20 ms·

Windows Now Showing Full-Screen Ads

599 points by tasoeur 11y ago

leeleelee 11y ago
I seem to remember some recent articles about MSFT which detailed how they had really turned things around. They've been missing the boat for years, and finally got their act together. They had a really aggressive goal for getting windows 10 on XYZ millions of devices by June or July this year. And now....this?! This does not fit Satya Nadella's recent narrative. Why would MSFT do this?
MajesticHobo 11y ago
Direct link to HTG guide: http://www.howtogeek.com/243263/how-to-disable-ads-on-your-windows-10-lock-screen/ http://www.howtogeek.com/243263/how-to-disable-ads-on-your-w...
- dang 11y ago
  We changed the URL to that from https://mobile.twitter.com/howtogeek/status/702275153439416322 https://mobile.twitter.com/howtogeek/status/7022751534394163..., which points to it. If someone suggests a better URL for this story, we can change it again.
  - zamalek 11y ago
    Maybe change the title, too? It's absurdly inaccurate, just look at how all the comments here are completely unrepresentative of what is stipulated in the article, everyone has read only the title and assumes: * Ads are popping up on the desktop ("full-screen"). Which they are not - it is restricted to the lock screen. Neither the tweet nor the article mentions "full-screen" once. * You can't opt-out of this process. The central point of the entire article is how to opt-out. * This is new. I personally opted out of this feature a while back. Possibly something like: "Windows is Showing Lock-Screen Ads (How to Opt-Out)". As per the guidelines: > Otherwise please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait. This post not only fails to adhere to the guidelines, it does the exact opposite by changing the meaning of the article entirely. It should actually be deleted and I have flagged it due to such a blatant disregard for the guidelines.
ArbitraryHobo 11y ago
Has Microsoft gone too far?
- melling 11y ago
  9 out of 10 PC's still run Windows so I guess not.
  - sp332 11y ago
    The PC market is shrinking quickly, so maybe they have.
    - forgetsusername 11y ago
      >The PC market is shrinking quickly There were 275 million PC units sold in 2015, and approximately the same number is expected for 2016. Sales were growing until 2011, when they peaked at around 360 million units. So certainly sales have shrunk, but I wouldn't describe them as "shrinking quickly", according to forecasts.
      - sp332 11y ago
        Shipments were down in 2015 even if you include Apple computers, which outperformed the rest. https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS40909316 https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS40909316 Things look even worse when you take them out. Which forecasts are you using?
        scholia 11y ago
        IDC PC numbers are depressed partly because it doesn't count tablets/2-in-1s as PCs, it counts them as tablets. The story to which you link notes that "The impact for 2016 will be larger as detachable tablet volume grows, boosting earlier forecasts of PC growth in 2016 from -3.1% to growth of 1 to 2%." The quote is saying that if you add those "tablets" back, it's predicting that the PC market will grow this year. Another important point is that the vast majority of Windows 7/8/8.1 PCs will run Windows 10, and the upgrade is free. There's very little need for most users to buy a new PC. If users only buy a new PC every six years, then Windows PC sales should halve, compared with a three-year upgrade cycle. It doesn't mean that PC usage is declining (though it might be), it just means that PCs are lasting twice as long. Smartphone sales were, of course, hugely inflated by the fact that they only lasted for 18 months or so. When people keep their smartphones for three years, smartphone sales with halve as well.
kagia 11y ago
If only it were April fools...
djsumdog 11y ago
I really don't like this direction that MS is heading. I'd rather they charger for Windows 10 and newer and not start bundling software and pushing ads by default. Also, fuck buying games off the Windows store, Steam and any other service that locks you into DRM. My steam client in Linux is hopelessly broken due to updates. Some of my games will still play, but most require the stupid Steam DRM layer. I should have bought them off Humble instead.
- bduerst 11y ago
  GoG is pretty great [1]. Their games are DRM-free and their windows client is super clean - I only wish they would hurry up and release for Linux. https://www.gog.com/galaxy https://www.gog.com/galaxy
  - sevensor 11y ago
    Many of their older games work great under Wine / DOSBox.
    - bduerst 11y ago
      Definitely. I was talking about their galaxy client.
      - gnud 11y ago
        Really? The best thing about GOG for me is that I don't have to install yet another crappy client.
        bduerst 11y ago
        I actually prefer the client, but gog works just as fine without it. To each their own.
- cm2187 11y ago
  Or at least give a paid option for no user monetization and monitoring.
gargravarr 11y ago
Seems like the only way people want to make money these days is through invasive advertising without the end-user's explicit consent. Granted the expectation of free software is driving most of this, but it starts a vicious cycle because those who get annoyed with them develop countermeasures, which the creator responds to with more aggressive ads, ad infinitum. It does start explaining some of the highly controversial telemetry MS was collecting in Win10 - turning everyone's PCs into billboards.
- cm2187 11y ago
  Except windows isn't free. Even users who upgraded for free initially paid for a windows license (at least outside of China).
  - gargravarr 11y ago
    Paying for the privilege of seeing adverts. So fundamentally MS. I'm so glad Win7 will be supported until 2020.
    - ArbitraryHobo 11y ago
      Too bad about Intel dropping support for Skylake and newer CPUs on Windows 7.
      - cm2187 11y ago
        you mean Microsoft dropping support for Skylake
        jfuhrman 11y ago
        Can't drop something that doesn't exist.
        wongarsu 11y ago
        You can drop something that doesn't exist but was announced. Thechnically Skylake support for Win7 wasn't announced, but the effect is the same since there was an implicit expectation that the feature would come.
gravypod 11y ago
"When the item is free, you are the product" is the lesson of this past decade. I am at least repeatedly learning this over and over again.
- Zikes 11y ago
  That doesn't necessarily hold true for FOSS, though.
  - gravypod 11y ago
    FOSS isn't free. You are being "paid for" by other people donating their time to make many, many people happy. That's at least my way of looking at it.
    - the_af 11y ago
      But the user is not the product in the case of FOSS. No-one is taking advantage of you as is the case when you, the user, are marketed to advertisers.
  - DrJokepu 11y ago
    Oh man, it's absolutely true for FOSS, unless you develop FOSS purely because of idealogical reasons, Richard Stallman-style. FOSS development can be turned into reputation and popularity, which can be turned into cash. It's much easier to get your startup off the ground (or find a good job or decent clients as a contractor, etc.) if you have 10,000 Twitter followers, because you write popular FOSS.
    - embik 11y ago
      Which is exactly how FOSS is supposed to work. You give away something free of charge and available to everyone and you're getting something back from your users. That doesn't make the software's user "the product" though. In your case the developer is making himself the product he tries to sell, not the users. This is really not comparable to advertisement and data collection.
s_kilk 11y ago
Not surprised. Some of us have been predicting this for years, but we tended to get shouted down for committing the Slippery Slope fallacy.
- gargravarr 11y ago
  Least we get to point and say 'told you so', right? :)
- mhurron 11y ago
  > Some of us have been predicting this for years Ever since Ubuntu did it.
  - jasonlotito 11y ago
    Apple does it right now.
- exodust 11y ago
  Predicting what exactly? 1. New spotlight feature = on; 2. Toggle "fun facts and more" = on; You know that images will stream in from the internet along with "fun facts and more" whatever that is. And when a Tomb Raider image appears, you're suddenly in Orwellian future shock mode? The day MS takes away the toggle so you can't switch ads off, is the day to be outraged. Not before.
  - CamperBob2 11y ago
    The day MS takes away the toggle so you can't switch ads off, is the day to be outraged. Not before. GWX certainly qualifies as an "ad." Just curious, where is the "toggle switch" in the "settings" that I can turn "off" to disable GWX? Oh, there isn't one? I thought so.
    - exodust 11y ago
      Okay... that would annoy me too. I'm still on Windows 7 and haven't seen anything like that. Not one Windows 10 ad, and I've been doing Windows updates (manual ones from time to time). On both my laptop and desktop - Win 7 and Win 8, I have yet to see any GWX ad. Maybe I will see it one day.
ccvannorman 11y ago
I still remember the last time I used Windows (outside of a VM for testing.) I had been given a Surface to develop on for my video game. At one point, it started playing an advertisement as a part of the operating experience. My reaction: 1. What is happening? 2. Why is this happening? 3. How do I shut this off? 4. Who the hell decided this was a good idea? 5. Where's the nearest trash bin?
CurtHagenlocher 11y ago
I didn't even realize that it was an advertisement. But if it is, it's not the first one. The Beatles images shown in December were then probably also technically ads for the just-released-on-streaming Beatles catalog. Disclosures: I work at Microsoft and really don't like advertising-supported products.
toxican 11y ago
Kind of complete bullshit to do that, but at the same time it's very easy to disable via settings. It's not as though you have to tinker with the register or modify your hosts file or whatever else.
- exodust 11y ago
  On the other hand, it's a static Tomb Raider image on your lock screen. I'd prefer that to say an "arty" photo of a new father holding his newborn baby to his bare chest in the morning sun or something... That would fill me with rage. Tomb Raider image, not so bad.
AdmiralAsshat 11y ago
Probably a good time to remind people about ReactOS: https://www.reactos.org/project-news/reactos-040-released https://www.reactos.org/project-news/reactos-040-released One day it may be the only way to use Windows programs without this kind of end-user harassment.
