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>There’s already another VR rig that doesn’t have a tether—and it costs a fraction of the Rift. Samsung’s $100 Gear VR, made in partnership with Oculus, is powe

>There’s already another VR rig that doesn’t have a tether—and it costs a fraction of the Rift. Samsung’s $100 Gear VR, made in partnership with Oculus, is powered by a smartphone that you physically insert in front of two lenses. The extra costs of the Rift (monetary and otherwise) would be justified if its image quality were dramatically better than the Gear’s, but it isn’t. I already got the sense that the author really hadn't done much research before writing the piece, but that statement is very telling. The key benefits of a rift over a gear vr are in it's motion capture, the processing power made available to it by the attached computer and not being time restricted by limited battery life, and I would expect a critic to know that. As it stands I respect the dudes view, and it'll be one shared by a lot of non-gamers, but this is basically a lets-play, not a critical review.

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jsprogrammer 11y ago
Can't you attach your phone to a computer and grid power with a USB cable?
- Sir_Substance 11y ago
  Off the top of my head I don't think you can with the gear vr (doesn't the USB port get taken up by the headset?), but even if you can, one of the authors key complaints leading into that statement was that the rift was not wireless. If you told him to wire up his gear vr, he wouldn't be impressed.
  - kitcar 11y ago
    Correct, the interface between the phone and the headset is the charge port, but there is an additional port on the Gear VR itself to allow for charging while being used. The original Gear VR ("Innovator edition") could not be charged while used though if I remember correctly.
  - jsprogrammer 11y ago
    The person I responded to was complaining that the rift alternative (a phone with appropriate lenses) had limited time usage due to relying on a battery. Most phones can run indefinitely by hooking them up to an external power source, obviating one of the poster's concerns. Additionally, you could augment the phone's processing power through a high-speed interconnect (like the USB cable that also supplies continuous power).
    - Retric 11y ago
      Phones get very warm when you charge them while playing 3D games. I doubt you would want to have that much heat with an enclosed headset for very long. Unless you can get a lot of ventilation without letting light in.
    - Sir_Substance 11y ago
      FYI the person you were responding to was me, and I wasn't complaining.
- dreamcompiler 11y ago
  The Gear VR has an extra USB port that you can connect to a charger which keeps the phone powered while in use. Or (more convenient) you can connect it to a self-contained brick battery you could wear on your waist.
- zamalek 11y ago
  I hacked up a quick head-tracking solution one weekend using my phone and WiFi. The problem was passive calibration. Accelerometers and gyroscopes are noisy and imperfect. Drift occurs and without the Occulus tracker or Vive lighthouses you are in for a frustrating experience. I own a DK2 and for many concrete reasons disagree with the author, it is not a novelty. Phone-based stuff is most certainly a novelty.
jqgatsby 11y ago
Comparison to Gear VR seems inappropriate, given the huge amount of effort Oculus the company has put into the partnership with Samsung.
- ZoF 11y ago
  How does that make comparison inappropriate?
soylentcola 11y ago
The difference between something like the Rift or the Vive and mobile-based stuff like Gear are huge when you get down to actually using it. Even discounting the differences between Rift and Vive regarding how they track motion, the Gear doesn't even have positional head tracking, just orientation. In use, this makes a huge difference if you're looking to put someone in a virtual environment. It's not even restricted to gaming applications. All of the software I've tried on my Rift dev unit and someone else's Gear made this abundantly clear to me. Not being able to lean forward/back/around things takes away a huge part of the "immersion" factor leaving you with more of a souped-up 3d screen. In terms of cost, for the Gear, don't you also need one of a few specific, expensive Samsung phones? I admit I haven't followed it as much lately so I don't know if they are selling something more affordable with the phone-stuff integrated or allowing the use of other phones. When I looked last, you needed a ~$700 phone plus the Gear. Not too big a price difference between $800 for phone+Gear and $1000 for a good video card+Rift. Personally, when I'm even considering something this expensive, new, and unnecessary, $800+ versus $1000 isn't a huge difference since I'm already spending a lot on something I don't really need. The other huge thing I've noticed is that all of the best new and in-development VR stuff just isn't gonna be something you can run on a phone or a Playstation. It's gonna be beta software (if you're lucky) and require a powerful, flexible platform like a computer. Down the line it will even out but right now, none of the really impressive stuff I've seen for VR will run on Gear and I doubt it will be in the Sony Playstation store anytime soon. That same console-level polish and ease comes with a flip-side: no access to anything that isn't seamless or marketable just yet.
- angersock 11y ago
  Speaking as somebody who is frustrated with the current dev story for AR and VR... ...maybe the specs wouldn't be so goddamn high if they actually let us do dev work against a lower-level interface. Forcing us to deal with massive frameworks like Unity and Unreal might well be the cause of spec creep. :( EDIT: And Meta can go eat a bag of rocks--no public docs on their API, and they seem to be wed to Unity...which can really screw up certain types of AR work they'd otherwise be perfect for. Oculus, at least, offered a native SDK for the brave and foolish.
MBCook 11y ago
I've been following VR for the last year or so. There is no question that the Rift has better specs and can do better graphics than the Gear. But I've read more than a few people in the VR space (game journalists, developers) say that there is something special about the Gear because there is no cable. There's nothing you have to keep conscious of so you don't trip over it or feel it on your back breaking immersion. The Gear VR could be enhanced with better tracking, and as new phones come out it will get better processing power. I think Fowler is right. VR is very new. Let's say your a consumer who wants to play with it. What's a better investment? $2200 in a PC and a Rift, or $100 that clips on your phone (assuming you're on Samsung)? If you just want to try it for now, play around a bit? The Gear is very compelling. (I'd love one, but I use an iPhone. I've got a PS VR on order though.)
- Sir_Substance 11y ago
  >$2200 in a PC and a Rift, or $100 that clips on your phone (assuming you're on Samsung)? Your figures are a little off. A rift is (all following figures in USD) $599, and a computer that will support it is generally quoted at $950, making it's package price $1550. You can buy bundles that include a Rift and an Oculus ready PC for $1499[1]. The gear VR only works with very recent phones, and only works on all games without heat problems on the S7. S7's are generally quoted at $700, making the package price $800. Rough figures, I know, but yours are well out of whack. [1] http://www.techtimes.com/articles/134240/20160217/oculus-ready-pcs-and-rift-bundles-now-available-for-preorder-at-amazon-best-buy-and-microsoft-store.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/134240/20160217/oculus-rea...
  - nawitus 11y ago
    What game causes heat problems on the S6?
    - Sir_Substance 11y ago
      https://forums.oculus.com/community/discussion/27568/consumer-vr-s6-heat-issue https://forums.oculus.com/community/discussion/27568/consume... https://www.reddit.com/r/GearVR/comments/3vlsad/is_the_overheating_problem_that_widespread/ https://www.reddit.com/r/GearVR/comments/3vlsad/is_the_overh...
iainmerrick 11y ago
To give useful feedback, it's less important for a critic to "know" those things in advance than to actually try out the device (and its competitors) and tell us how it works out in practice.
- Sir_Substance 11y ago
  I disagree. If that's what I'm after, I could just ask two or three people who own one to render an opinion. It would take me less then a minute to have that thread up on reddit. The whole argument behind why websites like wsj are allegedly valuable and thus worth un-adblocking or paying 10c an article for or whatever is the trendy solution now is that they're supposed to be offering a higher standard of information than whatever reddit thinks. If the guy writing the article knows so little about the topic he cannot even make factually correct comparisons between similar but distinct products, I might as well stick to reddits opinion, no?
  - iainmerrick 11y ago
    Yeah, okay, you're right, domain knowledge is important. I still think a clear and insightful description of practical experience is more important, though. I don't see what's factually incorrect in this article. The author says that the tether is kind of a pain, and the fact that the Gear is tether-free makes it more compelling (even though it's weaker in other aspects). That's opinion -- useful opinion! The basic facts (tethered versus untethered) seem correct.

