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This is so bubble-written it's not funny. Romania is a country where a large chunk of the populace get around by cart and donkey, where post-communist corrupti

This is so bubble-written it's not funny. Romania is a country where a large chunk of the populace get around by cart and donkey, where post-communist corruption is rife, where decades on they still can't decide what to do with the half built palace that occupies half of Bucharest, where gangsters run most of the hospitality industry and god knows what else. It's a chicken and egg problem, of course, as enterprise will bring wealth (in theory) which in turn will solve some of Romania's more immediate woes, but it's still a tiny tiny niche in a very poor country. Their only saving psychological grace is that Moldova are next door, and they make anyone look rich. Edit: on a Re-read, this comes across as horribly negative. I'm a big fan of Romania and its prospects - what I failed to mention is that I met a lot of intelligent, interesting and passionate younger people - and they will be the ones that drag Romania solidly into a functioning state - but the reality is that there's a lot of work to do.

XCSme 11y ago
When have you last been in Romania?
aorth 11y ago
There are two sides to every coin. I think both Techcrunch and your assessments are valid. It would not be hard to paint the USA as a totalitarian state run by organized crime and where half of the people live under some acceptable standard of living.
- joesmo 11y ago
  How else would you paint it?
mariusmg 11y ago
Dude, are you from Hungary ? :)
- mnyary 11y ago
  Please, don't do this!
marinabercea 11y ago
I live in Romania. For potential readers: this comment's content is a gross overstatement and does not reflect reality. For example, over 50% of the population lives in an urban environment (see the CIA Romania Factbook which is very up to date). Even so, it would be wrong to assume that just because some of the country's citizens live in the countryside, they 'get around by cart and donkey'. Also, for the sake of accuracy, where such transportation is used, horses would be much more common as opposed to donkeys. As for the 'half built palace that occupies half of Bucharest', I presume you're referring to the Palace of the Parliament, with an area of 365000 m2. The urban area of Bucharest occupies 228 km2, or 228000000 m2, significantly more than the area of the building you mentioned. Edit: I double checked some data in regards to the Palace of the Parliament, the FLOOR AREA is indeed 365000 m2, but since the building has multiple floors, the actual occupied area is smaller. Check the Technical Details on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_the_Parliament https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_the_Parliament
- madaxe_again 11y ago
  To be fair, I was last there six years ago, spent most of my time travelling through the the countryside, a few weeks in Cluj, visited friends in Sibiu, and got robbed when I went through Bucharest on my way to Moldova. So yes, my view is far less accurate than yours, as it's from about six weeks six years ago - but the only place I saw comparable levels of overt corruption was Kyrgyzstan, and I've visited most of the ex-ussr and associated states. This is no judgment on the Romanian or Kyrgyz peoples - this is a sad fact of life after economic oppression - corruption becomes a way of life.
  - oblio 11y ago
    I'm sorry for your personal experience, but you should be able to realize that traumatic personal experiences can cloud your opinion about a very complex topic such as a whole country. I visited the US and I wasn't really impressed, for example. But I wouldn't judge the US based on just what I saw in a couple of weeks, considering what I've read and seen about it. Oh, and regarding corruption: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Anticorruption_Directorate https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Anticorruption_Dire...
_fizz_buzz_ 11y ago
I think you are right that the article is a bit "bubble-written". But I think your comment is a lot further from the truth than the article. The biggest asset that Romania has is its talent pool. I am fairly convinced that Romania will follow Estonia's economic trajectory. The starting conditions are quite similar.
oblio 11y ago
Man, so much angst. Did you read the whole article? > Still, as many have noted, Romania has some big hurdles to overcome to truly become a tech hub. > Access to capital is slim. The risk-taking culture is nascent. > The government bureaucracy is strong and legislation that supports startups is lacking. > Yet every shift has to begin somewhere, and from what we see, there’s one afoot in Romania. They admit that not everything is perfect in the friendly article.
davidiach 11y ago
This is an exaggeration. 1. Only a tiny chunk of the population "get around by cart and donkey" and that's mostly in rural areas. Romania has around 314 cars per 1000 inhabitants. For comparison the UK has 519, Sweden 520, Mexico 275, Brazil 249, Ukraine 220, Moldova 156 and China 128. [1] 2. Corruption is one of the most discussed topics in Romania, but in my opinion it is over-rated. There is virtually no violent corruption, most of the existing corruption has to do government contracts or bribing of government officials. 3. Yeah, the Palace of the Parliament sucks. But it's one of the biggest tourist attractions right now in Bucharest. 4. "gangsters run most of the hospitality industry" - actually most of it is run by large foreign companies or small "mom and pop" entrepreneurs. No, Romania is not building the next "Silicon Valley", but it does have a vibrant IT community that is increasingly involved in creating technology startups and is developing in the right direction. ---------------------------------------------------- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_...
sndean 11y ago
> very poor country. One upside, from an outsider point-of-view, is that an apartment in Bucharest goes for about the same amount as a downpayment for an apartment in London. For that reason alone, I can imagine some Europeans (especially Londoners) would seriously consider giving up their 400 sqft place and going to Romania to own three large apartments. Or at least I would.
- prodmerc 11y ago
  Yeah renting good apartments and houses is really cheap. But imho try to avoid Bucharest, which is the London of Romania, that is, a bit of an overcrowded shithole. Any other major city is better (except maybe Iasi :D)...
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