- simoncion 11y ago
  > One day [ReactOS] may be the only way to use Windows programs without this kind of end-user harassment. There's a lot of code sharing between ReactOS and Wine. For the most part, Wine works really well to run Windows software... there's no need to run an entire somewhat-Windows-compatible OS that has limited hardware compatibility when you're just interested in running a particular Windows application. [0] However, I expect that you neither meant to imply that Wine wasn't a good option for running Windows software, nor that work on Wine was likely to stop before work on ReactOS stopped. :) [0] Edit: To be clear, I'm quite aware that the task that the ReactOS devs face is monumental. I also acknowledge that those devs have put in a lot of good work over the past ~eighteen years.
acre88 11y ago
Aren't plentiful, unrequested ads for games an integral part of Microsoft's XBox systems? I don't remember hearing too much outrage about those. Is that a different situation somehow?
- ohitsdom 11y ago
  Great point. I've always had an issue with those ads on the home screen. One ad that stands out in my memory was a particularly gruesome looking game ad, something about zombies. I thought it was way too dark for the little kids in my house to be seeing, but had no way to turn it off.
nikbackm 11y ago
That particular example does not seem too bad. I personally would have just assumed the ad to be yet another random lock screen image. Which I like for the most part.
- Negitivefrags 11y ago
  Thank you for being the only one in this thread not in an unreasonable panic. It's a very attractive piece of high quality concept art. It doesn't even have a logo. Is it for a game that they sell? Yes. But come on. This is one of the least invasive advertisements I've ever seen.
- Coincoin 11y ago
  Yeah, by the author's standard, any nice picture would be an ad for the photographer. Pretty picture of a New Zeeland countryside? Ad for NZ tourism office. Pretty picture of a data center chockfull of network equipment and mainframes? Ad for IBM and Cisco. Microsoft have been doing that since Bing, show a pretty interesting picture with a little icon to know where that picture is from. It just happens that one is from a game. People are so tired of obnoxious and disgusting ads that they tend to forget why they hate obnoxious and disgusting ads; because they are obnoxious and disgusting. Then they go on an irrational crusade about every picture, awesome viral video, mystery public campaign just because it originates from a corporation.
- niftich 11y ago
  This is about as tasteful as they could've gotten and I applaud them for their choice. It's visually appealing concept art showing a cool setting, and it's completely devoid of logos and obtrusive indicators of brand. It doesn't say "TOMB RAIDER" in the corner. There is a call-to-action, but it's absolutely tiny, and takes you to their Store app, not some sketchy website. This is product placement at it's best, really. It's subtle, attention-catching on its artistic merits, and stays out of your way if you're uninterested. I'll even go as far as suggest that this is exactly the kind of advertising I'd prefer, if we must have advertising (that point can be debated).
bendykstra 11y ago
I was shocked and very worried when ads for Microsoft Office started popping up in the Action Center (10's centralized notification area) last year. When I wrote about my concerns on a Windows forum, most pf the responses were along the lines of, "why are you complaining, Windows 10 is free." If people no longer feel that they own their operating systems, then there is no check on Microsoft's behavior. Inevitably, ads will become personalized and telemetry that Microsoft now uses to improve the operating system will be used to improve ads. The challenges to privacy that we currently experience online will expand to the desktop.
- RealCasually 11y ago
  What is the harm done? Of course you don't "own" your operating system. You also paid nothing for it. I also struggle to grasp the double standard of why Google, Facebook, et al are able to endlessly track and personalize ads, but when Microsoft follows a similar model, there is outrage.
  - gargravarr 11y ago
    The argument that Win10 is free won't hold for much longer, it's only 'free' if you upgrade from Win7 or 8. It's already being sold retail in stores for a similar price to the old versions. And from later this year, people will have to pay for upgrades too. On the flipside, you don't "own" your software anyway, you own a license to use it (EULA). The double-standard probably has something to do with the ability to block most of Google's ads and tracking, or use another search platform if you really want. This is the OS on top of which you'll be using all of your other software (web platforms included), and it's impossible to control what is going on in the background.
    - seanp2k2 11y ago
      While I agree with the difference, it should still be possible to block these types of ads with some kind of firewall. Unless the OS is blocking the blocking at a lower level (which I'd be VERY surprised by), something like Privoxy and using that as the system proxy for http[s] should be able to knock these out if they're loaded dynamically. I haven't tested this, so it would require some inspection and network monitoring to figure out what's serving these. Some hosts file entries may even be enough.
deleted 11y ago
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draw_down 11y ago
Wow! This is really just unbelievable to me.
- exodust 11y ago
  Yep, it is quite a spectacular Tomb Raider image.
throwaway21816 11y ago
Anyone who links m.wikipedia or mobile.twitter should be hung by their thumbs from a tall building
- dang 11y ago
  Please stop posting unsubstantive comments to HN.
aresant 11y ago
It's so funny to watch MSFT completely miss the lessons that have turned Google into the World's Most Valuable Advertising Business. HEY YOU GUYS LETS PLASTER ADVERTISING ALL OVER ALL OF THE THINGS! Look at Gmail: http://imgur.com/M8RF1TV http://imgur.com/M8RF1TV Look at Yahoo Mail: http://imgur.com/Cjwxspc http://imgur.com/Cjwxspc Look at AOL Mail: http://imgur.com/ZeaIe1L http://imgur.com/ZeaIe1L Which email product do you use? Which would you rather use? The advertising business that is sustainable is owning the user at a moment of high-intent, aka SEARCH. Slapping ads all over my login page is a great way render the fat from brand advertisers into short-term revenue gains at the price of ENRAGING me. MSFT get the tracking and the ads the fuck out of my kitchen and my OS or at least give me a REAL way to pay you for a clean, no ad version!
- vlunkr 11y ago
  Personally I wouldn't be willing to pay for an ad-free version of an OS that you are already paying for.
  - the_hangman 11y ago
    What? Who paid for Windows 10? I thought Windows 10 is supposed to be free?
    - bad_user 11y ago
      I hope this is snark.
    - ebbv 11y ago
      It's only free to upgrade to it. If you buy/build a new PC you have to pay $100 (or more) for the privilege of being shown ads on your login page.
    - wongarsu 11y ago
      There's no way to get Windows 10 for free. Either you pay for an old version of Windows and upgrade or you buy Windows 10.
- 11y ago
sj4nz 11y ago
As always, the future moves closer and closer to Black Mirror's S01E02.
jksmith 11y ago
Does ReactOS plan to copy this business model?
pearle 11y ago
I think I'm finally going back to Windows 7. I'd rather pay full price for a OS release than become a product. Of course, another issue is that the Windows Store is completely broken on my computer and quite a few apps no longer work (including Windows Calculator, Photos, etc.).
- exodust 11y ago
  Or just turn off the spotlight thing in settings.
  - JabavuAdams 11y ago
    This is not how you design good products and tools. If I grab my drill, it's because I want to make a hole. I don't want to click through even one annoyance. Also, in the real world, it's one annoyance today, but it'll be five tomorrow if people don't push back. Computers are annoying because apologists keep saying things like "just turn that off".
    - exodust 11y ago
      I don't disagree with your general point. But we have here a relatively new image showcase feature called "spotlight". I'm not really seeing the deception or poor design if you chose to enable this new feature in the first place. Edit - I've just found out Spotlight is enabled by default. I don't have Windows 10, didn't know.
jfoster 11y ago
Seems like the "new Microsoft" honeymoon period has been brought to an abrupt end. Did every single Windows 7 user get this? Perhaps they can recover from this by learning quickly from the backlash that's about to happen.
- exodust 11y ago
  Backlash from needing to go into settings and flick a toggle switch from on to off? Oh the horror!
  - dontblink 11y ago
    But why do I even have to do this? I paid for an OS. Not for new annoyances.
  - pkorzeniewski 11y ago
    You could say the same about installers bundled with some crapware toolbars installed by default - you just need to uncheck one checkbox! It's not about how much effort it requires to turn such bullshit off, to me it's a clear message from the company that you're just a sucker to be milked as hard as possible. "Oh, you've turned it off? No problem, we'll be more clever next time!" I refuse to use anything coming from such companies, even if it means more effort in everyday life.
  - jfoster 11y ago
    Whether it's justified or not is nearly beside the point. Will backlash happen from this? If it hits the login screen of every Windows 7 user, it'll almost certainly be in mainstream press within the next couple of days. It won't last, of course. That's why I think Microsoft will have an opportunity to learn from it.
  - vacri 11y ago
    There was backlash against iTunes 'helpfully' giving you a crappy U2 album. Traditionally, advertising is something you see when you 'go on the internet'. It doesn't usually appear before you even log onto the machine.
  - 11y ago
dethos 11y ago
This is the price for the "free" upgrade to windows 10. I really don't like this trend of turning your personal computer into a thin client, where its properties can be manipulated remotely by the vendor like if it was a web app. This is why I stayed away of products like Windows 10 and ChromeOS.
- shahidhussain 11y ago
  Why Chrome OS?
  - dethos 11y ago
    > ... turning your personal computer into a thin client ... Because, ChromeOS seems to be mostly about web apps, thus can suffer from the same issue that this post describes, for example.
dangrossman 11y ago
