8 ms·

This is a glimpse into what we'll see much more in the IoT-future. And while for a superexpensive car someone will take care, the same is not necessarily true f

by hannob 11y ago

This is a glimpse into what we'll see much more in the IoT-future. And while for a superexpensive car someone will take care, the same is not necessarily true for your home control system, washing machine, (insert other technology with lifetimes far beyond normal IT cycles), which may rely on an ancient app that doesn't run on any modern system any more.

digi_owl 11y ago
You can probably just look at smartphones that drop out of support almost as fast as they ship to get a feel for where IoT will end up.
- wmeredith 11y ago
  I was going to say the same thing. Apple supports iPhones for about 3-4 years and that's considered exceptional in the industry. People own cars and appliances for decades.
  - digi_owl 11y ago
    Well cars and certain appliances used to be fairly mechanical devices, and thus easily maintained with hand tools and a bit of effort. My dad used to love working on cars until they got CAN and all that, and he maintained their washing machine for nearly 3 decades, until the frame rusted apart. The latter he could do because it was a simple construction of two drums, a couple of engines, and a simple analog control unit.
    - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
      Cars at least are incredibly more reliable now than they were just twenty years ago, not to mention twenty years before that, and go back another twenty years and you have the heyday of "planned obsolence".
toyg 11y ago
Glimpse? It's already here: see what happened to Nest. The last episode of the Bad Voltage podcast basically features a long discussion on what IoT devices should be able to do when they lose the "I" for one reason or another. Tbh, I think we'll eventually need laws: something saying "companies should guarantee serviceability and functioning of advanced devices for 10 years, rain or shine (bar nuclear holocaust)". For all the loathing this idea gets, it's the only way to tell the market to "not be stupid". Once businesses start planning for extended serviceability, they'll work on things like durable interfaces that can be easily implemented on newer patforms, offline modes etc etc, which will be innovative and will greatly benefit consumers. As these sort of systems become routine, the 10-year window will naturally extend itself.
- Symbiote 11y ago
  The European Union already has these laws, the goods must be fit for purpose for a "reasonable" duration. In the UK the maximum is 6 years, but it depends on the item and how much it is used. However, up to now most things break because they wear out, or from a manufacturing fault. That's quite different from the manufacturer switching off some supporting servers, since most people would expect most old devices to work for longer than the minimum.
  - digi_owl 11y ago
    I recall the Norwegian consumer agency and Nokia was in a row back around 2000 about the length of mandatory warranty on mobile phones. Nokia wanted it to be 2 years, same as most electronics, but the agency wanted a couple more added or some such.
- dcposch 11y ago
  > For all the loathing this idea gets, it's the only way to tell the market to "not be stupid". No, the market will be just fine. IoT is a fad. Much of it is just taking things that were simple and reliable and making them complex and flaky, in order to market as "smart" or "advanced" or "high tech". Fire alarms that inexplicably run Linux. Thermostats that brick themselves one morning after an auto update. "Smart fridges" with a big touch screen that nobody will actually use. [1] Buyers will get burned. IoT will lose its "wow" factor and all this will be seen, in hindsight, as comically unnecessary and embarassingly tacky. Consumer Reports will give out a bunch of black circles. The market will correct. [1]: https://twitter.com/internetofshit https://twitter.com/internetofshit http://favstar.fm/users/internetofshit http://favstar.fm/users/internetofshit
taneq 11y ago
Even worse, even when the hardware is all still perfectly functional the devices will stop working as soon as the company that sold them gets acqui-hired and shuts down the web services they use.

by hannob 11y ago

digi_owl 11y ago

You can probably just look at smartphones that drop out of support almost as fast as they ship to get a feel for where IoT will end up.

wmeredith 11y ago
I was going to say the same thing. Apple supports iPhones for about 3-4 years and that's considered exceptional in the industry. People own cars and appliances for decades.
- digi_owl 11y ago
  Well cars and certain appliances used to be fairly mechanical devices, and thus easily maintained with hand tools and a bit of effort. My dad used to love working on cars until they got CAN and all that, and he maintained their washing machine for nearly 3 decades, until the frame rusted apart. The latter he could do because it was a simple construction of two drums, a couple of engines, and a simple analog control unit.
  - GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
    Cars at least are incredibly more reliable now than they were just twenty years ago, not to mention twenty years before that, and go back another twenty years and you have the heyday of "planned obsolence".

toyg 11y ago

Glimpse? It's already here: see what happened to Nest. The last episode of the Bad Voltage podcast basically features a long discussion on what IoT devices should be able to do when they lose the "I" for one reason or another. Tbh, I think we'll eventually need laws: something saying "companies should guarantee serviceability and functioning of advanced devices for 10 years, rain or shine (bar nuclear holocaust)". For all the loathing this idea gets, it's the only way to tell the market to "not be stupid". Once businesses start planning for extended serviceability, they'll work on things like durable interfaces that can be easily implemented on newer patforms, offline modes etc etc, which will be innovative and will greatly benefit consumers. As these sort of systems become routine, the 10-year window will naturally extend itself.

Symbiote 11y ago
The European Union already has these laws, the goods must be fit for purpose for a "reasonable" duration. In the UK the maximum is 6 years, but it depends on the item and how much it is used. However, up to now most things break because they wear out, or from a manufacturing fault. That's quite different from the manufacturer switching off some supporting servers, since most people would expect most old devices to work for longer than the minimum.
- digi_owl 11y ago
  I recall the Norwegian consumer agency and Nokia was in a row back around 2000 about the length of mandatory warranty on mobile phones. Nokia wanted it to be 2 years, same as most electronics, but the agency wanted a couple more added or some such.
dcposch 11y ago
> For all the loathing this idea gets, it's the only way to tell the market to "not be stupid". No, the market will be just fine. IoT is a fad. Much of it is just taking things that were simple and reliable and making them complex and flaky, in order to market as "smart" or "advanced" or "high tech". Fire alarms that inexplicably run Linux. Thermostats that brick themselves one morning after an auto update. "Smart fridges" with a big touch screen that nobody will actually use. [1] Buyers will get burned. IoT will lose its "wow" factor and all this will be seen, in hindsight, as comically unnecessary and embarassingly tacky. Consumer Reports will give out a bunch of black circles. The market will correct. [1]: https://twitter.com/internetofshit https://twitter.com/internetofshit http://favstar.fm/users/internetofshit http://favstar.fm/users/internetofshit

taneq 11y ago

Even worse, even when the hardware is all still perfectly functional the devices will stop working as soon as the company that sold them gets acqui-hired and shuts down the web services they use.