17 ms·

I am the very proud father of a 14yo girl whom I have turned into an teenaged IT guru over the years. She learned to read at age 3 using the very well done "Ca

by cubano 11y ago

I am the very proud father of a 14yo girl whom I have turned into an teenaged IT guru over the years. She learned to read at age 3 using the very well done "Cat In The Hat" desktop program, and since then I have turned her on to everything from Gmail at age 6 to Ableton at 12. I've decided that Snapchat is where it ends for me/us last year...she needs something to be hers and her friends alone, without "Dad" poking is old-ass nose into things. I think she really appreciates that I haven't bugged her about connecting and sharing on that platform, and I know deep down it was time. But boy...do I sometimes miss that 6yo angel sending me cryptic "i luvu" via Gmail.

sandworm101 11y ago
I'm biased by my perceptive (legal) but imho girls between 12 and 18 should not be allowed connected cameras. I've had too many conversations with horrified fathers and crying children after a disturbing image ends up somewhere it was never meant to be. There are just too many people, and I include cops in this, out there looking to get kids into serious trouble. I know that kids live a life in pictures, but that public record of everyday activities too often come back to haunt them. And fyi for fathers: Do not share a phone with your daughter. Do not borrow her phone, nor lend her yours. Some pictures are fine to be in her possession but if found in your possession could destroy your world.
- jsmeaton 11y ago
  Not boys? Boys send nudes too, and often request them. Isn't that soliciting child porn? We need to be feeding kids (boys and girls) way more information and hoping they don't mess up too badly.
  - sandworm101 11y ago
    I have yet to see a boy in my office. I'm in no doubt that it happens every day, but the cases I've had contact with all involved young girls, or at least images of them. I think there is a different dynamic with males. Boys seem to show off by photographing themselves with things, with cars, cash or even tigers. [see link] Girls seem more likely to create images focusing on their person or their friends' persons. There is also some sexual dimorphism at work. Boys simply have less to physically cover, probably making inappropriate or accidentally inappropriate images less likely. http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/06/25/new_york_bans_tiger_selfies_what_will_tinder_users_do.html http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/06/25/new_york_bans... http://tinderguyswithtigers.tumblr.com/ http://tinderguyswithtigers.tumblr.com/
  - qrendel 11y ago
    Maybe we could instead go after the people who want to make careers out of destroying teenage lives with trumped-up child pornography charges? They seem like the real enemy in this stuff.
    - jsmeaton 11y ago
      Oh, that shit is awful too don't get me wrong. I was just trying to make the point that both boys and girls can get in serious trouble (legally and personally/socially). I don't get or agree with the sentiment that teen girls, alone, should not have access to cameras. Attacking the wrong part of the problem.
    - lmm 11y ago
      Are you going to be the representative or congressman who proposes a bill to decriminalise child porn? Or the president who signs an executive order to not prosecute child porn cases? How do you think that would play in the media and with the voters?
      - qrendel 11y ago
        I'm aware of that feedback loop, but the comments I see here seem to view that kind of Draconian treatment of people, ones who are obviously not child pornographers or dangerous individuals, as a problem. So there seems to be at least a subset of voters who recognize the issue and think it's absurd. This is partly a problem of common knowledge[1] - where lots of people are thinking the laws are absurd, but no one wants to be the first to say it openly, because they can't know for certain that anyone else is thinking the same thing. Getting a conversation going about how ridiculous some of these prosecutions for "child porn" are would be the first step towards a sane discussion of what those kinds of child protection laws should actually be, when they should be applied and when they shouldn't, etc, so that it stops being a third rail for lawmakers. Might also point out that the recently passed "International Megan's Law" actually places a permanent mark on these people's passports labeling them as sex offenders.[2] These cases of a dad being permanently marked as a sex offender just for letting his daughter borrow his phone, or a 19 yro getting a naked pic from his 17 yro girlfriend, only end up being counterproductive to protecting the real victims. When you hear of someone labeled as a "sex offender" now, does it serve as a reliable warning? Or do you just wonder if the guy was unlucky enough to get caught pissing in public? [1] http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=2410 http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=2410 [2] http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/02/obama_signs_international_megans_law.html http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/02/obama_signs_int...
- tallanvor 11y ago
  > And fyi for fathers: Do not share a phone with your daughter. Do not borrow her phone, nor lend her yours. Some pictures are fine to be in her possession but if found in your possession could destroy your world. And the fact that you have to say that is a great example of what's wrong with the legal system in the US. Common sense about applying laws has been stripped away.
- dcposch 11y ago
