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As someone who tangentially works in the industry, you couldn't be more wrong. Ads literally subsidize the vast majority of content you consume on the internet.

As someone who tangentially works in the industry, you couldn't be more wrong. Ads literally subsidize the vast majority of content you consume on the internet. More importantly, ads subsidize and promote innovation. Without ads, we wouldn't have sites like youtube, facebook, reddit or pretty much every website that doesn't rely on donations (wikipedia, etc). It's interesting just how much of a disconnect young people have with this topic (in my experience, older people are skeptical of all the free content on the 'net. My grandmother thought she was going to get a bill from youtube for watching so many videos and not having to pay anything up front). Perhaps it's one of the reasons why they call our generation "the entitled generation". We've always had free content on the internet so we don't appreciate or understand how the people who create that content get paid.

marssaxman 11y ago
I'd be totally OK with all that subsidy going away if it meant we didn't have to deal with ads anymore. We'll figure it out. People would put more effort into peer-to-peer sharing networks if it weren't for the fact that ad-subsidized "free" services based on giant datacenters are so good at undercutting them.
- mahranch 11y ago
  You're missing the point, perhaps missing the scale. You don't understand just how vital ads are to the internet. Content itself wouldn't exist for you to view. There would be very little (nothing at all) for you to P2P. The internet would essentially be the IRC. People don't write in-depth articles for the hell of it. They expect to get paid.
  - marssaxman 11y ago
    Most of what I'm interested in using the internet for worked just fine before ads came along: better, in some cases, because volunteer efforts didn't have to compete with advertising budgets.
mike-cardwell 11y ago
Without ads we would have developed alternative revenue streams or different styles of architecture which don't place all of the costs and power in the lap of centralised organisations. Ads have crippled innovation on the Internet, not promoted it.
- mahranch 11y ago
  > Ads have crippled innovation on the Internet, not promoted it. The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. So your premise is wrong. Ads are the biggest driver of innovation on the internet right now. Inherently so. Because people want to get paid so they get more and more creative. Everything from youtube videos to web content, to science articles. They all flourish and exist because of ads, not because of your make believe hypothetical solution. You know, the one that is still not invented, nor have you even explained it. If such a solution was possible, we'd be using that instead. Until then, let's stick to reality, thanks.
  - dhimes 11y ago
    The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. I hope you are joking, or knowingly exaggerating. The internet was around waaaayyyyy before ads. Even when hte internet became a conduit for commerce, the first ads were just banners that advertisers bought on a (usually) related web page. Kind of like newspapers. Then Google decided that they would show ads based on what people were looking for. Rather than guessing my interests because I'm on the West Marine web page, they will show me ads related to my search inquiry. Starts to get a little creepy, but as long as they don't save my queries it's probably ok. <insert a montage/> And now we are where we are today.
  - mike-cardwell 11y ago
    "The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. So your premise is wrong" This statement is so laughably and obviously wrong to anyone that is aware of the history of the Internet, or has the abilitiy to think logically. "Ads are the biggest driver of innovation on the internet right now. Inherently so" That is completely irrelevant to whether or not the Internet would exist and be good if Ads didn't exist. "Because people want to get paid so they get more and more creative" You don't seem to be aware of the difference between "getting paid" and "getting paid by using ads" "Everything from youtube videos to web content, to science articles. They all flourish and exist because of ads" Again, this is laughably wrong to anyone with the capability of thinking. "your make believe hypothetical solution" - You mean, "pay for content". Yay, I know that's crazy! The reason that we don't have good ways to pay for content, is because Ads have made that incredibly difficult, because Ads give the illusion that you're getting something for free. How do you compete with that? You can't. Because Ads are here, and they're ruining the Internet, and they're ruining any innovation that would occur in non-Ad payment methods.
dhimes 11y ago
No no no. Your grandmother grew up with free media: radio and television have always been free and ad-supported. In fact, the first thing that likely pissed her off was getting ads on her cable channels, because the "rich" folks paid for cable, which was ad-free (except, I believe, the broadcast channel, but we didn't have it so I'm not sure). Internet advertising used to be done far less creepily. For example, you can do context-advertising: show me an ad for surfboards when I'm reading about surfing. I have no problem with that. You can guess that I'm interested in surfing if I'm reading the article. You don't need my shopping history for that.
- guyzero 11y ago
  Cable has never been ad-free with the exception of channels that people explicitly paid extra for like HBO.