Microsoft added the Spotlight feature last year, and this is pretty much exactly what it was billed as: if you don't have a lock screen image of your own, you get random wallpaper images from Bing, and also occasional app offers and tips. You can upvote/downvote the offers to personalize the suggestions in the future. It's an app discovery mechanism, and you can turn it off by picking your own lock screen image. I don't know why it's only in the news now. This isn't the first time wallpapers for an app have been in the rotation.
- BinaryIdiot 11y ago
  I'm fine with jumping aboard the hate train for things like the Office ads but this seems like a pretty non-issue and I agree with you. Just like the Google Play widget or notifications for the App Store on iOS; Windows is doing the same-thing but with a lock screen background. I'm not sure if this is a default (I thought it wasn't; it certainly wasn't when I bought a Surface a couple of weeks ago). If this is a default then I think that should be changed but beyond that? Not a big deal. Let's focus on other Windows 10 issues that should be addressed versus this.
  - GhotiFish 11y ago
    I look at it as a part of a larger arc of issues. Windows is going fremium. I feel like advertisements as a direct component of an operating system have crossed a line. This is like when Ubuntu started advertising amazon products in their launch bar. It crossed a line.
    - arm 11y ago
      Yeah, and the worst part is, Windows 10 actually does¹ cost money. And the people who pay for it still get to see ads. It seems like the only sure way to avoid all this tracking crap in Windows 10 is to pony up for the Enterprise version (which is basically impossible if you’re not a business). ―――――― ¹ — http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=windows+10&SiteID=msca&Locale=en_CA&Action=DisplayProductSearchResultsPage&result=&sortby=score%20descending&filters=undefined http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=windows+10&Site...
slavik81 11y ago
I'm more annoyed that they pop up desktop notifications just to advertise Office 365.
- r3bl 11y ago
  The irony here is that you still see those ads even if you have a running Office 365 subscription associated with the same Microsoft account you've used to create your Windows account.
fpgaminer 11y ago
With Windows 10 doing things like this, and Windows 7 being aggressively deprecated, I decided I finally wanted to ditch Windows as my daily driver. It was good timing, then, that I watched the "7 Gamers 1 CPU" video from LinuxTechTips, which showed me how to do it without sacrificing gaming. Most everything I use runs in Linux, and for the few things that don't I can spin up a VM. But there's the caveat that is as old as Windows itself ... gaming. Dual booting isn't an option for me, because I tend to run various server VMs 24/7. I also didn't want a second tower just for Windows; that's non-ideal. But wait! Apparently modern CPUs have this fancy thing called IOMMU I never knew about, which lets you give direct access to PCI-E devices, like GPUs, to a VM. So I bought up a 5820K, a X99 motherboard, and an extra graphics card, and away I went. I now have Arch Linux running as the host system where I do all my work. Windows 10 sits in a VM where it's given direct and exclusive access to a GTX 970 for graphics. So far, things are working well and Windows runs the benchmark apps just fine. The end result is that I can use Linux as my daily driver, but flip over to my Windows VM whenever I want to game. It keeps Windows isolated, which is great from a privacy/security perspective, I don't have to dual-boot, and best of all I can spin up different VMs if I want to use the beastly GTX 970 for other work like machine learning. Thanks to using the 5820K which has a few Xeon features in it, the entire process when smoothly. The biggest caveat is I haven't found a DisplayPort switch yet, so I can't hook up the Windows VM to my primary Cinema monitor, and I haven't nailed down the mouse+keyboard thing yet. QEMU's virtual mouse+keyboard doesn't normally work with these kinds of VMs, so you have to hack it in, and even then it likes to randomly stop working. I could just grab a second set of physical mouse+keyboard but that's not ideal. Steam Steaming will probably be the best option for now.
- hatsix 11y ago
  Is there a write-up on this that you can recommend?
  - zymhan 11y ago
    The Arch docs are super helpful on this, even if you're not running Arch: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF#vfio-pci https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVM...
imgabe 11y ago
I've been using Windows 10 for a while now at work and I haven't seen any ads yet. I was really enjoying the different pictures on the lock screen and the way you can like/dislike them to get more of the types of pictures you like. If they start running ads on it and I have to disable it that's going to be pretty sad. I mean, not really in the grand scheme of things, but it was a pleasant, enjoyable feature that made me like Windows. Why ruin it with ads?
fiatjaf 11y ago
It's funny to read all those irritating comments: "oh, my OS is showing me ads", people complaining after they got a pirate OS without paying for it.
- arm 11y ago
  Are you joking? Windows 10 actually does cost money. And the people who pay for it still get to see ads.
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butz 11y ago
They should add bitcoin miner next. That way they will make even more money.
mariusmg 11y ago
What the fuck ? You choose to let Microsoft show you whatever they want on the login screen and complain their show you an ad ? Seriously ? Disable the spotlight crap and be on your merry way. Or install Ubuntu and watch Amazon ads :D
- nacs 11y ago
  Ubuntu has removed the Amazon ads with newer versions.
Animats 11y ago
Can you buy an single enterprise version of Windows 10 without the ads and the snooping ("telemetry")? How much does it cost? How do you buy it? Microsoft makes this info very hard to find.[1] [1] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-for-enterprise https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-f...
- zamalek 11y ago
  As far as I know the W10 machine needs to be also joined to an AD domain for this to work (the telemetry is disabled via a group policy on the DC).
proactivesvcs 11y ago
Malware straight to the lock screen now? Wow. This behaviour just goes to show the advertising industry still has no idea about real-world concerns and opinions on advertising. I wonder how long it'll take for this to start getting farmed out to malware brokers/bidding platforms that Microsoft's MSN uses, such as AppNexus, AdSpirit etc.
- gargravarr 11y ago
  This is not specifically malware, just a blatant ad, but I expect it's only a matter of time before someone exploits it. Upload a booby-trapped image, let Bing categorise it and let the bombs start falling...
- recursive 11y ago
  In your opinion, what is malware?
  - proactivesvcs 11y ago
    Microsoft's advertising. Specifically, those they choose to do business with allowing exploit kits to deliver malware payload, such as cryptolocker-style viruses.
    - recursive 11y ago
      So you're assuming that the channel this tomb raider wallpaper came through is able to transmit a virus? Or do you have knowledge that it's true?
      - proactivesvcs 11y ago
        I know that Microsoft are not to be trusted with advertisements, and this is advertising. Who knows what executable code, like javascript, fonts or GDI+ objects, are involved with the wallpaper? If not today, what about tomorrow?
guardian5x 11y ago
I don't like the direction they are going. What's next? Sending a U2 Album on the PCs?
yuhong 11y ago
I have suggested before that MS should sell Windows to a non-profit foundation. It is probably not trivial though.
brudgers 11y ago
Ubuntu baked Amazon products into Unity several years ago. Google bakes....well, where do I start? Anyway, this is the Microsoft everyone was screaming for...more just like everyone else. At least Facebook doesn't inject ads into information about my friends...[puts finger to ear ala Jon Stewart]...what's that?
solnyshok 11y ago
I just disabled Windows Lockscreen (not to be confused with Login Screen) right after installation.
gdulli 11y ago
Kind of an alarmist headline for what's essentially a screen saver type thing that's set as the default but can be changed to something else.
ck2 11y ago
For those that want to make sure you never are forced upgraded to Windows 10 http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/ http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/ GWX Control Panel - blocks Windows 7/8 from ever installing W10
wangchow 11y ago
It's easy enough to disable the adds. Also check the Microsoft account and there are various preferences with toggle buttons associated with "targeted ads." To be honest, some people like having targeted ads if it's something consumers may be interested in.. Why not inform them? And for those who don't like them.. Just go through those settings and change them. As long as these ads are configurable it's not a big deal. That being said, if they became something customers can not opt out of that is a different story.
alistproducer2 11y ago
I will run Windows 7 as long as I can. When it goes the way of XP, I'll go back to Linux.
gosukiwi 11y ago
If only gaming on Linux would be as easy as it is on Windows...
ape4 11y ago
That's terrible. How long until its not an option.
jlhim 11y ago
nice click bait title.
- jlhim 11y ago
  lol @ down voting because you don't like what i say. who is this dang? he seems to like to do that. the title is not honest.
JabavuAdams 11y ago
This is so anti-user it boggles the mind.
UK-AL 11y ago
Heh, I didn't know windows had this feature. I just turned it on.
pasbesoin 11y ago
Recently, I bought one of the cheapo Amazon tablets to have a "beater" I didn't need to worry about. Sure, the price was nice. But the full-page ad upon every lock screen, that is too easy to trigger into video play when trying to swipe to unlock, has rather put me off. I won't be buying another Amazon tablet. And I'm glad I never got one of their phones -- I shudder to think. It's my computer / tablet / phone / computing device. The more you work to make and demonstrate otherwise, the more I'm going to move away from you. I just hope I keep having a choice. And I have to consider my individual role in making sure that is the case.
aikah 11y ago