  > imho girls between 12 and 18 should not be allowed connected cameras are you saying they shouldnt have a phone until they turn 18? that sounds super unrealistic i think its important to respect their intelligence. >There are just too many people, and I include cops in this, out there looking to get kids into serious trouble maybe that is the problem we need to solve. saying a young woman in high school shouldnt be allowed a phone sounds like victim blaming
daveloyall 11y ago
Cat In The Hat desktop software? Hm, I searched and found more than one. Various companies: The Learning Company. Borderbund. MacKiev. Which did you have?
- matmann2001 11y ago
  My younger brother had the Borderbund one. I recall it being a pretty decent piece of software.
Avalaxy 11y ago
Sorry for being an old-ass as well, but wasn't snapchat created to send nudes to other people in a way that they are automatically erased and can't be saved? I don't know if people still use it like that, but do you feel comfortable letting your 12 years old daughter use something like that?
- Tactic 11y ago
  As an old-ass father of 3 that pokes here and there I can tell you that does happen. However, that is hardly the point of it. It is because everyone needs to be able to say and do things that aren't recorded. That go away. And kids need space to experiment and grow in ways they are not watched. Honestly, from what I can tell it is used far more for making funny faces and moments than anything else. Besides, if you are concerned that they are showing each other their bodies you have more to worry about than snapchat because it is going to happen regardless. At least nobody has got an STD from snapchat. And after the things I found when doing a backup of my 16 year old's computer I'm more concerned with the pictures that stick around than don't. We had a talk about why I never want pictures of naked teenage friends on my network. But if you think you can stifle teenagers, you are wrong. You just push them into the shadows and you out of their life.
  - ambicapter 11y ago
    Yes, but you know snapchat pictures aren't really deleted right? 'Temporary pictures' is a proposition that doesn't actually exist in the digital realm, and certainly not when a VC-backed company is proposing it.
    - lurkinggrue 11y ago
      Compared to facebook they go away and it's more a "Probably" goes away. I'm sure there will be a few snapchat users that will get screwed by this but at least the majority of the use will vanish before these kids are old enough for jobs and the shit they did on snapchat doesn't show up in a background check.
ceocoder 11y ago
man this is scary for me, I'm about to have a baby girl (she already has a Gmail account), I know I'm far from the "dad doesn't get 'it'" phase, but it is still scary. Do you have any tips to make this transition easy?
- matt_morgan 11y ago
  Every kid is different. You'll know what to do.
  - rrauenza 11y ago
    The great thing starting with a baby is you get to grow with them -- you don't have to be an expert right off the bat. Gloria Wall (mother of four, spouse of Larry Wall) also has great advice that is worth repeating: You don't have to be an expert in children to be a parent -- you only have to be an expert in _your_ children.
    - jon-wood 11y ago
      Just after our son was born this was wonderfully summed up by a friend of mine as being like levelling up in a game. You start off with the absolute basics of keeping them fed and clean, and then just as you've got the hang of that something new is introduce. Before you know it you're at month 24, and seemingly without effort juggling food, drink, changes, entertainment, nap times, and telling them what they just said is probably not appropriate in front of granny.
  - ArkyBeagle 11y ago
    That's exactly right. If you don't right away, it won't take long to find it. Never forget to tell them "you are my vengeance on this world."
- hluska 11y ago
  Congratulations!! I'm about to have a baby girl too (she is due on March 6). I've been really stressed out about this, so I set out to have as many conversations with other dads as I could. The best thing that I heard was that you just need to accept it as part of their maturing process. You won't get it because you aren't meant to get it. Then, I remind myself that when I was into AD&D, my Mom thought that I was worshipping Satan...:)
otoburb 11y ago
Which "Cat In The Hat" desktop program are you referring to? The CITH section of the PBS site, or something different? If the latter, then my Google-fu is currently failing me and would appreciate a pointer.
- cubano 11y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dtqzn6WuHk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dtqzn6WuHk it's been virtualized and mobilized and everything by now, but kids have been entranced by this since I was a kid and something about the rhymes and the the drawings just work.
abrkn 11y ago
"i luvu" via Gmail Ouch. Right in the onion sensor.
- mattdeboard 11y ago
  seriously. Memories of my 12-year-old doing the same.
ank_the_elder 11y ago
If I may... http://i.imgur.com/6e50Kwl.jpg http://i.imgur.com/6e50Kwl.jpg
- MichaelApproved 11y ago
  Please don't. It lowers the bar for the type of comments on HN.
joezydeco 11y ago
My 7 year old sends me strings of poop emojis.
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  My kids were running around when they were 5 doing the Minions "bee-doo-bee-doo-bee-doo!" until my wife said "ENOUGH!" They went to one of their iPods and SMSed "bee-doo!" to my wife. I don't think I've ever been prouder as a parent.
- smellf 11y ago
  My wife does this to me :(
dorfsmay 11y ago
My house is a Linux house, so Thunderbird for mail. Over the years, it went from "that sucks compared to gmail" (didn't need to introduce gmail, friends I guess), to "Thunderbird is for our real email with our real domain, gmail accounts are for the other stuff" I gave all the internet safety tips I could over the years, I don't want to know what "the other stuff" are!
cnr 11y ago
This "Cat In The Hat" app looks quite nice. Is it Mac/iOS only? I can't find version for Windows :(