XCSme 11y ago

When have you last been in Romania?

aorth 11y ago

There are two sides to every coin. I think both Techcrunch and your assessments are valid. It would not be hard to paint the USA as a totalitarian state run by organized crime and where half of the people live under some acceptable standard of living.

joesmo 11y ago
How else would you paint it?

mariusmg 11y ago

Dude, are you from Hungary ? :)

mnyary 11y ago
Please, don't do this!

marinabercea 11y ago

I live in Romania. For potential readers: this comment's content is a gross overstatement and does not reflect reality. For example, over 50% of the population lives in an urban environment (see the CIA Romania Factbook which is very up to date). Even so, it would be wrong to assume that just because some of the country's citizens live in the countryside, they 'get around by cart and donkey'. Also, for the sake of accuracy, where such transportation is used, horses would be much more common as opposed to donkeys. As for the 'half built palace that occupies half of Bucharest', I presume you're referring to the Palace of the Parliament, with an area of 365000 m2. The urban area of Bucharest occupies 228 km2, or 228000000 m2, significantly more than the area of the building you mentioned. Edit: I double checked some data in regards to the Palace of the Parliament, the FLOOR AREA is indeed 365000 m2, but since the building has multiple floors, the actual occupied area is smaller. Check the Technical Details on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_the_Parliament https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palace_of_the_Parliament

madaxe_again 11y ago
To be fair, I was last there six years ago, spent most of my time travelling through the the countryside, a few weeks in Cluj, visited friends in Sibiu, and got robbed when I went through Bucharest on my way to Moldova. So yes, my view is far less accurate than yours, as it's from about six weeks six years ago - but the only place I saw comparable levels of overt corruption was Kyrgyzstan, and I've visited most of the ex-ussr and associated states. This is no judgment on the Romanian or Kyrgyz peoples - this is a sad fact of life after economic oppression - corruption becomes a way of life.
- oblio 11y ago
  I'm sorry for your personal experience, but you should be able to realize that traumatic personal experiences can cloud your opinion about a very complex topic such as a whole country. I visited the US and I wasn't really impressed, for example. But I wouldn't judge the US based on just what I saw in a couple of weeks, considering what I've read and seen about it. Oh, and regarding corruption: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Anticorruption_Directorate https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Anticorruption_Dire...

_fizz_buzz_ 11y ago

I think you are right that the article is a bit "bubble-written". But I think your comment is a lot further from the truth than the article. The biggest asset that Romania has is its talent pool. I am fairly convinced that Romania will follow Estonia's economic trajectory. The starting conditions are quite similar.

oblio 11y ago

Man, so much angst. Did you read the whole article? > Still, as many have noted, Romania has some big hurdles to overcome to truly become a tech hub. > Access to capital is slim. The risk-taking culture is nascent. > The government bureaucracy is strong and legislation that supports startups is lacking. > Yet every shift has to begin somewhere, and from what we see, there’s one afoot in Romania. They admit that not everything is perfect in the friendly article.

davidiach 11y ago

This is an exaggeration. 1. Only a tiny chunk of the population "get around by cart and donkey" and that's mostly in rural areas. Romania has around 314 cars per 1000 inhabitants. For comparison the UK has 519, Sweden 520, Mexico 275, Brazil 249, Ukraine 220, Moldova 156 and China 128. [1] 2. Corruption is one of the most discussed topics in Romania, but in my opinion it is over-rated. There is virtually no violent corruption, most of the existing corruption has to do government contracts or bribing of government officials. 3. Yeah, the Palace of the Parliament sucks. But it's one of the biggest tourist attractions right now in Bucharest. 4. "gangsters run most of the hospitality industry" - actually most of it is run by large foreign companies or small "mom and pop" entrepreneurs. No, Romania is not building the next "Silicon Valley", but it does have a vibrant IT community that is increasingly involved in creating technology startups and is developing in the right direction. ---------------------------------------------------- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_...

sndean 11y ago

> very poor country. One upside, from an outsider point-of-view, is that an apartment in Bucharest goes for about the same amount as a downpayment for an apartment in London. For that reason alone, I can imagine some Europeans (especially Londoners) would seriously consider giving up their 400 sqft place and going to Romania to own three large apartments. Or at least I would.

prodmerc 11y ago
Yeah renting good apartments and houses is really cheap. But imho try to avoid Bucharest, which is the London of Romania, that is, a bit of an overcrowded shithole. Any other major city is better (except maybe Iasi :D)...

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]