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"Solar energy prices hit a new record low in January with the auction of 420 megawatts in Rajasthan at 4.34 rupees a kilowatt-hour. In comparison coal tariffs r
by downandout 11y ago
"Solar energy prices hit a new record low in January with the auction of 420 megawatts in Rajasthan at 4.34 rupees a kilowatt-hour. In comparison coal tariffs range between 3-5 rupees/kWh."
So the headline here is, as is usually the case with articles in this space, misleading at best. It's slightly cheaper than the highest-end coal, but dramatically more expensive - nearly 1.5X more - than the lower end. Overall, it's still more expensive, and that doesn't include the cost of batteries to deal with the fact that the sun sets each day.
To be sure, advances are being made in this space. But this headline is nothing more than clickbait.
- Kliment 11y agoThe comparison is between the cost of new installations - coal power is very cheap because the facilities are old and the capital expenses were sunk a long time ago. New solar power is now cheaper to build out than new coal plants, which is reasonable enough given the cost of both raw materials and production processes for solar had plummeted over the last decade whereas coal is a very mature technology that is effectively at the end of its efficiency curve (and getting worse over time as the cost of extraction grows).
- downandout 11y ago>The comparison is between the cost of new installations That may be, but that isn't what the headline says. It simply says that solar is cheaper than coal, which of course is not the case right now.
- Osiris30 11y agoYes, all solar installations are not cheaper than all coal installations. But conversely, all coal is not cheaper than all solar! That applies globally and in India. The point is that solar costs are declining every year, by 10% p.a. In many sunny places it is already at parity or below (eg Arizona, Mexico, Rajasthan and Gujarat in India, Mexico). We have already seen several bids this year at US¢ 3/Kwh ($30/MWh). $20/MWh is in sight - that would be well under the cheapest coal. This link is useful summary http://cleantechnica.com/2016/04/15/why-energy-experts-are-still-shocked-by-the-rise-of-solar-the-fall-in-costs/ http://cleantechnica.com/2016/04/15/why-energy-experts-are-s... (And none of this accounts for the massive unpriced carbon + health externality of coal plants). Coal is staying at best flat + whatever the fuel cost.
- parimm 11y ago> US¢ 3/Kwh ($30/MWh). $30/MWh seems to be very very cheap. That is half the price of the lowest bid in India. Is there a source for that number?
- Osiris30 11y agoDubai Nov 2014 - $58.40 per MWHr. See [1] Austin July 2015 - $57.10 per MWh. See [2] Nevada July 2015 - $38.7 per MWh. See [3] Mexico April 2016 - $35.44 per MWh. See [4] [1] http://cleantechnica.com/2014/11/29/dubai-shatters-solar-tariff-records-worldwide-lowest-ever/ http://cleantechnica.com/2014/11/29/dubai-shatters-solar-tar... [2] http://cleantechnica.com/2015/07/02/worlds-cheapest-solar-power-lands-in-austin-texas-under-4%C2%A2kwh-sort-of/ http://cleantechnica.com/2015/07/02/worlds-cheapest-solar-po... [3] http://www.pv-magazine.com/news/details/beitrag/buffett-strikes-cheapest-electricity-price-in-us-with-nevada-solar-farm_100020120/#axzz46HDeOcQs http://www.pv-magazine.com/news/details/beitrag/buffett-stri... [4] http://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/Solar-Stuns-in-Mexicos-First-Clean-Energy-Auction-1860-MW-Won-at-50.7-P http://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/Solar-Stuns-in-M...
- TheCoelacanth 11y agoSure, but you can't build an old coal plant. You can only build a new one.
- __jal 11y agoShort Headlines Omit Details, Experts Say Seven Words Found Insufficient for Expressing Nuance Headlines "Easy Targets" for Quibbling
- shripadk 11y agoIt is cost to implement a new renewable energy source (solar power) based power plant vs a non-renewable energy source (coal) based power plant. I would have been happy even if the cost to build a solar power plant was 10 times the cost of a coal based plant as the latter has a negative long term impact on health and environment. The very fact that it is just 1.5 times the lower end of coal tariff is something to be happy about.
