4 ms·

A degree is very useful when trying to get your first job in the industry. It provides some comfort for the hiring company that you have some level of training

A degree is very useful when trying to get your first job in the industry. It provides some comfort for the hiring company that you have some level of training and understanding. It makes you stand out from those without a degree that are also trying to get a start. Once you have several years experience the degree becomes less important because you will be judged on your actual experience. An employers looks at the languages/platforms you have used and can then easily test you based on those. After 5 or more years the degree is pretty much irrelevant. Especially when there is a shortage of talent.

cmrdporcupine 11y ago
Some employers do not care much at all about your experience. For example, Google interviews really don't consider this at all beyond the initial screen whether you will get your interview or not. After that it's all hours of testing your responses to problems, etc. And in reality most industry experience is of little use at Google anyways. Google does care about school and GPAs, etc. tho. More than most.
- theGimp 11y ago
  I believe that has changed. Q. Other insights from the data you’ve gathered about Google employees? A. One of the things we’ve seen from all our data crunching is that G.P.A.’s are worthless as a criteria for hiring, and test scores are worthless — no correlation at all except for brand-new college grads, where there’s a slight correlation. Google famously used to ask everyone for a transcript and G.P.A.’s and test scores, but we don’t anymore, unless you’re just a few years out of school. We found that they don’t predict anything. Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/20/business/in-head-hunting-big-data-may-not-be-such-a-big-deal.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/20/business/in-head-hunting-b... Also, I doubt that external industry experience means little to Google -- for two reasons: 1. Good engineering practices are good engineering practices. You can pick those up by working at a good firm 2. Though they hold God-like stature, Google is like any other company. They mostly use the same technology and a lot of the same tools as everybody else.
  - cmrdporcupine 11y ago
    I'm pretty sure that our local hiring committee at my site definitely considers your level of degree and what school. I don't know anybody else in my office without a degree. A very high % have masters or phds.
    - komali2 11y ago
      That's probably a different sort of correlation than a Google-caused one.
  - cmrdporcupine 11y ago
    "Btw, 2. Though they hold God-like stature, Google is like any other company. They mostly use the same technology and a lot of the same tools as everybody else." As a Google employee, no, not true. Yes, we use the same _languages_ and compilers and editors... but beyond that most everything else is unique to Google. Build tools, libraries, deployment environment, web servers, databases, it's all unique to Google.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
  - wavefunction 11y ago
    >G.P.A.'s Ugh, a degree might be a good thing, some things considered... I have to hope this was a phone interview, but even so, where is the author and editor and proofer? (I am degreeless)
    - burkaman 11y ago
      http://afterdeadline.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/13/faqs-on-style/ http://afterdeadline.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/13/faqs-on-st... "A number of readers have complained after seeing plural abbreviations like M.D.’s and M.R.I.’s in The Times. They say the apostrophe is wrong — that it indicates a possessive and should not be used in a plural like this. In fact, style rules at The Times (and some other publications, including the Chicago Manual of Style) do call for using an apostrophe in the plural of abbreviations that include periods. The idea is that a combination of uppercase letters, periods and a lowercase “s” is confusing at first glance, and that the apostrophe helps a reader see that the “s” has been added to make a plural." You might say that it should be GPA instead of G.P.A., but at least you can see that it was proofread.
- marssaxman 11y ago
  That certainly used to be the story, but so far as I know it hasn't actually been the case for several years. I had no trouble getting a job there in 2011 despite my lack of a high-school diploma. (This turned out to have been a terrible idea; that was mostly bad luck, but the nature of Google's business makes it a place I would never have easily fit in.)
- dsfyu404ed 11y ago
  No company seriously cares about GPA beyond using it as a tie breaker when a coin toss would suffice. There's a very obvious inverse relationship between how much work you take on and your GPA. The students with jobs take a hit on their GPA, so do the students who spend a lot of time on clubs. Obviously the people who spend all their time partying will have a lower GPA but it's easy to discern the difference between those groups just from looking at a resume.
encoderer 11y ago
Until the last 10 years of your career when you may have a shot at a role as a Sr Executive, CEO, serve on a board, etc. Then, again, you'll be held back by not having a degree.
- ktRolster 11y ago
  Then, again, you'll be held back by not having a degree. Really?
  - madengr 11y ago
    Yes, a high level manager at my employer (fedgov contractor) was teaspooned when edict from fedgov said managers at his level needed a masters or higher, despite it being irrelevant to his non-technical job. This is someone in his 50s who had probably been there 30 years.
    - ars 11y ago
      teaspooned?
      - madengr 11y ago
        Lateral transfer into a position of no importance, but retaining pay and title. You are there at the table, but not really used; teaspooned.
  - n00b101 11y ago
    Yes
  - J_Darnley 11y ago
    Yes. You cannot get hired without a degree unless you have experience. You cannot get experience without getting hired. The chicken and egg problem that a degree solves. What you might call "bootstrapping"
    - 11y ago
zamalek 11y ago
> After 5 or more years the degree is pretty much irrelevant. Except in one case: immigration. I'm the type of person who is simply dreadful at exactly only one thing: education. The how an why seems irrelevant. The American government does allow an employer to motivate an H1B, but after 5 years (when the visa expires) I'll need a degree in order to continue my stay. So it becomes irrelevant in terms of landing a job. It's still valuable in many other situations.

