default custody of child in divorce, men don't There is no legally-specified default custody in divorce; women get custody in divorce more often because they are more likely to request it. Men get custody more often when it is contested between the parties. > Women get to adopt easier than men AFAIK, that's true for single women vs. single men in practice, but not an example of a default in the law, since its a result of the practices of private adoption agencies, not a result of a difference in legal requirements. > Domestic violence on men is ignored/laughed upon, presumably because men are not caregivers but violators by default Again, to the extent that's true, that's not an example of the law treating them differently; as a matter of law, domestic violence is equally prohibited when a male is the victim. > Women don't have mandatory military conscription, men do Well, no, since the draft ended and the all-volunteer force was established, no one has had mandatory military conscription in the US. Men are required to register in preparation for any potential change in that policy, though, so while overstated, this seems to be the single valid example of a legal preference in the direction you suggest on your list.
  - NTDF9 10y ago
    > There is no legally-specified default custody in divorce; women get custody in divorce more often because they are more likely to request it. Men get custody more often when it is contested between the parties. > Again, to the extent that's true, that's not an example of the law treating them differently; as a matter of law, domestic violence is equally prohibited when a male is the victim. You are onto something. The laws seem to treat men and women the same. So why is there a need for an organizations like "Women who code"? The law, on paper, treats both men and women the same right? If your answer is that the laws are unfair towards a particular gender, then you yourself contradict the above mentioned points. else if your answer is that "in practice" women get treated unfairly despite equal on-paper laws, that is exactly what I meant by "US laws default to women as caregivers". Men get treated unfairly in domestic and family issues. Written law and law as it is enforced and practiced is very very different when it comes to gender issues.