They are beating Google at their own game. I wouldn't be surprised if Google announced a real desktop OS, since they basically pulled the plug on Chrome OS and Android isn't even fit for Tablet. Microsoft is basically trying to outgoogle Google, and they are trying to do that at the OS level, not at the browser level. From a purely strategic standpoint this is brillant. From a user stand point it's obnoxious of course, because good luck blocking ads if Microsoft decides Windows won't allow you to. Clearly web advertising is drying up, so Native ads,i.e. at the OS level is where the growth is. EDIT: correction
- Mithaldu 11y ago
  > I wouldn't be surprised if Google announced a real desktop OS It has taken MS almost all it has to get Windows to the point where it currently is, while the best thing Google can claim is to have made a browser using someone else's engine, while skipping 90% of the features that other browsers have. This works for the web, but on the OS front they cannot compete.
  - akoumis 11y ago
    Sorry which features is it lacking in? https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chromemobile-44/firefox-40/ie-Edge%2013/safari-9.0.html https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chromemobile-44/firefo...
    - Mithaldu 11y ago
      User interface customizability. It has almost none whatsoever. The rendering engine and what it supports doesn't matter, since Webkit wasn't made by Google.
cmdrfred 11y ago
I don't have any data to back this up but it really feels more and more like the fabled "Year of Linux" to me. Microsoft last it's way when Gates left and hardware manufacturers are starting to get on board.
finishingmove 11y ago
Well, this is exactly what I would expect if I left any "Give me something random, I don't want to think too much" option activated. These are the first things I disable on any OS. With that said, I recently switched my home PC to Linux. It was not due to the privacy issues, rather buggy experience (probably due to older hardware). Overall happy, although the UX in KDE 4 and Gnome 3.1x is still lagging behind Windows/OS X noticeably IMHO.
- anonbanker 11y ago
  Then switch to a distro using KDE Plasma 5.5, and be _ahead_ of Windows' UX.
makecheck 11y ago
When I was a kid and learning basic manners, there were certain things taught that separated good from bad. And you know, advertising methods are starting to look a lot like pure rudeness to me. It wouldn’t be socially acceptable to walk up to somebody sitting on a park bench and just start randomly bothering them. It wouldn’t be socially acceptable to just start dumping signs all over someone’s front porch and gluing them to the windows of the house. Why, then, aren’t companies downright ashamed (and publicly shamed) when they create a product that feels the need to periodically pop messages in front of the user’s face that are by definition completely unnecessary to the function of the product? Build a product; make it nice; make it functional; and make it show things to the user only when necessary. Anything else is mere distraction, and frankly taints the product’s perceived value. We are spiraling down into a cesspool of “free” products that tax users with a thousand needles every day. We used to know how to pay $40 for software, or even $10, and demand better. We need to return to that.
Sideloader 11y ago
One aspect of OS X I've always appreciated is the absence of bundled bloatware and obtrusive advertising. Sure, you can disable the ads and uninstall any unwanted software Microsoft is aggressively pushing on you, but how many people actually do this? Most of my parent's friends that I've helped to resolve OS issues don't even try to find out how to switch off or delete Windows annoyances. Their machines are bogged down with junk that they don't want or need and some suffer silently while others complain loudly, but very few from either camp take the initiative and learn how the OS works. I don't know what percentage of the Windows owning public is unable or unwilling to wrest control of their OS from default setting tyranny, but anecdotal evidence suggests it's a not insignificant number.
kozukumi 11y ago
Ever since switching to Windows 10 I have found myself using Ubuntu more and more. To the point where I mostly boot Windows 10 once a week just to keep it and some software up to date. I like some things about Windows 10, for example the new snap features for programs is nice, overall the system looks quite nice as well. Their virtual desktop implementation is kind of lacking but at least it is there. Explorer is actually quite decent these days as well. However it just keeps pissing me off. I use SumatraPDF as my PDF reader, it is a great program. I can't think of a time when it hasn't worked perfectly yet for the 5th time now Windows has helpfully informed me it had to restore Edge as the default PDF reader for "reasons", of course I have no idea what these reasons are! I have Office 2016 installed and yet the stupid "Get Office 365" bullshit constantly nags me and reinstalls itself when the Store does some background updating. I had to hunt down a bloody PowerShell command to force remove it. Oh yes and in Microsoft's infinite wisdom they auto-install Twitter and Candy Crush Saga on my so-called "Professional" version of Windows which I paid for on a new machine! Honestly it is a fucking horrible experience. Their own modern Universal apps are garbage. They release these totally shit apps with the idea that "oh we can update constantly via the Store!" but the apps they are releasing are just plain awful. I have used tech demos that work better ffs. I honestly can't stand the Windows 10 experience. The new way of doing things is just horrible. I end up using Windows 10 just like I used Windows 7/8 with Win32 apps because there are still not any good Universal apps as the platform is just garbage by the looks of it. I mean if the maker of the platform can't even make decent apps what does that say about the platform?! Ubuntu isn't perfect but at least it doesn't fuck with me every other day to the point where I just want to walk away from the computer. Yes Linux still has some rough around the edges but I have found that installing Chrome makes everything web-related "just work" as well as on Windows. Netflix? Check! Flash? Check! Also TIS-100 has a Linux version so that keeps me happy :)
- amq 11y ago
  There are Universal apps which I actually like: Mail, Calendar, Weather, Edge, OneNote, Groove. I feel like your comment is over-exaggerated.
  - kozukumi 11y ago
apricot 11y ago
Amazing. This was exactly what we needed right now as a society. More ads.
smegel 11y ago
Maybe now the Year of the Linux Desktop has truly arrived.
- kbart 11y ago
  At least for me - yes. Currently I'm using dual boot with Ubuntu and Windows 7. But when Win7 expires, no more Windows on my machine(s). There's no way I'm letting malware, called Windows 10, near my data.
cbd1984 11y ago
Now, you can be the customer and the product! Innovation: Only From Microsoft.
voltagex_ 11y ago
I haven't seen this on the two devices I have running Windows 10 at home. I believe opting out of all the personalisation at http://choice.microsoft.com http://choice.microsoft.com has stopped this "feature".
ramgorur 11y ago
I thought they started embedding full screen tomb raider ad through UEFI, my bad.
dba7dba 11y ago
They are out of their minds. All of them. Board of directors to ceo to product manager to project managers to designers to coders to the company that bought the advertising. All of them.
userbinator 11y ago
Does anyone find it unpleasant how these new OSs are increasingly embedding online content everywhere, presumably opening many network connections and using bandwidth while increasing attack area unnecessarily? The start screen tiles in Win8, which continue into Win10's start menu, are the most obvious example here. It isn't that I hate the Internet or anything like that; I've certainly spent long hours online visiting various sites. Nonetheless, the idea of some parts of the OS that --- by default and with no explicit action of the user --- at some undisclosed time, reaching out somewhere to some server that I have no idea of, and retrieving content to be rendered on my machine, just doesn't feel right to me. If some of that "promiscuity" resulted in malware being installed, it would be extremely difficult to determine the cause; according to the list in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10053622 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10053622 , Windows 10 by default contacts a rather large list of domains, many of which are third-party and not even Microsoft-controlled. As I write this post I have a total of one network connection from my machine, an IM client; and at all times I am aware of what connections it's making, and which processes are doing it, so there is nothing unaccounted for. That's the way I like it --- my machine does not "talk to strangers" without me being unaware.
- H0n3sty 11y ago
  Yes! As Windows moves closer to an ad-supported model it's only going to get worse. All the bloatware was bad enough, adware is taking the abuse of OS users to a new level.
- Grishnakh 11y ago
  Personally, I like it a lot, but I don't think Microsoft is going nearly far enough with it. For instance, what if a machine isn't connected to the internet, as with a lot of corporate and government systems? Hopefully, after everyone (esp. the government) has switched to Windows 10, they'll roll out an essential update which will require all systems to be connected to the internet for telemetry and advertising purposes, and these features should not be able to be disabled. This even goes for government computers handling highly classified data. These computers should simply refuse to run without an internet connection for phoning home. Since customers have shown over and over that they're willing to accept any amount of abuse by MS, I think MS should just go for the gold and screw their customers over as hard as they can think of.
blahblah12 11y ago
Seriously, what is wrong with people? It's SPOTLIGHT UBUNTU shows me ads too . . calm yourselves down. Ads on installers are normal, also. If you didn't want microsoft to randomly send you a sign-on wallpaper, then disable spotlight.
stillsut 11y ago
And look what Google did with Chromecast - beautiful, national geographic style pictures you could sit and watch for hours. Clearly there's a team spending money at Google to create the best experience for me. If I went into a business meeting and Laura Croft showed up as my screen saver so MS could pocket $0.000001 for showing me an ad I would go ballistic. And I'm a MS guy. It's these type of shortsighted ad-in-the-os decisions which are making me doubt the future of MS as a serious company.
- wingerlang 11y ago
  Lara, not Laura.