cmrdporcupine 11y ago

Some employers do not care much at all about your experience. For example, Google interviews really don't consider this at all beyond the initial screen whether you will get your interview or not. After that it's all hours of testing your responses to problems, etc. And in reality most industry experience is of little use at Google anyways. Google does care about school and GPAs, etc. tho. More than most.

theGimp 11y ago
I believe that has changed. Q. Other insights from the data you’ve gathered about Google employees? A. One of the things we’ve seen from all our data crunching is that G.P.A.’s are worthless as a criteria for hiring, and test scores are worthless — no correlation at all except for brand-new college grads, where there’s a slight correlation. Google famously used to ask everyone for a transcript and G.P.A.’s and test scores, but we don’t anymore, unless you’re just a few years out of school. We found that they don’t predict anything. Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/20/business/in-head-hunting-big-data-may-not-be-such-a-big-deal.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/20/business/in-head-hunting-b... Also, I doubt that external industry experience means little to Google -- for two reasons: 1. Good engineering practices are good engineering practices. You can pick those up by working at a good firm 2. Though they hold God-like stature, Google is like any other company. They mostly use the same technology and a lot of the same tools as everybody else.
- cmrdporcupine 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure that our local hiring committee at my site definitely considers your level of degree and what school. I don't know anybody else in my office without a degree. A very high % have masters or phds.
  - komali2 11y ago
    That's probably a different sort of correlation than a Google-caused one.
- cmrdporcupine 11y ago
  "Btw, 2. Though they hold God-like stature, Google is like any other company. They mostly use the same technology and a lot of the same tools as everybody else." As a Google employee, no, not true. Yes, we use the same _languages_ and compilers and editors... but beyond that most everything else is unique to Google. Build tools, libraries, deployment environment, web servers, databases, it's all unique to Google.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- wavefunction 11y ago
  >G.P.A.'s Ugh, a degree might be a good thing, some things considered... I have to hope this was a phone interview, but even so, where is the author and editor and proofer? (I am degreeless)
  - burkaman 11y ago
    http://afterdeadline.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/13/faqs-on-style/ http://afterdeadline.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/13/faqs-on-st... "A number of readers have complained after seeing plural abbreviations like M.D.’s and M.R.I.’s in The Times. They say the apostrophe is wrong — that it indicates a possessive and should not be used in a plural like this. In fact, style rules at The Times (and some other publications, including the Chicago Manual of Style) do call for using an apostrophe in the plural of abbreviations that include periods. The idea is that a combination of uppercase letters, periods and a lowercase “s” is confusing at first glance, and that the apostrophe helps a reader see that the “s” has been added to make a plural." You might say that it should be GPA instead of G.P.A., but at least you can see that it was proofread.
marssaxman 11y ago
That certainly used to be the story, but so far as I know it hasn't actually been the case for several years. I had no trouble getting a job there in 2011 despite my lack of a high-school diploma. (This turned out to have been a terrible idea; that was mostly bad luck, but the nature of Google's business makes it a place I would never have easily fit in.)
dsfyu404ed 11y ago
No company seriously cares about GPA beyond using it as a tie breaker when a coin toss would suffice. There's a very obvious inverse relationship between how much work you take on and your GPA. The students with jobs take a hit on their GPA, so do the students who spend a lot of time on clubs. Obviously the people who spend all their time partying will have a lower GPA but it's easy to discern the difference between those groups just from looking at a resume.

encoderer 11y ago

Until the last 10 years of your career when you may have a shot at a role as a Sr Executive, CEO, serve on a board, etc. Then, again, you'll be held back by not having a degree.

ktRolster 11y ago
Then, again, you'll be held back by not having a degree. Really?
- madengr 11y ago
  Yes, a high level manager at my employer (fedgov contractor) was teaspooned when edict from fedgov said managers at his level needed a masters or higher, despite it being irrelevant to his non-technical job. This is someone in his 50s who had probably been there 30 years.
  - ars 11y ago
    teaspooned?
    - madengr 11y ago
      Lateral transfer into a position of no importance, but retaining pay and title. You are there at the table, but not really used; teaspooned.
- n00b101 11y ago
  Yes
- J_Darnley 11y ago
  Yes. You cannot get hired without a degree unless you have experience. You cannot get experience without getting hired. The chicken and egg problem that a degree solves. What you might call "bootstrapping"
  - 11y ago

zamalek 11y ago

> After 5 or more years the degree is pretty much irrelevant. Except in one case: immigration. I'm the type of person who is simply dreadful at exactly only one thing: education. The how an why seems irrelevant. The American government does allow an employer to motivate an H1B, but after 5 years (when the visa expires) I'll need a degree in order to continue my stay. So it becomes irrelevant in terms of landing a job. It's still valuable in many other situations.