by cubano 11y ago

sandworm101 11y ago

I'm biased by my perceptive (legal) but imho girls between 12 and 18 should not be allowed connected cameras. I've had too many conversations with horrified fathers and crying children after a disturbing image ends up somewhere it was never meant to be. There are just too many people, and I include cops in this, out there looking to get kids into serious trouble. I know that kids live a life in pictures, but that public record of everyday activities too often come back to haunt them. And fyi for fathers: Do not share a phone with your daughter. Do not borrow her phone, nor lend her yours. Some pictures are fine to be in her possession but if found in your possession could destroy your world.

jsmeaton 11y ago
Not boys? Boys send nudes too, and often request them. Isn't that soliciting child porn? We need to be feeding kids (boys and girls) way more information and hoping they don't mess up too badly.
- sandworm101 11y ago
  I have yet to see a boy in my office. I'm in no doubt that it happens every day, but the cases I've had contact with all involved young girls, or at least images of them. I think there is a different dynamic with males. Boys seem to show off by photographing themselves with things, with cars, cash or even tigers. [see link] Girls seem more likely to create images focusing on their person or their friends' persons. There is also some sexual dimorphism at work. Boys simply have less to physically cover, probably making inappropriate or accidentally inappropriate images less likely. http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/06/25/new_york_bans_tiger_selfies_what_will_tinder_users_do.html http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/06/25/new_york_bans... http://tinderguyswithtigers.tumblr.com/ http://tinderguyswithtigers.tumblr.com/
- qrendel 11y ago
  Maybe we could instead go after the people who want to make careers out of destroying teenage lives with trumped-up child pornography charges? They seem like the real enemy in this stuff.
  - jsmeaton 11y ago
    Oh, that shit is awful too don't get me wrong. I was just trying to make the point that both boys and girls can get in serious trouble (legally and personally/socially). I don't get or agree with the sentiment that teen girls, alone, should not have access to cameras. Attacking the wrong part of the problem.
  - lmm 11y ago
    Are you going to be the representative or congressman who proposes a bill to decriminalise child porn? Or the president who signs an executive order to not prosecute child porn cases? How do you think that would play in the media and with the voters?
    - qrendel 11y ago
      I'm aware of that feedback loop, but the comments I see here seem to view that kind of Draconian treatment of people, ones who are obviously not child pornographers or dangerous individuals, as a problem. So there seems to be at least a subset of voters who recognize the issue and think it's absurd. This is partly a problem of common knowledge[1] - where lots of people are thinking the laws are absurd, but no one wants to be the first to say it openly, because they can't know for certain that anyone else is thinking the same thing. Getting a conversation going about how ridiculous some of these prosecutions for "child porn" are would be the first step towards a sane discussion of what those kinds of child protection laws should actually be, when they should be applied and when they shouldn't, etc, so that it stops being a third rail for lawmakers. Might also point out that the recently passed "International Megan's Law" actually places a permanent mark on these people's passports labeling them as sex offenders.[2] These cases of a dad being permanently marked as a sex offender just for letting his daughter borrow his phone, or a 19 yro getting a naked pic from his 17 yro girlfriend, only end up being counterproductive to protecting the real victims. When you hear of someone labeled as a "sex offender" now, does it serve as a reliable warning? Or do you just wonder if the guy was unlucky enough to get caught pissing in public? [1] http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=2410 http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=2410 [2] http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/02/obama_signs_international_megans_law.html http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2016/02/obama_signs_int...
tallanvor 11y ago
> And fyi for fathers: Do not share a phone with your daughter. Do not borrow her phone, nor lend her yours. Some pictures are fine to be in her possession but if found in your possession could destroy your world. And the fact that you have to say that is a great example of what's wrong with the legal system in the US. Common sense about applying laws has been stripped away.
dcposch 11y ago
> imho girls between 12 and 18 should not be allowed connected cameras are you saying they shouldnt have a phone until they turn 18? that sounds super unrealistic i think its important to respect their intelligence. >There are just too many people, and I include cops in this, out there looking to get kids into serious trouble maybe that is the problem we need to solve. saying a young woman in high school shouldnt be allowed a phone sounds like victim blaming

daveloyall 11y ago

Cat In The Hat desktop software? Hm, I searched and found more than one. Various companies: The Learning Company. Borderbund. MacKiev. Which did you have?

matmann2001 11y ago
My younger brother had the Borderbund one. I recall it being a pretty decent piece of software.