599 points by tasoeur 11y ago

I seem to remember some recent articles about MSFT which detailed how they had really turned things around. They've been missing the boat for years, and finally got their act together. They had a really aggressive goal for getting windows 10 on XYZ millions of devices by June or July this year. And now....this?! This does not fit Satya Nadella's recent narrative. Why would MSFT do this?

MajesticHobo 11y ago

Direct link to HTG guide: http://www.howtogeek.com/243263/how-to-disable-ads-on-your-windows-10-lock-screen/ http://www.howtogeek.com/243263/how-to-disable-ads-on-your-w...

dang 11y ago
We changed the URL to that from https://mobile.twitter.com/howtogeek/status/702275153439416322 https://mobile.twitter.com/howtogeek/status/7022751534394163..., which points to it. If someone suggests a better URL for this story, we can change it again.
- zamalek 11y ago
  Maybe change the title, too? It's absurdly inaccurate, just look at how all the comments here are completely unrepresentative of what is stipulated in the article, everyone has read only the title and assumes: * Ads are popping up on the desktop ("full-screen"). Which they are not - it is restricted to the lock screen. Neither the tweet nor the article mentions "full-screen" once. * You can't opt-out of this process. The central point of the entire article is how to opt-out. * This is new. I personally opted out of this feature a while back. Possibly something like: "Windows is Showing Lock-Screen Ads (How to Opt-Out)". As per the guidelines: > Otherwise please use the original title, unless it is misleading or linkbait. This post not only fails to adhere to the guidelines, it does the exact opposite by changing the meaning of the article entirely. It should actually be deleted and I have flagged it due to such a blatant disregard for the guidelines.

ArbitraryHobo 11y ago

Has Microsoft gone too far?

melling 11y ago
9 out of 10 PC's still run Windows so I guess not.
- sp332 11y ago
  The PC market is shrinking quickly, so maybe they have.
  - forgetsusername 11y ago
    >The PC market is shrinking quickly There were 275 million PC units sold in 2015, and approximately the same number is expected for 2016. Sales were growing until 2011, when they peaked at around 360 million units. So certainly sales have shrunk, but I wouldn't describe them as "shrinking quickly", according to forecasts.
    - sp332 11y ago
      Shipments were down in 2015 even if you include Apple computers, which outperformed the rest. https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS40909316 https://www.idc.com/getdoc.jsp?containerId=prUS40909316 Things look even worse when you take them out. Which forecasts are you using?
      - scholia 11y ago
        IDC PC numbers are depressed partly because it doesn't count tablets/2-in-1s as PCs, it counts them as tablets. The story to which you link notes that "The impact for 2016 will be larger as detachable tablet volume grows, boosting earlier forecasts of PC growth in 2016 from -3.1% to growth of 1 to 2%." The quote is saying that if you add those "tablets" back, it's predicting that the PC market will grow this year. Another important point is that the vast majority of Windows 7/8/8.1 PCs will run Windows 10, and the upgrade is free. There's very little need for most users to buy a new PC. If users only buy a new PC every six years, then Windows PC sales should halve, compared with a three-year upgrade cycle. It doesn't mean that PC usage is declining (though it might be), it just means that PCs are lasting twice as long. Smartphone sales were, of course, hugely inflated by the fact that they only lasted for 18 months or so. When people keep their smartphones for three years, smartphone sales with halve as well.

kagia 11y ago

If only it were April fools...

djsumdog 11y ago

I really don't like this direction that MS is heading. I'd rather they charger for Windows 10 and newer and not start bundling software and pushing ads by default. Also, fuck buying games off the Windows store, Steam and any other service that locks you into DRM. My steam client in Linux is hopelessly broken due to updates. Some of my games will still play, but most require the stupid Steam DRM layer. I should have bought them off Humble instead.

bduerst 11y ago
GoG is pretty great [1]. Their games are DRM-free and their windows client is super clean - I only wish they would hurry up and release for Linux. https://www.gog.com/galaxy https://www.gog.com/galaxy
- sevensor 11y ago
  Many of their older games work great under Wine / DOSBox.
  - bduerst 11y ago
    Definitely. I was talking about their galaxy client.
    - gnud 11y ago
      Really? The best thing about GOG for me is that I don't have to install yet another crappy client.
      - bduerst 11y ago
        I actually prefer the client, but gog works just as fine without it. To each their own.
cm2187 11y ago
Or at least give a paid option for no user monetization and monitoring.

gargravarr 11y ago

Seems like the only way people want to make money these days is through invasive advertising without the end-user's explicit consent. Granted the expectation of free software is driving most of this, but it starts a vicious cycle because those who get annoyed with them develop countermeasures, which the creator responds to with more aggressive ads, ad infinitum. It does start explaining some of the highly controversial telemetry MS was collecting in Win10 - turning everyone's PCs into billboards.

cm2187 11y ago
Except windows isn't free. Even users who upgraded for free initially paid for a windows license (at least outside of China).
- gargravarr 11y ago
  Paying for the privilege of seeing adverts. So fundamentally MS. I'm so glad Win7 will be supported until 2020.
  - ArbitraryHobo 11y ago
    Too bad about Intel dropping support for Skylake and newer CPUs on Windows 7.
    - cm2187 11y ago
      you mean Microsoft dropping support for Skylake
      - jfuhrman 11y ago
        Can't drop something that doesn't exist.
        wongarsu 11y ago
        You can drop something that doesn't exist but was announced. Thechnically Skylake support for Win7 wasn't announced, but the effect is the same since there was an implicit expectation that the feature would come.

gravypod 11y ago

"When the item is free, you are the product" is the lesson of this past decade. I am at least repeatedly learning this over and over again.

Zikes 11y ago
That doesn't necessarily hold true for FOSS, though.
- gravypod 11y ago
  FOSS isn't free. You are being "paid for" by other people donating their time to make many, many people happy. That's at least my way of looking at it.
  - the_af 11y ago
    But the user is not the product in the case of FOSS. No-one is taking advantage of you as is the case when you, the user, are marketed to advertisers.
- DrJokepu 11y ago
  Oh man, it's absolutely true for FOSS, unless you develop FOSS purely because of idealogical reasons, Richard Stallman-style. FOSS development can be turned into reputation and popularity, which can be turned into cash. It's much easier to get your startup off the ground (or find a good job or decent clients as a contractor, etc.) if you have 10,000 Twitter followers, because you write popular FOSS.
  - embik 11y ago
    Which is exactly how FOSS is supposed to work. You give away something free of charge and available to everyone and you're getting something back from your users. That doesn't make the software's user "the product" though. In your case the developer is making himself the product he tries to sell, not the users. This is really not comparable to advertisement and data collection.

s_kilk 11y ago

Not surprised. Some of us have been predicting this for years, but we tended to get shouted down for committing the Slippery Slope fallacy.

gargravarr 11y ago
Least we get to point and say 'told you so', right? :)
mhurron 11y ago
> Some of us have been predicting this for years Ever since Ubuntu did it.
- jasonlotito 11y ago
  Apple does it right now.
exodust 11y ago
Predicting what exactly? 1. New spotlight feature = on; 2. Toggle "fun facts and more" = on; You know that images will stream in from the internet along with "fun facts and more" whatever that is. And when a Tomb Raider image appears, you're suddenly in Orwellian future shock mode? The day MS takes away the toggle so you can't switch ads off, is the day to be outraged. Not before.
- CamperBob2 11y ago
  The day MS takes away the toggle so you can't switch ads off, is the day to be outraged. Not before. GWX certainly qualifies as an "ad." Just curious, where is the "toggle switch" in the "settings" that I can turn "off" to disable GWX? Oh, there isn't one? I thought so.
  - exodust 11y ago
    Okay... that would annoy me too. I'm still on Windows 7 and haven't seen anything like that. Not one Windows 10 ad, and I've been doing Windows updates (manual ones from time to time). On both my laptop and desktop - Win 7 and Win 8, I have yet to see any GWX ad. Maybe I will see it one day.

ccvannorman 11y ago

I still remember the last time I used Windows (outside of a VM for testing.) I had been given a Surface to develop on for my video game. At one point, it started playing an advertisement as a part of the operating experience. My reaction: 1. What is happening? 2. Why is this happening? 3. How do I shut this off? 4. Who the hell decided this was a good idea? 5. Where's the nearest trash bin?

CurtHagenlocher 11y ago

I didn't even realize that it was an advertisement. But if it is, it's not the first one. The Beatles images shown in December were then probably also technically ads for the just-released-on-streaming Beatles catalog. Disclosures: I work at Microsoft and really don't like advertising-supported products.

toxican 11y ago

Kind of complete bullshit to do that, but at the same time it's very easy to disable via settings. It's not as though you have to tinker with the register or modify your hosts file or whatever else.

exodust 11y ago
On the other hand, it's a static Tomb Raider image on your lock screen. I'd prefer that to say an "arty" photo of a new father holding his newborn baby to his bare chest in the morning sun or something... That would fill me with rage. Tomb Raider image, not so bad.

