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More evidence emerges for 'transmissible Alzheimer's' theory
- andrewclunn 11y agoAnecdotally, I am aware that many in my family who developed alzheimer's (it runs on both side of my family) has surgery a few years before the disease started to present itself. Though the likelihood of there being much of a connection seems far fetched, even with this latest evidence, I have suddenly become much more concerned about going under the knife until this is all worked out. The grafts I get, but that proteins lingering on equipment, which isn't ordinarily removed through standard sterilization, could be a means of transmission... scary.
- ceejayoz 11y agoI'd be cautious about relying on anecdotal data here. This may be a bit like the "my kid got autism after vaccines" confirmation bias issue - as people get older, they're more likely to need surgical interventions.
- mc32 11y agoThese cases involved brain tissues. So unless you're having brain surgery done, there are other more mundane complications to worry about.
- Gibbon1 11y agoCourse there are prion diseases which can be spread by ingesting infected nervous system tissue. Kuru, Mad cow disease and scrapie come to mind.
- SixSigma 11y agoThe long term effects of surgery are just coming to light. While, obviously, it is better to have an operation than die, it seems that you don't recover as quickly as your meat heals. Anecdotal I know but I believe it took me 10 years to get over my bowel resection. And then there's the anesthesia : http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/hidden-dangers-of-going-under/ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/hidden-dangers-of-...
- nommm-nommm 11y agoThe anesthesia is scary - my grandpa-in-law was never the same after he had surgery. He went in totally lucid and came out of surgury totally out of it with dementia-like symptoms. It was permanent and it made him have to go into a home. He didn't even know who I was anymore. The surgery itself was routine and very uneventful but the difference in mental function pre and post op were as dramatic as night and day - and permanent. I mentioned it to my doctor in casual conversation and she says she has seen that happen before when older people have surgery, especially those in not so great health. The article says "researchers hit on two other factors that increased the chances a patient would become dramatically confused after an operation: being older than about 70." He was about 80.
- scott_s 11y agoI wonder if he had a stroke while under anesthesia - but maybe they would have seen that?
- mgpc 11y agoThe same thing happened to my grandmother. She went in for a minor hernia operation, and came out a different person. She never recovered. It was very dramatic and very sad.
- jowiar 11y agoSame thing happened to my grandfather as well -- late 70s, was put under to have a small bladder tumor removed, came out of the anesthesia delirious, and was in a nursing home for the rest of his life. Scary, and terrible.
- elfyhat 11y agoWow, thanks for that link about anesthesia! I never thought to look into anesthesia being the culprit of what I'm about to relate.. 5 years ago I underwent major surgery after an incident. I remember one day being fine and normal and then my next memories are of me slowly becoming self-aware, conscious & lucid again in a hospital bed over the course of somewhere between 15-30 days (I'm not sure I can pin-point a specific time I became fully aware of where I was and what had happened). The period of time in between my surgery and when I was fully awake was without a doubt the most terrifying experience of my life. Mentally, I was in a nightmare state for what felt like a large extent of the time that I was 'out of it.' I still have memories and images in my mind today of the dreams I experienced falling in and out of consciousness while slowly 'waking' up over a month.
- JoshTriplett 11y agoSomewhat misleading headline; critical quote from the article: "Neither study implies that Alzheimer’s disease could ever be transmitted through normal contact with caretakers or family members, the scientists emphasize." This study purely covered transmission via a specific kind of transplant. Still important for understanding the disease, though.
- ars 11y agoBut another critical part is that this might be transmitted by surgical instruments, which apparently can not be cleaned well enough. That would be huge if true.
- hammock 11y ago> surgical instruments, which apparently can not be cleaned well enough. It's a problem. Previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10171077 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10171077
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- frozenport 11y agoThis isn't true, many surgical instruments are disposed after use. Here is a picture of a needle: http://forums.steroid.com/attachments/anabolic-steroids-questions-answers/35557d1088522377-rubbing-alcohol-clean-1-time-used-needle-needle2.jpg http://forums.steroid.com/attachments/anabolic-steroids-ques...
- ambicapter 11y agoThe last picture in that set is at a higher magnification than the three others.
- ars 11y ago> many surgical instruments are disposed after use What do you mean "isn't true", what about the ones that aren't disposed of? Since some are disposed of, that means I should somehow not worry about that ones that aren't? And that picture is misleading.
- Someone1234 11y agoDoes this improve the likelihood that it is treatable? Some previous theories had been that Alzheimer's was essentially genetic. But never fully genetic, instead of guaranteeing your chance of getting it, it just increases the likelihood. So my question is: Could this hint at Alzheimer's being the result of some yet undetected infection in the brain that some people are more prone to due to genetics, and that is transmitted due to brain tissue sharing? PS - What I am asking about isn't that far from the latest research, see: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/574944_4 http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/574944_4
- Spooky23 11y agoOr maybe an alternate type disease that is hard to detect like mad cow disease.
- ekianjo 11y agoThere is some ongoing research as well to establish whether or not AZ is a form a brain diabetes. But at this stage the amyloid hypothesis is still considered the most probable.
- JamesBarney 11y agoMy understanding was that they weren't separate hypotheses but one. I thought amyloid beta interrupted insulin signalling which then lead to all of the downstream effects of neuroinflammation, cell death, oxidative stress, glutamate toxicity, etc etc. But I've never been super clear on the type 3 diabetes explanation.
- alexholehouse 11y agoBoth this result and the preceding paper are also entirely consistent with the hypotheses that: 1) People who are susceptible to vCJD are more susceptible to AD 2) The (cellular) stress caused by vCJD increases susceptibility for AD 3) People who have had brain surgery (a traumatic and stressful experience in terms of brain swelling) are more susceptible to AD All three of which would be entirely inline with the fields' current way of thinking about AD, proteostasis, CBI etc. Which is not to say I actually don't think that there is a transmissible element, but I think we should avoid jumping to conclusions...
- pc2g4d 11y agoBut what about the CJD controls that didn't receive transplants derived from cadaver tissue? Those didn't show the same rate of Alzheimers-like plaques, if I understood the report correctly.
- alexholehouse 11y agoThe CJD controls had sporadic (sCJD), not variant CJD (vCJD) (whether or not these are distinct diseases is certainly an open question - I'm more trying to make the point that there are a lot of variables up in the air, and while it's a striking relationship there are other equally striking relationships one could draw).
- pc2g4d 11y agoA good note of caution for any study.
- clord 11y agoCould it be that Alzheimer's plaque is the ultimate expression of an attempt by the body to deal with CJD?