Avalaxy 11y ago

Sorry for being an old-ass as well, but wasn't snapchat created to send nudes to other people in a way that they are automatically erased and can't be saved? I don't know if people still use it like that, but do you feel comfortable letting your 12 years old daughter use something like that?

Tactic 11y ago
As an old-ass father of 3 that pokes here and there I can tell you that does happen. However, that is hardly the point of it. It is because everyone needs to be able to say and do things that aren't recorded. That go away. And kids need space to experiment and grow in ways they are not watched. Honestly, from what I can tell it is used far more for making funny faces and moments than anything else. Besides, if you are concerned that they are showing each other their bodies you have more to worry about than snapchat because it is going to happen regardless. At least nobody has got an STD from snapchat. And after the things I found when doing a backup of my 16 year old's computer I'm more concerned with the pictures that stick around than don't. We had a talk about why I never want pictures of naked teenage friends on my network. But if you think you can stifle teenagers, you are wrong. You just push them into the shadows and you out of their life.
- ambicapter 11y ago
  Yes, but you know snapchat pictures aren't really deleted right? 'Temporary pictures' is a proposition that doesn't actually exist in the digital realm, and certainly not when a VC-backed company is proposing it.
  - lurkinggrue 11y ago
    Compared to facebook they go away and it's more a "Probably" goes away. I'm sure there will be a few snapchat users that will get screwed by this but at least the majority of the use will vanish before these kids are old enough for jobs and the shit they did on snapchat doesn't show up in a background check.

ceocoder 11y ago

man this is scary for me, I'm about to have a baby girl (she already has a Gmail account), I know I'm far from the "dad doesn't get 'it'" phase, but it is still scary. Do you have any tips to make this transition easy?

matt_morgan 11y ago
Every kid is different. You'll know what to do.
- rrauenza 11y ago
  The great thing starting with a baby is you get to grow with them -- you don't have to be an expert right off the bat. Gloria Wall (mother of four, spouse of Larry Wall) also has great advice that is worth repeating: You don't have to be an expert in children to be a parent -- you only have to be an expert in _your_ children.
  - jon-wood 11y ago
    Just after our son was born this was wonderfully summed up by a friend of mine as being like levelling up in a game. You start off with the absolute basics of keeping them fed and clean, and then just as you've got the hang of that something new is introduce. Before you know it you're at month 24, and seemingly without effort juggling food, drink, changes, entertainment, nap times, and telling them what they just said is probably not appropriate in front of granny.
- ArkyBeagle 11y ago
  That's exactly right. If you don't right away, it won't take long to find it. Never forget to tell them "you are my vengeance on this world."
hluska 11y ago
Congratulations!! I'm about to have a baby girl too (she is due on March 6). I've been really stressed out about this, so I set out to have as many conversations with other dads as I could. The best thing that I heard was that you just need to accept it as part of their maturing process. You won't get it because you aren't meant to get it. Then, I remind myself that when I was into AD&D, my Mom thought that I was worshipping Satan...:)

otoburb 11y ago

Which "Cat In The Hat" desktop program are you referring to? The CITH section of the PBS site, or something different? If the latter, then my Google-fu is currently failing me and would appreciate a pointer.

cubano 11y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dtqzn6WuHk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dtqzn6WuHk it's been virtualized and mobilized and everything by now, but kids have been entranced by this since I was a kid and something about the rhymes and the the drawings just work.

abrkn 11y ago

"i luvu" via Gmail Ouch. Right in the onion sensor.

mattdeboard 11y ago
seriously. Memories of my 12-year-old doing the same.

ank_the_elder 11y ago

If I may... http://i.imgur.com/6e50Kwl.jpg http://i.imgur.com/6e50Kwl.jpg

MichaelApproved 11y ago
Please don't. It lowers the bar for the type of comments on HN.

joezydeco 11y ago

My 7 year old sends me strings of poop emojis.

ceejayoz 11y ago
My kids were running around when they were 5 doing the Minions "bee-doo-bee-doo-bee-doo!" until my wife said "ENOUGH!" They went to one of their iPods and SMSed "bee-doo!" to my wife. I don't think I've ever been prouder as a parent.
smellf 11y ago
My wife does this to me :(

dorfsmay 11y ago

My house is a Linux house, so Thunderbird for mail. Over the years, it went from "that sucks compared to gmail" (didn't need to introduce gmail, friends I guess), to "Thunderbird is for our real email with our real domain, gmail accounts are for the other stuff" I gave all the internet safety tips I could over the years, I don't want to know what "the other stuff" are!

cnr 11y ago

This "Cat In The Hat" app looks quite nice. Is it Mac/iOS only? I can't find version for Windows :(