AdmiralAsshat 11y ago

Probably a good time to remind people about ReactOS: https://www.reactos.org/project-news/reactos-040-released https://www.reactos.org/project-news/reactos-040-released One day it may be the only way to use Windows programs without this kind of end-user harassment.

simoncion 11y ago
> One day [ReactOS] may be the only way to use Windows programs without this kind of end-user harassment. There's a lot of code sharing between ReactOS and Wine. For the most part, Wine works really well to run Windows software... there's no need to run an entire somewhat-Windows-compatible OS that has limited hardware compatibility when you're just interested in running a particular Windows application. [0] However, I expect that you neither meant to imply that Wine wasn't a good option for running Windows software, nor that work on Wine was likely to stop before work on ReactOS stopped. :) [0] Edit: To be clear, I'm quite aware that the task that the ReactOS devs face is monumental. I also acknowledge that those devs have put in a lot of good work over the past ~eighteen years.

acre88 11y ago

Aren't plentiful, unrequested ads for games an integral part of Microsoft's XBox systems? I don't remember hearing too much outrage about those. Is that a different situation somehow?

ohitsdom 11y ago
Great point. I've always had an issue with those ads on the home screen. One ad that stands out in my memory was a particularly gruesome looking game ad, something about zombies. I thought it was way too dark for the little kids in my house to be seeing, but had no way to turn it off.

nikbackm 11y ago

That particular example does not seem too bad. I personally would have just assumed the ad to be yet another random lock screen image. Which I like for the most part.

Negitivefrags 11y ago
Thank you for being the only one in this thread not in an unreasonable panic. It's a very attractive piece of high quality concept art. It doesn't even have a logo. Is it for a game that they sell? Yes. But come on. This is one of the least invasive advertisements I've ever seen.
Coincoin 11y ago
Yeah, by the author's standard, any nice picture would be an ad for the photographer. Pretty picture of a New Zeeland countryside? Ad for NZ tourism office. Pretty picture of a data center chockfull of network equipment and mainframes? Ad for IBM and Cisco. Microsoft have been doing that since Bing, show a pretty interesting picture with a little icon to know where that picture is from. It just happens that one is from a game. People are so tired of obnoxious and disgusting ads that they tend to forget why they hate obnoxious and disgusting ads; because they are obnoxious and disgusting. Then they go on an irrational crusade about every picture, awesome viral video, mystery public campaign just because it originates from a corporation.
niftich 11y ago
This is about as tasteful as they could've gotten and I applaud them for their choice. It's visually appealing concept art showing a cool setting, and it's completely devoid of logos and obtrusive indicators of brand. It doesn't say "TOMB RAIDER" in the corner. There is a call-to-action, but it's absolutely tiny, and takes you to their Store app, not some sketchy website. This is product placement at it's best, really. It's subtle, attention-catching on its artistic merits, and stays out of your way if you're uninterested. I'll even go as far as suggest that this is exactly the kind of advertising I'd prefer, if we must have advertising (that point can be debated).

bendykstra 11y ago

I was shocked and very worried when ads for Microsoft Office started popping up in the Action Center (10's centralized notification area) last year. When I wrote about my concerns on a Windows forum, most pf the responses were along the lines of, "why are you complaining, Windows 10 is free." If people no longer feel that they own their operating systems, then there is no check on Microsoft's behavior. Inevitably, ads will become personalized and telemetry that Microsoft now uses to improve the operating system will be used to improve ads. The challenges to privacy that we currently experience online will expand to the desktop.

RealCasually 11y ago
What is the harm done? Of course you don't "own" your operating system. You also paid nothing for it. I also struggle to grasp the double standard of why Google, Facebook, et al are able to endlessly track and personalize ads, but when Microsoft follows a similar model, there is outrage.
- gargravarr 11y ago
  The argument that Win10 is free won't hold for much longer, it's only 'free' if you upgrade from Win7 or 8. It's already being sold retail in stores for a similar price to the old versions. And from later this year, people will have to pay for upgrades too. On the flipside, you don't "own" your software anyway, you own a license to use it (EULA). The double-standard probably has something to do with the ability to block most of Google's ads and tracking, or use another search platform if you really want. This is the OS on top of which you'll be using all of your other software (web platforms included), and it's impossible to control what is going on in the background.
  - seanp2k2 11y ago
    While I agree with the difference, it should still be possible to block these types of ads with some kind of firewall. Unless the OS is blocking the blocking at a lower level (which I'd be VERY surprised by), something like Privoxy and using that as the system proxy for http[s] should be able to knock these out if they're loaded dynamically. I haven't tested this, so it would require some inspection and network monitoring to figure out what's serving these. Some hosts file entries may even be enough.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

draw_down 11y ago

Wow! This is really just unbelievable to me.

exodust 11y ago
Yep, it is quite a spectacular Tomb Raider image.

throwaway21816 11y ago

Anyone who links m.wikipedia or mobile.twitter should be hung by their thumbs from a tall building

dang 11y ago
Please stop posting unsubstantive comments to HN.

aresant 11y ago

It's so funny to watch MSFT completely miss the lessons that have turned Google into the World's Most Valuable Advertising Business. HEY YOU GUYS LETS PLASTER ADVERTISING ALL OVER ALL OF THE THINGS! Look at Gmail: http://imgur.com/M8RF1TV http://imgur.com/M8RF1TV Look at Yahoo Mail: http://imgur.com/Cjwxspc http://imgur.com/Cjwxspc Look at AOL Mail: http://imgur.com/ZeaIe1L http://imgur.com/ZeaIe1L Which email product do you use? Which would you rather use? The advertising business that is sustainable is owning the user at a moment of high-intent, aka SEARCH. Slapping ads all over my login page is a great way render the fat from brand advertisers into short-term revenue gains at the price of ENRAGING me. MSFT get the tracking and the ads the fuck out of my kitchen and my OS or at least give me a REAL way to pay you for a clean, no ad version!

vlunkr 11y ago
Personally I wouldn't be willing to pay for an ad-free version of an OS that you are already paying for.
- the_hangman 11y ago
  What? Who paid for Windows 10? I thought Windows 10 is supposed to be free?
  - bad_user 11y ago
    I hope this is snark.
  - ebbv 11y ago
    It's only free to upgrade to it. If you buy/build a new PC you have to pay $100 (or more) for the privilege of being shown ads on your login page.
  - wongarsu 11y ago
    There's no way to get Windows 10 for free. Either you pay for an old version of Windows and upgrade or you buy Windows 10.
11y ago

sj4nz 11y ago

As always, the future moves closer and closer to Black Mirror's S01E02.

jksmith 11y ago

Does ReactOS plan to copy this business model?

pearle 11y ago

I think I'm finally going back to Windows 7. I'd rather pay full price for a OS release than become a product. Of course, another issue is that the Windows Store is completely broken on my computer and quite a few apps no longer work (including Windows Calculator, Photos, etc.).

exodust 11y ago
Or just turn off the spotlight thing in settings.
- JabavuAdams 11y ago
  This is not how you design good products and tools. If I grab my drill, it's because I want to make a hole. I don't want to click through even one annoyance. Also, in the real world, it's one annoyance today, but it'll be five tomorrow if people don't push back. Computers are annoying because apologists keep saying things like "just turn that off".
  - exodust 11y ago
    I don't disagree with your general point. But we have here a relatively new image showcase feature called "spotlight". I'm not really seeing the deception or poor design if you chose to enable this new feature in the first place. Edit - I've just found out Spotlight is enabled by default. I don't have Windows 10, didn't know.

jfoster 11y ago

Seems like the "new Microsoft" honeymoon period has been brought to an abrupt end. Did every single Windows 7 user get this? Perhaps they can recover from this by learning quickly from the backlash that's about to happen.

exodust 11y ago
Backlash from needing to go into settings and flick a toggle switch from on to off? Oh the horror!
- dontblink 11y ago
  But why do I even have to do this? I paid for an OS. Not for new annoyances.
- pkorzeniewski 11y ago
  You could say the same about installers bundled with some crapware toolbars installed by default - you just need to uncheck one checkbox! It's not about how much effort it requires to turn such bullshit off, to me it's a clear message from the company that you're just a sucker to be milked as hard as possible. "Oh, you've turned it off? No problem, we'll be more clever next time!" I refuse to use anything coming from such companies, even if it means more effort in everyday life.
- jfoster 11y ago
  Whether it's justified or not is nearly beside the point. Will backlash happen from this? If it hits the login screen of every Windows 7 user, it'll almost certainly be in mainstream press within the next couple of days. It won't last, of course. That's why I think Microsoft will have an opportunity to learn from it.
- vacri 11y ago
  There was backlash against iTunes 'helpfully' giving you a crappy U2 album. Traditionally, advertising is something you see when you 'go on the internet'. It doesn't usually appear before you even log onto the machine.
- 11y ago

dethos 11y ago

This is the price for the "free" upgrade to windows 10. I really don't like this trend of turning your personal computer into a thin client, where its properties can be manipulated remotely by the vendor like if it was a web app. This is why I stayed away of products like Windows 10 and ChromeOS.

shahidhussain 11y ago
Why Chrome OS?
- dethos 11y ago
  > ... turning your personal computer into a thin client ... Because, ChromeOS seems to be mostly about web apps, thus can suffer from the same issue that this post describes, for example.

dangrossman 11y ago

Microsoft added the Spotlight feature last year, and this is pretty much exactly what it was billed as: if you don't have a lock screen image of your own, you get random wallpaper images from Bing, and also occasional app offers and tips. You can upvote/downvote the offers to personalize the suggestions in the future. It's an app discovery mechanism, and you can turn it off by picking your own lock screen image. I don't know why it's only in the news now. This isn't the first time wallpapers for an app have been in the rotation.

