8 ms·
Policy wise Obama is close to a Rockefeller Republican. What people say during elections is entirely disposable.
by api 11y ago
Policy wise Obama is close to a Rockefeller Republican. What people say during elections is entirely disposable.
- enraged_camel 11y agoI'm giving Bernie Sanders one last chance. But if he is elected and also reneges on his promises, I will probably stop caring about politics permanently. edit: Whoops! Shouldn't have revealed I'm a Bernie supporter. Forgot that HN is a libertarian paradise!
- pearle 11y agoI think people put too much importance on the role of the president with regards to domestic policy. You can't expect the president to effect change if congress opposes the president 100% of the time. Electing Bernie won't make a huge difference if the republicans still control congress.
- cgriswald 11y agoWoodrow Wilson sprang immediately to mind as an example of a president who effected change despite an intransigent congress. He is also a president who fought against entrenched interests. Your idea seems to be more of an observation of recent presidents than a property of the presidency itself. I think there are two things that make it so. First, modern presidents are generally picked from a very narrow pool of candidates which the parties and the media help select and shape, thus making sure a relatively docile candidate is chosen. Second, most modern presidents are very politically oriented and beholden to the groups that donated to them during their campaigns. I think that can be used to describe Hillary, but I think both Sanders and Trump are non-docile and not beholden to outside interests. Sanders, because his funds largely come as a mandate from individuals and he is very clear about who he works for. Trump, because he has nothing at all to lose by doing whatever he wants.
- Qwertious 11y agoThis is kind of sad, when I think about it - what you're describing is Trump and Sanders being opposed to Hillary and <Trump's opposition, I forget the name> in a way that matters just as much as Democrat VS Republican, but that decision is entirely up to the Dem/Rep oligarchy.
- rapind 11y agoPlus both Trump and Sanders bring in a lot of new voters. That may potentially scare the shit out of weaker members of congress... as it should.
- derefr 11y agoI've always wondered what would happen if a President gave a TV-broadcast speech, telling people to write to their congressmen and demand a change of their policy on some issue. Would that be illegal? Would it be speech? It's not like the President would be telling you who to vote for (though it might be different if the US had referendums, because the President would be telling you what to vote for); the President is simply attempting to sway your opinion, and then telling you to inform someone else of your (hopefully swayed) opinion.
- clevernickname 11y agoThis is exactly what I think Trump has in mind. First time congress doesn't do what he wants, he'll get on TV and list off every single congress critter that is getting in the way of Making America Great Again. They'll quickly fall in line or find themselves replaced in 2 years.
- ap22213 11y agoAnd, the alternative of Republicans controlling all three branches of government would be good how?
- pearle 11y agoI wasn't implying that republicans controlling all three branches of government would be good. In fact, it's rather horrifying considering the current state of that party. However, even if democrats won back the majority of congress -- are there enough left leaning democrats enough to support Bernie's platform?
- wfo 11y agoThe president has an enormous amount of power. The executive branch has been steadily expanding its power since the beginning of the country. Consider, for example, a Sanders DOJ vs. a Trump DOJ? (I suspect a Trump FBI would be primarily interested in cataloging and spying on anyone critical of Trump or of Muslim faith, essentially use COINTELPRO as a starting point, but make it better and stronger and do good deals). What about a Sanders DEA? EPA? DHS? The executive can do nearly anything if they are bold enough. The executive can ignore the judicial branch ("He has made his ruling, now let him enforce it"), the legislative branch (subpoenas from congress? About illegal leaks of classified information for political purposes concerning Valerie Plame? Please direct the law enforcement officers with weapons in your branch to serve them. You don't have any?) I believe Sanders would refrain from using executive power to make things worse, while I am certain all of the other candidates would not refrain. Hillary will not differ from Obama nor does she claim to. Trump's shtick is to be an American dictator, an executive strong man who advocates violence and abuse towards anyone who disagrees with him and acts as an outlet for racism and hate and anger. Imagine if he had an army of FBI, DHS, NSA agents at his beck and call.
- rayiner 11y agoIf Sander's doesn't reneg on his promises he'll be a one-term president (which of course assumes he gets elected which would never happen). I mean, think of how much people hate Carter.
- ap22213 11y agoBased on the title of the post alone, someone with even center to left politics should expect to get jumped on in the following discussion. It's a post that's trolling for conflict, not solutions.
- mikeash 11y agoForgot that HN is a libertarian paradise! It's funny, some threads you'd think everyone here was at least a socialist. Then in others you'd think everyone is one step short of declaring themselves sovereign citizens. I think the lizard people who run the site just flip a coin when each story is posted to decide which kind of comments it'll have.
- oldmanjay 11y agoYour comment is simply low quality. Threats of giving up are games for the immature to play
- mtgx 11y agoAnd once again we see what a bad idea it is for the US to only have two major political parties. If there was at least another major left-wing party, they could freely criticize Obama for acting more like a right-winger than a left-winger during his terms. But the "supposed left-wing" Democrats can't do that right now even if they wanted to, because that would hurt their chances with the Democrats, and Independents are irrelevant in this context, as if they want to vote left-wing, they'll have no choice but to go Democrat anyway - even though Independents make up almost 50% of the country and could easily support at least another 2 major parties if they all were a little more organized and didn't get brainwashed into voting the same Democratic or Republican parties that they hate (and the reason they registered Independents).
- dikdik 11y agoSanders will criticize Obama, one of the things I love about him. Especially compared to his opponent that wraps herself in Obama.
- theseatoms 11y ago> What people say during elections is entirely disposable. This is my hope re Trump.
- tajen 11y agoAnd Obama is the reason to vote for Trump: Obama is a demonstration that it doesn't matter who people vote for.
- MicroBerto 11y agoThe good news about Trump is that he's not bought or sold. He is what he is, which from my viewpoint is better than the unknown that we currently have.
- keehun 11y agoCould say the same about Bernie? Or would you disagree?
- MicroBerto 11y agoWould agree, but I'm not confident in his chances of defeating "the chosen one"...
- keehun 11y agoHow come? Polls & numbers (whatever value they have this early on in the "general" cycle) state otherwise. In fact, it looks like Bernie has a much better chance at the moment than Hilary... Don't you think Trump would dominate 24/7 news cycle on digging up Hilary's old wounds? What does he have on Bernie? "He's a communist you're voting for a communist!"?
- theseatoms 11y agoPersonally, I agree. He just has far lower odds in the general election.