4 ms·

All of those problems are political; ie, we already know how to build more densely, how to make better trains, how to zone, etc. etc. For that matter, I doubt

All of those problems are political; ie, we already know how to build more densely, how to make better trains, how to zone, etc. etc. For that matter, I doubt Uber for Houses would be successful (ignore all permits and just build).

surfmike 11y ago
Excavation is expensive and that's the main reason people don't use it. Trains are hard to build in established areas but self-driving cars, ride sharing, and hyper loop point to new ways enabled by technology. I agree that zoning is the big political obstacle. But I feel like some development entrepreneurs could convince some cities and make some great examples of dense livable neighborhoods.
- abakker 11y ago
  In can't help but think that the only real answer to getting housing to be appropriately cheap is to manufacture it 100% off site and bring it to the site in easy to assemble pieces.
  - surfmike 11y ago
    edit: The more I think about it, the more I think this is important regardless of the cost of land. If it became cheaper to "start over" and redevelop underused lots, you could scale up density a lot faster. In that vein, technology to make demolition cheaper/faster would help too. --- original: That's definitely part of it. But cost of land often dwarfs the construction costs. And some things like excavation (which lets you avoid wasting land on low-value uses) need to be done on site.
    - abakker 11y ago
      The major cost in time is also weather related. Materials are damaged if they sit in the rain, things have to be done in a specific order, in many places the livable build season is short (in the rocky mountain states, eg.) and the opportunity fir error is huge. If things arrive as a mostly prefab kit, then things are faster to put up on site, which avoids tons of complexity. It especially avoids a lot of the challenges with multiple subcontractors and scheduling. Making demolition cheaper and easier would be a major improvement. Of course, demolition is one area where care is very important, for safety of the workers and the environment. It is amazing the types of hazmat that are in old buildings and houses. (Asbestos, lead, mercury, etc.) Containing it all is very hard.
  - imtringued 11y ago
    Isn't that the whole point of prefab houses?
miguelrochefort 11y ago
You know those capsule hotels in Japan? I could easily see the same thing being implemented, except as appartments, in the US. - You get there, strip down, leave your stuff in a locker, put a clean bathrobe on. - Go to your room to sleep, browse the web on a tablet, watch a movie. - Go to one of the many restaurants to eat a breakfast, lunch or dinner. - Go to one of the many theatre rooms, to watch a movie, watch a live event, watch the news, etc. - Go to the bathroom or shower (soap, shampoo, razor, deodorant, toothbrush included). - Go to the gym, pool, spa, sauna, etc. - Meet people. Play chess. Have a coffee. You basically come back from work/life to a simple indoor resort every single day, and get to relax and disconnect for a while. You don't have anything to maintain or worry about. Calm, by yourself or with others, at the end of each day. That's the dream.
- krapp 11y ago
  Those capsule hotels aren't meant for long-term occupancy. Such extreme confinement may be a dream for you but I think most people would consider it torture. Nevertheless, I do think it's worth trying as temporary housing. I certainly might be willing to drop into one for a night or two if I had a job interview somewhere.
  - logfromblammo 11y ago
    The most important factors are going to be as follows: - Freedom to come and go at will - Security for personal possessions - Safety for all occupants - Affordable price with utilities - Permanent mailing address Also, I think 250 sq.ft. per couple is the absolute minimum viable apartment space in the US market. Anything smaller will always be seen as transient housing, except for those committed to lifelong celibacy or those who are trained astronauts. It may well be that renting your own coffin is psychologically better than borrowing someone else's couch, or camping out somewhere. But once you've been in it for a while, you're eventually going to want enough room to stretch out without banging into a wall. If you reduce your maximum occupancy by a factor of 32 on the same floor area, you would probably increase duration of tenancy from days or weeks to years.

surfmike 11y ago

Excavation is expensive and that's the main reason people don't use it. Trains are hard to build in established areas but self-driving cars, ride sharing, and hyper loop point to new ways enabled by technology. I agree that zoning is the big political obstacle. But I feel like some development entrepreneurs could convince some cities and make some great examples of dense livable neighborhoods.

abakker 11y ago
In can't help but think that the only real answer to getting housing to be appropriately cheap is to manufacture it 100% off site and bring it to the site in easy to assemble pieces.
- surfmike 11y ago
  edit: The more I think about it, the more I think this is important regardless of the cost of land. If it became cheaper to "start over" and redevelop underused lots, you could scale up density a lot faster. In that vein, technology to make demolition cheaper/faster would help too. --- original: That's definitely part of it. But cost of land often dwarfs the construction costs. And some things like excavation (which lets you avoid wasting land on low-value uses) need to be done on site.
  - abakker 11y ago
    The major cost in time is also weather related. Materials are damaged if they sit in the rain, things have to be done in a specific order, in many places the livable build season is short (in the rocky mountain states, eg.) and the opportunity fir error is huge. If things arrive as a mostly prefab kit, then things are faster to put up on site, which avoids tons of complexity. It especially avoids a lot of the challenges with multiple subcontractors and scheduling. Making demolition cheaper and easier would be a major improvement. Of course, demolition is one area where care is very important, for safety of the workers and the environment. It is amazing the types of hazmat that are in old buildings and houses. (Asbestos, lead, mercury, etc.) Containing it all is very hard.
- imtringued 11y ago
  Isn't that the whole point of prefab houses?

miguelrochefort 11y ago

You know those capsule hotels in Japan? I could easily see the same thing being implemented, except as appartments, in the US. - You get there, strip down, leave your stuff in a locker, put a clean bathrobe on. - Go to your room to sleep, browse the web on a tablet, watch a movie. - Go to one of the many restaurants to eat a breakfast, lunch or dinner. - Go to one of the many theatre rooms, to watch a movie, watch a live event, watch the news, etc. - Go to the bathroom or shower (soap, shampoo, razor, deodorant, toothbrush included). - Go to the gym, pool, spa, sauna, etc. - Meet people. Play chess. Have a coffee. You basically come back from work/life to a simple indoor resort every single day, and get to relax and disconnect for a while. You don't have anything to maintain or worry about. Calm, by yourself or with others, at the end of each day. That's the dream.

krapp 11y ago
Those capsule hotels aren't meant for long-term occupancy. Such extreme confinement may be a dream for you but I think most people would consider it torture. Nevertheless, I do think it's worth trying as temporary housing. I certainly might be willing to drop into one for a night or two if I had a job interview somewhere.
- logfromblammo 11y ago
  The most important factors are going to be as follows: - Freedom to come and go at will - Security for personal possessions - Safety for all occupants - Affordable price with utilities - Permanent mailing address Also, I think 250 sq.ft. per couple is the absolute minimum viable apartment space in the US market. Anything smaller will always be seen as transient housing, except for those committed to lifelong celibacy or those who are trained astronauts. It may well be that renting your own coffin is psychologically better than borrowing someone else's couch, or camping out somewhere. But once you've been in it for a while, you're eventually going to want enough room to stretch out without banging into a wall. If you reduce your maximum occupancy by a factor of 32 on the same floor area, you would probably increase duration of tenancy from days or weeks to years.