BinaryIdiot 11y ago
I'm fine with jumping aboard the hate train for things like the Office ads but this seems like a pretty non-issue and I agree with you. Just like the Google Play widget or notifications for the App Store on iOS; Windows is doing the same-thing but with a lock screen background. I'm not sure if this is a default (I thought it wasn't; it certainly wasn't when I bought a Surface a couple of weeks ago). If this is a default then I think that should be changed but beyond that? Not a big deal. Let's focus on other Windows 10 issues that should be addressed versus this.
- GhotiFish 11y ago
  I look at it as a part of a larger arc of issues. Windows is going fremium. I feel like advertisements as a direct component of an operating system have crossed a line. This is like when Ubuntu started advertising amazon products in their launch bar. It crossed a line.
  - arm 11y ago
    Yeah, and the worst part is, Windows 10 actually does¹ cost money. And the people who pay for it still get to see ads. It seems like the only sure way to avoid all this tracking crap in Windows 10 is to pony up for the Enterprise version (which is basically impossible if you’re not a business). ―――――― ¹ — http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=windows+10&SiteID=msca&Locale=en_CA&Action=DisplayProductSearchResultsPage&result=&sortby=score%20descending&filters=undefined http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=windows+10&Site...

slavik81 11y ago

I'm more annoyed that they pop up desktop notifications just to advertise Office 365.

r3bl 11y ago
The irony here is that you still see those ads even if you have a running Office 365 subscription associated with the same Microsoft account you've used to create your Windows account.

fpgaminer 11y ago

With Windows 10 doing things like this, and Windows 7 being aggressively deprecated, I decided I finally wanted to ditch Windows as my daily driver. It was good timing, then, that I watched the "7 Gamers 1 CPU" video from LinuxTechTips, which showed me how to do it without sacrificing gaming. Most everything I use runs in Linux, and for the few things that don't I can spin up a VM. But there's the caveat that is as old as Windows itself ... gaming. Dual booting isn't an option for me, because I tend to run various server VMs 24/7. I also didn't want a second tower just for Windows; that's non-ideal. But wait! Apparently modern CPUs have this fancy thing called IOMMU I never knew about, which lets you give direct access to PCI-E devices, like GPUs, to a VM. So I bought up a 5820K, a X99 motherboard, and an extra graphics card, and away I went. I now have Arch Linux running as the host system where I do all my work. Windows 10 sits in a VM where it's given direct and exclusive access to a GTX 970 for graphics. So far, things are working well and Windows runs the benchmark apps just fine. The end result is that I can use Linux as my daily driver, but flip over to my Windows VM whenever I want to game. It keeps Windows isolated, which is great from a privacy/security perspective, I don't have to dual-boot, and best of all I can spin up different VMs if I want to use the beastly GTX 970 for other work like machine learning. Thanks to using the 5820K which has a few Xeon features in it, the entire process when smoothly. The biggest caveat is I haven't found a DisplayPort switch yet, so I can't hook up the Windows VM to my primary Cinema monitor, and I haven't nailed down the mouse+keyboard thing yet. QEMU's virtual mouse+keyboard doesn't normally work with these kinds of VMs, so you have to hack it in, and even then it likes to randomly stop working. I could just grab a second set of physical mouse+keyboard but that's not ideal. Steam Steaming will probably be the best option for now.

hatsix 11y ago
Is there a write-up on this that you can recommend?
- zymhan 11y ago
  The Arch docs are super helpful on this, even if you're not running Arch: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVMF#vfio-pci https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PCI_passthrough_via_OVM...

imgabe 11y ago

I've been using Windows 10 for a while now at work and I haven't seen any ads yet. I was really enjoying the different pictures on the lock screen and the way you can like/dislike them to get more of the types of pictures you like. If they start running ads on it and I have to disable it that's going to be pretty sad. I mean, not really in the grand scheme of things, but it was a pleasant, enjoyable feature that made me like Windows. Why ruin it with ads?

fiatjaf 11y ago

It's funny to read all those irritating comments: "oh, my OS is showing me ads", people complaining after they got a pirate OS without paying for it.

arm 11y ago
Are you joking? Windows 10 actually does cost money. And the people who pay for it still get to see ads.

deleted 11y ago

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butz 11y ago

They should add bitcoin miner next. That way they will make even more money.

mariusmg 11y ago

What the fuck ? You choose to let Microsoft show you whatever they want on the login screen and complain their show you an ad ? Seriously ? Disable the spotlight crap and be on your merry way. Or install Ubuntu and watch Amazon ads :D

nacs 11y ago
Ubuntu has removed the Amazon ads with newer versions.

Animats 11y ago

Can you buy an single enterprise version of Windows 10 without the ads and the snooping ("telemetry")? How much does it cost? How do you buy it? Microsoft makes this info very hard to find.[1] [1] https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-for-enterprise https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-f...

zamalek 11y ago
As far as I know the W10 machine needs to be also joined to an AD domain for this to work (the telemetry is disabled via a group policy on the DC).

proactivesvcs 11y ago

Malware straight to the lock screen now? Wow. This behaviour just goes to show the advertising industry still has no idea about real-world concerns and opinions on advertising. I wonder how long it'll take for this to start getting farmed out to malware brokers/bidding platforms that Microsoft's MSN uses, such as AppNexus, AdSpirit etc.

gargravarr 11y ago
This is not specifically malware, just a blatant ad, but I expect it's only a matter of time before someone exploits it. Upload a booby-trapped image, let Bing categorise it and let the bombs start falling...
recursive 11y ago
In your opinion, what is malware?
- proactivesvcs 11y ago
  Microsoft's advertising. Specifically, those they choose to do business with allowing exploit kits to deliver malware payload, such as cryptolocker-style viruses.
  - recursive 11y ago
    So you're assuming that the channel this tomb raider wallpaper came through is able to transmit a virus? Or do you have knowledge that it's true?
    - proactivesvcs 11y ago
      I know that Microsoft are not to be trusted with advertisements, and this is advertising. Who knows what executable code, like javascript, fonts or GDI+ objects, are involved with the wallpaper? If not today, what about tomorrow?

guardian5x 11y ago

I don't like the direction they are going. What's next? Sending a U2 Album on the PCs?

yuhong 11y ago

I have suggested before that MS should sell Windows to a non-profit foundation. It is probably not trivial though.

brudgers 11y ago

Ubuntu baked Amazon products into Unity several years ago. Google bakes....well, where do I start? Anyway, this is the Microsoft everyone was screaming for...more just like everyone else. At least Facebook doesn't inject ads into information about my friends...[puts finger to ear ala Jon Stewart]...what's that?

solnyshok 11y ago

I just disabled Windows Lockscreen (not to be confused with Login Screen) right after installation.

gdulli 11y ago

Kind of an alarmist headline for what's essentially a screen saver type thing that's set as the default but can be changed to something else.

ck2 11y ago

For those that want to make sure you never are forced upgraded to Windows 10 http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/ http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/ GWX Control Panel - blocks Windows 7/8 from ever installing W10

wangchow 11y ago

It's easy enough to disable the adds. Also check the Microsoft account and there are various preferences with toggle buttons associated with "targeted ads." To be honest, some people like having targeted ads if it's something consumers may be interested in.. Why not inform them? And for those who don't like them.. Just go through those settings and change them. As long as these ads are configurable it's not a big deal. That being said, if they became something customers can not opt out of that is a different story.

alistproducer2 11y ago

I will run Windows 7 as long as I can. When it goes the way of XP, I'll go back to Linux.

gosukiwi 11y ago

If only gaming on Linux would be as easy as it is on Windows...

ape4 11y ago

That's terrible. How long until its not an option.

jlhim 11y ago

nice click bait title.

jlhim 11y ago
lol @ down voting because you don't like what i say. who is this dang? he seems to like to do that. the title is not honest.

JabavuAdams 11y ago

This is so anti-user it boggles the mind.