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jsprogrammer 11y ago

Can't you attach your phone to a computer and grid power with a USB cable?

Sir_Substance 11y ago
Off the top of my head I don't think you can with the gear vr (doesn't the USB port get taken up by the headset?), but even if you can, one of the authors key complaints leading into that statement was that the rift was not wireless. If you told him to wire up his gear vr, he wouldn't be impressed.
- kitcar 11y ago
  Correct, the interface between the phone and the headset is the charge port, but there is an additional port on the Gear VR itself to allow for charging while being used. The original Gear VR ("Innovator edition") could not be charged while used though if I remember correctly.
- jsprogrammer 11y ago
  The person I responded to was complaining that the rift alternative (a phone with appropriate lenses) had limited time usage due to relying on a battery. Most phones can run indefinitely by hooking them up to an external power source, obviating one of the poster's concerns. Additionally, you could augment the phone's processing power through a high-speed interconnect (like the USB cable that also supplies continuous power).
  - Retric 11y ago
    Phones get very warm when you charge them while playing 3D games. I doubt you would want to have that much heat with an enclosed headset for very long. Unless you can get a lot of ventilation without letting light in.
  - Sir_Substance 11y ago
    FYI the person you were responding to was me, and I wasn't complaining.
dreamcompiler 11y ago
The Gear VR has an extra USB port that you can connect to a charger which keeps the phone powered while in use. Or (more convenient) you can connect it to a self-contained brick battery you could wear on your waist.
zamalek 11y ago
I hacked up a quick head-tracking solution one weekend using my phone and WiFi. The problem was passive calibration. Accelerometers and gyroscopes are noisy and imperfect. Drift occurs and without the Occulus tracker or Vive lighthouses you are in for a frustrating experience. I own a DK2 and for many concrete reasons disagree with the author, it is not a novelty. Phone-based stuff is most certainly a novelty.

jqgatsby 11y ago

Comparison to Gear VR seems inappropriate, given the huge amount of effort Oculus the company has put into the partnership with Samsung.

