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> There were a a few peculiar-seeming moves made by AlphaGo that the commentator found very atypical. Myungwan Kim 9-dan professional (comments on match #1): "

> There were a a few peculiar-seeming moves made by AlphaGo that the commentator found very atypical. Myungwan Kim 9-dan professional (comments on match #1): "She knows everything [...] Unthinkable move for human [...] AlphaGo plays like the god of go" https://youtu.be/6ZugVil2v4w?t=5054 https://youtu.be/6ZugVil2v4w?t=5054

imron 11y ago
I wonder how long before humans start learning from AlphaGo! I want to see AlphaGo vs AlphaGo :-)
- pavelrub 11y ago
  AlphaGo has already played millions of games against AlphaGo during the reinforcement learning stage.
  - ponyous 11y ago
    Is it possible to view games somewhere?
    - dcre 11y ago
      No, but they might release more info after these games.
- sidko 11y ago
  Seeing the way chess computers have evolved, this won't be far into the future. There are several tournaments just for chess computers, and it is very hard even for grandmasters to follow every more. Somehow, after a 20-move sequence that appears to accomplish nothing, one side is slightly up, and the rest of the game is decided.
  - Jach 11y ago
    There's been a big annual Go computer cup for a while now, it's been fun to read about: http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/index.html http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/index.html Of interest this year is Facebook's new bot is competing, which employs the same strategy as AlphaGo (Deep nets with MCTS), but from what I remember they've said (they've been a lot more open about its performance, you could even play a version on KGS, though I did really like AlphaGo's paper) it's quite a bit weaker. However I suspect it's also running on a lot less computer power, and that it will still be a while before you can get AlphaGo or better performance from a mere modest gaming rig let alone a standard laptop. One benefit of programs like AlphaGo eventually becoming available to individuals is that we'll see a rise in some incredibly strong young players that leave their ancestors in the dust, as I think has happened with Chess via Magnus. For the amount of training that can only be done by playing more and more games, being able to do that against a computer will be a lot more efficient.
  - tzs 11y ago
    > Seeing the way chess computers have evolved, this won't be far into the future. With chess, there were two breakthroughs. First, there was Deep Blue, which threw massive hardware resources at the problem and achieved world champion level play. That was interesting, of course, but didn't really do anything for human chess, because most humans did not have access to the necessary hardware. The second breakthrough was when the developers of chess programs that ran on commodity desktop computers improved their algorithms to the point that they could play at (and far beyond) Deep Blue's level even though they were only able to search about 1/100th as many positions per second. That was when humans started being able to really use computers to help the humans understand chess. The breakthroughs in chess algorithms on commodity computers had little, if anything, to do with the Deep Blue breakthrough. The two are just too different. Can AlphaGo be made available on hardware that top human Go players have access to, or is AlphaGo to Go as Deep Blue was to chess?
    - jacquesm 11y ago
      The fact that Lee Sedols hardware is a couple of pounds of wetware running on a peanut butter sandwich suggests the answer to your question is yes. Whether those insights will come soon or not is the big question.
- eru 11y ago
  Fan Hui has already learned from AlphaGo. He's been playing matches against her regularly, and (perhaps as a result of that) won _all_ his games in the last European championship.
  - hasenj 11y ago
    Interesting. Mind if I ask for a source? Where did you read this?
    - eru 11y ago
      Heard it. Internal tech talk at Google. (Though I don't think it's a secret. If yes, I just leaked inadvertently.)
      - tux1968 11y ago
        You're off the hook.. it was already public ;o) https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881 https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881
    - tux1968 11y ago
      It was mentioned in a recent talk. Here's a link to a few seconds before that comment was made... https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881 https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881
      - hasenj 11y ago
        Thanks for the link!
    - kozlovsky 11y ago
      You can see tournament results here: http://senseis.xmp.net/?EuropeanProfessionalGoChampionship http://senseis.xmp.net/?EuropeanProfessionalGoChampionship
  - taneq 11y ago
    I find it interesting that people are using gendered pronouns for AlphaGo. Getting some definite Turing-test vibes here.

imron 11y ago

I wonder how long before humans start learning from AlphaGo! I want to see AlphaGo vs AlphaGo :-)

pavelrub 11y ago
AlphaGo has already played millions of games against AlphaGo during the reinforcement learning stage.
- ponyous 11y ago
  Is it possible to view games somewhere?
  - dcre 11y ago
    No, but they might release more info after these games.
sidko 11y ago
Seeing the way chess computers have evolved, this won't be far into the future. There are several tournaments just for chess computers, and it is very hard even for grandmasters to follow every more. Somehow, after a 20-move sequence that appears to accomplish nothing, one side is slightly up, and the rest of the game is decided.
- Jach 11y ago
  There's been a big annual Go computer cup for a while now, it's been fun to read about: http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/index.html http://jsb.cs.uec.ac.jp/~igo/eng/index.html Of interest this year is Facebook's new bot is competing, which employs the same strategy as AlphaGo (Deep nets with MCTS), but from what I remember they've said (they've been a lot more open about its performance, you could even play a version on KGS, though I did really like AlphaGo's paper) it's quite a bit weaker. However I suspect it's also running on a lot less computer power, and that it will still be a while before you can get AlphaGo or better performance from a mere modest gaming rig let alone a standard laptop. One benefit of programs like AlphaGo eventually becoming available to individuals is that we'll see a rise in some incredibly strong young players that leave their ancestors in the dust, as I think has happened with Chess via Magnus. For the amount of training that can only be done by playing more and more games, being able to do that against a computer will be a lot more efficient.
- tzs 11y ago
  > Seeing the way chess computers have evolved, this won't be far into the future. With chess, there were two breakthroughs. First, there was Deep Blue, which threw massive hardware resources at the problem and achieved world champion level play. That was interesting, of course, but didn't really do anything for human chess, because most humans did not have access to the necessary hardware. The second breakthrough was when the developers of chess programs that ran on commodity desktop computers improved their algorithms to the point that they could play at (and far beyond) Deep Blue's level even though they were only able to search about 1/100th as many positions per second. That was when humans started being able to really use computers to help the humans understand chess. The breakthroughs in chess algorithms on commodity computers had little, if anything, to do with the Deep Blue breakthrough. The two are just too different. Can AlphaGo be made available on hardware that top human Go players have access to, or is AlphaGo to Go as Deep Blue was to chess?
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    The fact that Lee Sedols hardware is a couple of pounds of wetware running on a peanut butter sandwich suggests the answer to your question is yes. Whether those insights will come soon or not is the big question.
eru 11y ago
Fan Hui has already learned from AlphaGo. He's been playing matches against her regularly, and (perhaps as a result of that) won _all_ his games in the last European championship.
- hasenj 11y ago
  Interesting. Mind if I ask for a source? Where did you read this?
  - eru 11y ago
    Heard it. Internal tech talk at Google. (Though I don't think it's a secret. If yes, I just leaked inadvertently.)
    - tux1968 11y ago
      You're off the hook.. it was already public ;o) https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881 https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881
  - tux1968 11y ago
    It was mentioned in a recent talk. Here's a link to a few seconds before that comment was made... https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881 https://youtu.be/4fjmnOQuqao?t=2881
    - hasenj 11y ago
      Thanks for the link!
  - kozlovsky 11y ago
    You can see tournament results here: http://senseis.xmp.net/?EuropeanProfessionalGoChampionship http://senseis.xmp.net/?EuropeanProfessionalGoChampionship
- taneq 11y ago
  I find it interesting that people are using gendered pronouns for AlphaGo. Getting some definite Turing-test vibes here.