8 ms·

> Maintainability is the feature of unreliable equipment. Not quite. The whole purpose of maintenance is to increase the longevity of a product by making small

by vecinu 11y ago

> Maintainability is the feature of unreliable equipment. Not quite. The whole purpose of maintenance is to increase the longevity of a product by making small, cheap, tweaks to complex parts that can fail due to wear and tear. Everything lasts longer if you maintain it. A good knife, a high performance vehicle, a good pair of shoes, a couch, etc ... I don't know of any product that is "as good as new" after years of use. Watches, even spoons, aren't as shiny as they were when you bought them for the first time. Maintenance is the work of the caring.

codehalo 11y ago
I think his point is that the goal is to make equipment that minimizes having to make "small, cheap, tweaks to complex parts that can fail due to wear and tear".
- hueving 11y ago
  That's not how it works though. Manufacturers realized they want to force you to buy again so they just made it unmaintainable with the same lifespan. iPhones are unmaintainable and they still become useless after 5 years or so.
  - schrodinger 11y ago
    5 years is a long time for a smart phone! And remember that a longer lifespan costs more money. I doubt many customers (myself included) would be willing to pay more money for an iPhone for it to last more than 5 years.
rubber_duck 11y ago
>Maintenance is the work of the caring Agreed - which is why building mass market convinience stuff that require it is a bad idea - I have limited hours in a day - I do not want to spend any of them doing chores such as maintenence - I'd rather just buy a new working thing every x years and not care. Paying someone else to do the maintenence is nice in theory but finding someone reliable who won't ripp you off is too much hassle.
- lallysingh 11y ago
  You know, there are reviews - on the internet - for mechanics and dealer service departments. And really, anyone able bodied can change oil.
  - npunt 11y ago
    In college I changed my oil and filters. It was a pain getting under a car a few inches off the ground, disposal was tricky, and I had to spend time cleaning up nasty gunk. I also could only do it when the car had not been driven recently. The fundamental problem with changing your oil is that it involves oil. I saved $30, at the cost of an hour of my labor. As soon as I had a job, that equation didn't make sense.
    - mswiss 11y ago
      I did the same thing on a late 90's 3 series throughout college. A pair of car jacks or rhino ramps makes the job way easier. Also if you take your oil to pep boys they'll dispose of it for free. Either way I'd still do it if I didn't live in a city. There's something nice about maintaining your things, it brings pride in ownership. I now have a much newer car (that I probably don't need since I don't need to drive to work and live in a city) and no garage so I pay for oil changes. On the college car I knew how everything fit together, I took everything apart to fix it multiple times, I changed/ upgraded/ retrofitted things in their to make it more enjoyable. On my new car I can't really do those things without more complicated tech. It definitely changes how you view the object. Both are fun "tools" but one was my fun tool the other isn't
    - runamok 11y ago
      Not even $30 as the cost of the filter and oil (not to mention tools and ideally things to make it safer like ramps or jackstands)...
Retric 11y ago
You don't maintain CPU's. 1,000,000,000+ parts and it just works.
- avn2109 11y ago
  But they do degrade over time (slowly).
  - marcosdumay 11y ago
    Yes, slowly. For almost everything I buy, I want it to last as long as possible without maintenance, instead of longer, but with regular maintenance. Expensive items are an exception - I want my car to last long, not to avoid maintaining it. But there is space for very few exceptions.
- heeen2 11y ago
  Except for when you have to update the microcode due to bugs that freeze your system under certain loads. Or when certain calculations are incorrect and you could NOT maintain it and the whole CPU range had to be recalled http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/intel-skylake-bug-causes-pcs-to-freeze-during-complex-workloads/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/intel-skylake-bug-cau... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug
- zerohp 11y ago
  CPUs don't have a billion parts. The unpackaged die is one carefully crafted solid.
  - Retric 11y ago
    Oceans have different parts and are far more homogeneous than CPU's. Further individual transistors can break making parts a meaningful distinction. PS: We call them silicon chips, but there are several tiny blobs of different chemicals involved. The process is closer to 3D printing than you might think.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

by vecinu 11y ago

codehalo 11y ago

I think his point is that the goal is to make equipment that minimizes having to make "small, cheap, tweaks to complex parts that can fail due to wear and tear".

hueving 11y ago
That's not how it works though. Manufacturers realized they want to force you to buy again so they just made it unmaintainable with the same lifespan. iPhones are unmaintainable and they still become useless after 5 years or so.
- schrodinger 11y ago
  5 years is a long time for a smart phone! And remember that a longer lifespan costs more money. I doubt many customers (myself included) would be willing to pay more money for an iPhone for it to last more than 5 years.

rubber_duck 11y ago

>Maintenance is the work of the caring Agreed - which is why building mass market convinience stuff that require it is a bad idea - I have limited hours in a day - I do not want to spend any of them doing chores such as maintenence - I'd rather just buy a new working thing every x years and not care. Paying someone else to do the maintenence is nice in theory but finding someone reliable who won't ripp you off is too much hassle.

lallysingh 11y ago
You know, there are reviews - on the internet - for mechanics and dealer service departments. And really, anyone able bodied can change oil.
- npunt 11y ago
  In college I changed my oil and filters. It was a pain getting under a car a few inches off the ground, disposal was tricky, and I had to spend time cleaning up nasty gunk. I also could only do it when the car had not been driven recently. The fundamental problem with changing your oil is that it involves oil. I saved $30, at the cost of an hour of my labor. As soon as I had a job, that equation didn't make sense.
  - mswiss 11y ago
    I did the same thing on a late 90's 3 series throughout college. A pair of car jacks or rhino ramps makes the job way easier. Also if you take your oil to pep boys they'll dispose of it for free. Either way I'd still do it if I didn't live in a city. There's something nice about maintaining your things, it brings pride in ownership. I now have a much newer car (that I probably don't need since I don't need to drive to work and live in a city) and no garage so I pay for oil changes. On the college car I knew how everything fit together, I took everything apart to fix it multiple times, I changed/ upgraded/ retrofitted things in their to make it more enjoyable. On my new car I can't really do those things without more complicated tech. It definitely changes how you view the object. Both are fun "tools" but one was my fun tool the other isn't
  - runamok 11y ago
    Not even $30 as the cost of the filter and oil (not to mention tools and ideally things to make it safer like ramps or jackstands)...

Retric 11y ago

You don't maintain CPU's. 1,000,000,000+ parts and it just works.

avn2109 11y ago
But they do degrade over time (slowly).
- marcosdumay 11y ago
  Yes, slowly. For almost everything I buy, I want it to last as long as possible without maintenance, instead of longer, but with regular maintenance. Expensive items are an exception - I want my car to last long, not to avoid maintaining it. But there is space for very few exceptions.
heeen2 11y ago
Except for when you have to update the microcode due to bugs that freeze your system under certain loads. Or when certain calculations are incorrect and you could NOT maintain it and the whole CPU range had to be recalled http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/intel-skylake-bug-causes-pcs-to-freeze-during-complex-workloads/ http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/intel-skylake-bug-cau... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentium_FDIV_bug
zerohp 11y ago
CPUs don't have a billion parts. The unpackaged die is one carefully crafted solid.
- Retric 11y ago
  Oceans have different parts and are far more homogeneous than CPU's. Further individual transistors can break making parts a meaningful distinction. PS: We call them silicon chips, but there are several tiny blobs of different chemicals involved. The process is closer to 3D printing than you might think.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]