ZoF 11y ago
How does that make comparison inappropriate?

soylentcola 11y ago

The difference between something like the Rift or the Vive and mobile-based stuff like Gear are huge when you get down to actually using it. Even discounting the differences between Rift and Vive regarding how they track motion, the Gear doesn't even have positional head tracking, just orientation. In use, this makes a huge difference if you're looking to put someone in a virtual environment. It's not even restricted to gaming applications. All of the software I've tried on my Rift dev unit and someone else's Gear made this abundantly clear to me. Not being able to lean forward/back/around things takes away a huge part of the "immersion" factor leaving you with more of a souped-up 3d screen. In terms of cost, for the Gear, don't you also need one of a few specific, expensive Samsung phones? I admit I haven't followed it as much lately so I don't know if they are selling something more affordable with the phone-stuff integrated or allowing the use of other phones. When I looked last, you needed a ~$700 phone plus the Gear. Not too big a price difference between $800 for phone+Gear and $1000 for a good video card+Rift. Personally, when I'm even considering something this expensive, new, and unnecessary, $800+ versus $1000 isn't a huge difference since I'm already spending a lot on something I don't really need. The other huge thing I've noticed is that all of the best new and in-development VR stuff just isn't gonna be something you can run on a phone or a Playstation. It's gonna be beta software (if you're lucky) and require a powerful, flexible platform like a computer. Down the line it will even out but right now, none of the really impressive stuff I've seen for VR will run on Gear and I doubt it will be in the Sony Playstation store anytime soon. That same console-level polish and ease comes with a flip-side: no access to anything that isn't seamless or marketable just yet.

angersock 11y ago
Speaking as somebody who is frustrated with the current dev story for AR and VR... ...maybe the specs wouldn't be so goddamn high if they actually let us do dev work against a lower-level interface. Forcing us to deal with massive frameworks like Unity and Unreal might well be the cause of spec creep. :( EDIT: And Meta can go eat a bag of rocks--no public docs on their API, and they seem to be wed to Unity...which can really screw up certain types of AR work they'd otherwise be perfect for. Oculus, at least, offered a native SDK for the brave and foolish.

MBCook 11y ago

I've been following VR for the last year or so. There is no question that the Rift has better specs and can do better graphics than the Gear. But I've read more than a few people in the VR space (game journalists, developers) say that there is something special about the Gear because there is no cable. There's nothing you have to keep conscious of so you don't trip over it or feel it on your back breaking immersion. The Gear VR could be enhanced with better tracking, and as new phones come out it will get better processing power. I think Fowler is right. VR is very new. Let's say your a consumer who wants to play with it. What's a better investment? $2200 in a PC and a Rift, or $100 that clips on your phone (assuming you're on Samsung)? If you just want to try it for now, play around a bit? The Gear is very compelling. (I'd love one, but I use an iPhone. I've got a PS VR on order though.)

Sir_Substance 11y ago
>$2200 in a PC and a Rift, or $100 that clips on your phone (assuming you're on Samsung)? Your figures are a little off. A rift is (all following figures in USD) $599, and a computer that will support it is generally quoted at $950, making it's package price $1550. You can buy bundles that include a Rift and an Oculus ready PC for $1499[1]. The gear VR only works with very recent phones, and only works on all games without heat problems on the S7. S7's are generally quoted at $700, making the package price $800. Rough figures, I know, but yours are well out of whack. [1] http://www.techtimes.com/articles/134240/20160217/oculus-ready-pcs-and-rift-bundles-now-available-for-preorder-at-amazon-best-buy-and-microsoft-store.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/134240/20160217/oculus-rea...
- nawitus 11y ago
  What game causes heat problems on the S6?
  - Sir_Substance 11y ago
    https://forums.oculus.com/community/discussion/27568/consumer-vr-s6-heat-issue https://forums.oculus.com/community/discussion/27568/consume... https://www.reddit.com/r/GearVR/comments/3vlsad/is_the_overheating_problem_that_widespread/ https://www.reddit.com/r/GearVR/comments/3vlsad/is_the_overh...

iainmerrick 11y ago

To give useful feedback, it's less important for a critic to "know" those things in advance than to actually try out the device (and its competitors) and tell us how it works out in practice.

Sir_Substance 11y ago
I disagree. If that's what I'm after, I could just ask two or three people who own one to render an opinion. It would take me less then a minute to have that thread up on reddit. The whole argument behind why websites like wsj are allegedly valuable and thus worth un-adblocking or paying 10c an article for or whatever is the trendy solution now is that they're supposed to be offering a higher standard of information than whatever reddit thinks. If the guy writing the article knows so little about the topic he cannot even make factually correct comparisons between similar but distinct products, I might as well stick to reddits opinion, no?
- iainmerrick 11y ago
  Yeah, okay, you're right, domain knowledge is important. I still think a clear and insightful description of practical experience is more important, though. I don't see what's factually incorrect in this article. The author says that the tether is kind of a pain, and the fact that the Gear is tether-free makes it more compelling (even though it's weaker in other aspects). That's opinion -- useful opinion! The basic facts (tethered versus untethered) seem correct.