- stuaxo 11y agoGiven how much electricity is burned in hot countries for airconditioning, electricity that works during the day is no bad thing.
- aub3bhat 11y agoRajasthan is mostly an arid desert with huge amount of area where nothing can grow. Solar power is an ideal fit for amount unused land available.
- Osiris30 11y agoNo. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11524691 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11524691 Why does solar always need batteries? These are not "advances". India is adding 20k MW of solar and 10k MW of wind p.a. China is at 20+20. US at 20+20. Europe at 20+20. 30% of all new power capacity additions globally will be from renewables for the foreseeable future. Probably more. This is without "batteries". Without subsidies. The need for "baseload", "storage", or "the sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow" are red herrings. They are not relevant. Whether we like it or not, driven by massive cost and technology improvements, solar and wind are here in a massive way.
- downandout 11y agoBut it is not cheaper than coal, which is what the headline says and was the impetus of my comment. I'm happy to see the costs going down, and maybe one day it will be competitively priced. But that day is not today.
- barney54 11y agoThe need for reliable energy or energy when the sun is not shining is critical important--according to the people of India. For example, according to this article in ClimateWire (a trade pub) http://www.eenews.net/climatewire/stories/1060026477/ http://www.eenews.net/climatewire/stories/1060026477/ Dharnai, a community of about 3,200 people in eastern India's Bihar state, had been without electricity for three decades. So when activists with Greenpeace set up a solar-powered microgrid in July of 2014, the excitement was palpable. But, residents said, the problems started almost immediately. When the former chief minister of Bihar state visited to inaugurate the grid, villagers lined up to protest, chanting, "We want real electricity, not fake electricity!" By "real," they meant power from the central grid, generated mostly using coal. By "fake," they meant solar.
- pjc50 11y agoYour link is paywalled unfortunately? India is quite capable of having unreliable power without solar. I agree that people should not be fobbed off with unreliable solutions, but that doesn't mean solar can't be a big part of the grid mix. It sounds like the activist microgrid was inadequate. http://www.dnaindia.com/analysis/standpoint-what-is-the-real-cost-of-unreliable-power-supply-2138990 http://www.dnaindia.com/analysis/standpoint-what-is-the-real... "It is believed that, out of the 70 million tonne of diesel consumed in the country per year, about 20% or 14 million tonne is used in captive power generation."
- Certhas 11y agoTrue, but the externalities for coal are huge, as are the hidden subsidies. A fair comparison would also include those: https://www.pik-potsdam.de/members/edenh/publications-1/copy_of_KingCoalandtheQueenofSubsidies_Final.pdf https://www.pik-potsdam.de/members/edenh/publications-1/copy... The important thing to note is that politicians are hopefully willing to act on this.
- julienchastang 11y agoExactly. Huge externalities such as rising sea-levels, ocean acidification, etc. etc.
- nathansobo 11y agoTakes political mechanisms to enforce those costs on polluters, so it's really important for solar to beat coal even in the presence of this hidden subsidy.
- conceit 11y agoSolar does have externalities, as well. Solar panels aren't built from nothing. And batteries neither, apparently
- CyberDildonics 11y agoWhy would bring up batteries? Solar for the moment isn't about all or nothing electricity, it is about cost and if it beats coal in the cost per kw/hr then that is electricity that doesn't need to be generated by coal.
- piyushpr134 11y agoIndia has National Solar Mission. It has differential pricing for solar vs other means govt subsidizes solar power for it to compete with coal. When the govt started this programme about 8 years back, cost was around INR17 per kwh. It has come down to a level where it can actually compete with coal during day times of high load. That is pretty significant.
- boomlinde 11y agoI think that you have to assume that they don't need batteries (it turns out that there are other sources of power), that the cost is actually included in the auctioned price or that they are making a safe bet that they can sell it at a loss based on predictions of future costs.
- dang 11y agoThanks for vetting this for all of us. We've inserted "some" before "coal" in the title above.