UK-AL 11y ago

Heh, I didn't know windows had this feature. I just turned it on.

pasbesoin 11y ago

Recently, I bought one of the cheapo Amazon tablets to have a "beater" I didn't need to worry about. Sure, the price was nice. But the full-page ad upon every lock screen, that is too easy to trigger into video play when trying to swipe to unlock, has rather put me off. I won't be buying another Amazon tablet. And I'm glad I never got one of their phones -- I shudder to think. It's my computer / tablet / phone / computing device. The more you work to make and demonstrate otherwise, the more I'm going to move away from you. I just hope I keep having a choice. And I have to consider my individual role in making sure that is the case.

aikah 11y ago

They are beating Google at their own game. I wouldn't be surprised if Google announced a real desktop OS, since they basically pulled the plug on Chrome OS and Android isn't even fit for Tablet. Microsoft is basically trying to outgoogle Google, and they are trying to do that at the OS level, not at the browser level. From a purely strategic standpoint this is brillant. From a user stand point it's obnoxious of course, because good luck blocking ads if Microsoft decides Windows won't allow you to. Clearly web advertising is drying up, so Native ads,i.e. at the OS level is where the growth is. EDIT: correction

Mithaldu 11y ago
> I wouldn't be surprised if Google announced a real desktop OS It has taken MS almost all it has to get Windows to the point where it currently is, while the best thing Google can claim is to have made a browser using someone else's engine, while skipping 90% of the features that other browsers have. This works for the web, but on the OS front they cannot compete.
- akoumis 11y ago
  Sorry which features is it lacking in? https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chromemobile-44/firefox-40/ie-Edge%2013/safari-9.0.html https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chromemobile-44/firefo...
  - Mithaldu 11y ago
    User interface customizability. It has almost none whatsoever. The rendering engine and what it supports doesn't matter, since Webkit wasn't made by Google.

cmdrfred 11y ago

I don't have any data to back this up but it really feels more and more like the fabled "Year of Linux" to me. Microsoft last it's way when Gates left and hardware manufacturers are starting to get on board.

finishingmove 11y ago

Well, this is exactly what I would expect if I left any "Give me something random, I don't want to think too much" option activated. These are the first things I disable on any OS. With that said, I recently switched my home PC to Linux. It was not due to the privacy issues, rather buggy experience (probably due to older hardware). Overall happy, although the UX in KDE 4 and Gnome 3.1x is still lagging behind Windows/OS X noticeably IMHO.

anonbanker 11y ago
Then switch to a distro using KDE Plasma 5.5, and be _ahead_ of Windows' UX.

makecheck 11y ago

When I was a kid and learning basic manners, there were certain things taught that separated good from bad. And you know, advertising methods are starting to look a lot like pure rudeness to me. It wouldn’t be socially acceptable to walk up to somebody sitting on a park bench and just start randomly bothering them. It wouldn’t be socially acceptable to just start dumping signs all over someone’s front porch and gluing them to the windows of the house. Why, then, aren’t companies downright ashamed (and publicly shamed) when they create a product that feels the need to periodically pop messages in front of the user’s face that are by definition completely unnecessary to the function of the product? Build a product; make it nice; make it functional; and make it show things to the user only when necessary. Anything else is mere distraction, and frankly taints the product’s perceived value. We are spiraling down into a cesspool of “free” products that tax users with a thousand needles every day. We used to know how to pay $40 for software, or even $10, and demand better. We need to return to that.

Sideloader 11y ago

One aspect of OS X I've always appreciated is the absence of bundled bloatware and obtrusive advertising. Sure, you can disable the ads and uninstall any unwanted software Microsoft is aggressively pushing on you, but how many people actually do this? Most of my parent's friends that I've helped to resolve OS issues don't even try to find out how to switch off or delete Windows annoyances. Their machines are bogged down with junk that they don't want or need and some suffer silently while others complain loudly, but very few from either camp take the initiative and learn how the OS works. I don't know what percentage of the Windows owning public is unable or unwilling to wrest control of their OS from default setting tyranny, but anecdotal evidence suggests it's a not insignificant number.

kozukumi 11y ago

Ever since switching to Windows 10 I have found myself using Ubuntu more and more. To the point where I mostly boot Windows 10 once a week just to keep it and some software up to date. I like some things about Windows 10, for example the new snap features for programs is nice, overall the system looks quite nice as well. Their virtual desktop implementation is kind of lacking but at least it is there. Explorer is actually quite decent these days as well. However it just keeps pissing me off. I use SumatraPDF as my PDF reader, it is a great program. I can't think of a time when it hasn't worked perfectly yet for the 5th time now Windows has helpfully informed me it had to restore Edge as the default PDF reader for "reasons", of course I have no idea what these reasons are! I have Office 2016 installed and yet the stupid "Get Office 365" bullshit constantly nags me and reinstalls itself when the Store does some background updating. I had to hunt down a bloody PowerShell command to force remove it. Oh yes and in Microsoft's infinite wisdom they auto-install Twitter and Candy Crush Saga on my so-called "Professional" version of Windows which I paid for on a new machine! Honestly it is a fucking horrible experience. Their own modern Universal apps are garbage. They release these totally shit apps with the idea that "oh we can update constantly via the Store!" but the apps they are releasing are just plain awful. I have used tech demos that work better ffs. I honestly can't stand the Windows 10 experience. The new way of doing things is just horrible. I end up using Windows 10 just like I used Windows 7/8 with Win32 apps because there are still not any good Universal apps as the platform is just garbage by the looks of it. I mean if the maker of the platform can't even make decent apps what does that say about the platform?! Ubuntu isn't perfect but at least it doesn't fuck with me every other day to the point where I just want to walk away from the computer. Yes Linux still has some rough around the edges but I have found that installing Chrome makes everything web-related "just work" as well as on Windows. Netflix? Check! Flash? Check! Also TIS-100 has a Linux version so that keeps me happy :)

amq 11y ago
There are Universal apps which I actually like: Mail, Calendar, Weather, Edge, OneNote, Groove. I feel like your comment is over-exaggerated.
- kozukumi 11y ago

apricot 11y ago

Amazing. This was exactly what we needed right now as a society. More ads.

smegel 11y ago

Maybe now the Year of the Linux Desktop has truly arrived.

kbart 11y ago
At least for me - yes. Currently I'm using dual boot with Ubuntu and Windows 7. But when Win7 expires, no more Windows on my machine(s). There's no way I'm letting malware, called Windows 10, near my data.

cbd1984 11y ago

Now, you can be the customer and the product! Innovation: Only From Microsoft.

voltagex_ 11y ago

I haven't seen this on the two devices I have running Windows 10 at home. I believe opting out of all the personalisation at http://choice.microsoft.com http://choice.microsoft.com has stopped this "feature".

ramgorur 11y ago

I thought they started embedding full screen tomb raider ad through UEFI, my bad.

dba7dba 11y ago

They are out of their minds. All of them. Board of directors to ceo to product manager to project managers to designers to coders to the company that bought the advertising. All of them.

userbinator 11y ago

Does anyone find it unpleasant how these new OSs are increasingly embedding online content everywhere, presumably opening many network connections and using bandwidth while increasing attack area unnecessarily? The start screen tiles in Win8, which continue into Win10's start menu, are the most obvious example here. It isn't that I hate the Internet or anything like that; I've certainly spent long hours online visiting various sites. Nonetheless, the idea of some parts of the OS that --- by default and with no explicit action of the user --- at some undisclosed time, reaching out somewhere to some server that I have no idea of, and retrieving content to be rendered on my machine, just doesn't feel right to me. If some of that "promiscuity" resulted in malware being installed, it would be extremely difficult to determine the cause; according to the list in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10053622 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10053622 , Windows 10 by default contacts a rather large list of domains, many of which are third-party and not even Microsoft-controlled. As I write this post I have a total of one network connection from my machine, an IM client; and at all times I am aware of what connections it's making, and which processes are doing it, so there is nothing unaccounted for. That's the way I like it --- my machine does not "talk to strangers" without me being unaware.

H0n3sty 11y ago
Yes! As Windows moves closer to an ad-supported model it's only going to get worse. All the bloatware was bad enough, adware is taking the abuse of OS users to a new level.
Grishnakh 11y ago
Personally, I like it a lot, but I don't think Microsoft is going nearly far enough with it. For instance, what if a machine isn't connected to the internet, as with a lot of corporate and government systems? Hopefully, after everyone (esp. the government) has switched to Windows 10, they'll roll out an essential update which will require all systems to be connected to the internet for telemetry and advertising purposes, and these features should not be able to be disabled. This even goes for government computers handling highly classified data. These computers should simply refuse to run without an internet connection for phoning home. Since customers have shown over and over that they're willing to accept any amount of abuse by MS, I think MS should just go for the gold and screw their customers over as hard as they can think of.

blahblah12 11y ago

Seriously, what is wrong with people? It's SPOTLIGHT UBUNTU shows me ads too . . calm yourselves down. Ads on installers are normal, also. If you didn't want microsoft to randomly send you a sign-on wallpaper, then disable spotlight.

stillsut 11y ago

And look what Google did with Chromecast - beautiful, national geographic style pictures you could sit and watch for hours. Clearly there's a team spending money at Google to create the best experience for me. If I went into a business meeting and Laura Croft showed up as my screen saver so MS could pocket $0.000001 for showing me an ad I would go ballistic. And I'm a MS guy. It's these type of shortsighted ad-in-the-os decisions which are making me doubt the future of MS as a serious company.

wingerlang 11y ago
Lara, not Laura.