marssaxman 11y ago

I'd be totally OK with all that subsidy going away if it meant we didn't have to deal with ads anymore. We'll figure it out. People would put more effort into peer-to-peer sharing networks if it weren't for the fact that ad-subsidized "free" services based on giant datacenters are so good at undercutting them.

mahranch 11y ago
You're missing the point, perhaps missing the scale. You don't understand just how vital ads are to the internet. Content itself wouldn't exist for you to view. There would be very little (nothing at all) for you to P2P. The internet would essentially be the IRC. People don't write in-depth articles for the hell of it. They expect to get paid.
- marssaxman 11y ago
  Most of what I'm interested in using the internet for worked just fine before ads came along: better, in some cases, because volunteer efforts didn't have to compete with advertising budgets.

mike-cardwell 11y ago

Without ads we would have developed alternative revenue streams or different styles of architecture which don't place all of the costs and power in the lap of centralised organisations. Ads have crippled innovation on the Internet, not promoted it.

mahranch 11y ago
> Ads have crippled innovation on the Internet, not promoted it. The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. So your premise is wrong. Ads are the biggest driver of innovation on the internet right now. Inherently so. Because people want to get paid so they get more and more creative. Everything from youtube videos to web content, to science articles. They all flourish and exist because of ads, not because of your make believe hypothetical solution. You know, the one that is still not invented, nor have you even explained it. If such a solution was possible, we'd be using that instead. Until then, let's stick to reality, thanks.
- dhimes 11y ago
  The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. I hope you are joking, or knowingly exaggerating. The internet was around waaaayyyyy before ads. Even when hte internet became a conduit for commerce, the first ads were just banners that advertisers bought on a (usually) related web page. Kind of like newspapers. Then Google decided that they would show ads based on what people were looking for. Rather than guessing my interests because I'm on the West Marine web page, they will show me ads related to my search inquiry. Starts to get a little creepy, but as long as they don't save my queries it's probably ok. <insert a montage/> And now we are where we are today.
- mike-cardwell 11y ago
  "The internet itself wouldn't even exist without ads. So your premise is wrong" This statement is so laughably and obviously wrong to anyone that is aware of the history of the Internet, or has the abilitiy to think logically. "Ads are the biggest driver of innovation on the internet right now. Inherently so" That is completely irrelevant to whether or not the Internet would exist and be good if Ads didn't exist. "Because people want to get paid so they get more and more creative" You don't seem to be aware of the difference between "getting paid" and "getting paid by using ads" "Everything from youtube videos to web content, to science articles. They all flourish and exist because of ads" Again, this is laughably wrong to anyone with the capability of thinking. "your make believe hypothetical solution" - You mean, "pay for content". Yay, I know that's crazy! The reason that we don't have good ways to pay for content, is because Ads have made that incredibly difficult, because Ads give the illusion that you're getting something for free. How do you compete with that? You can't. Because Ads are here, and they're ruining the Internet, and they're ruining any innovation that would occur in non-Ad payment methods.

dhimes 11y ago

No no no. Your grandmother grew up with free media: radio and television have always been free and ad-supported. In fact, the first thing that likely pissed her off was getting ads on her cable channels, because the "rich" folks paid for cable, which was ad-free (except, I believe, the broadcast channel, but we didn't have it so I'm not sure). Internet advertising used to be done far less creepily. For example, you can do context-advertising: show me an ad for surfboards when I'm reading about surfing. I have no problem with that. You can guess that I'm interested in surfing if I'm reading the article. You don't need my shopping history for that.

guyzero 11y ago
Cable has never been ad-free with the exception of channels that people explicitly paid extra for like HBO.