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Ask HN: What sites do you use to find contract work?

358 points by the_wheel 11y ago

mathgeek 11y ago
Welcome to HN! You'll find that this was asked previously: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8908279 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8908279
- Roedou 11y ago
  Good find, thanks for sharing that link. It's interesting that the other thread was 364 days ago, which would have been exactly this same Monday last year (ie: the beginning of the third week of Jan.)
  - 8draco8 11y ago
    Blue Monday, the most depressing day of the year.
dustingetz 11y ago
HN who's hiring threads, exclusively update: I post my pitch in the freelancer thread and potential clients contact me, for example https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9998249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9998249
- darklighter3 11y ago
  Have you had success replying to those posts and asking 'Would you consider a freelancer for this position?' or how do you go about it since these threads seem to implicitly indicate that they're looking for employees?
  - dustingetz 11y ago
    I definitely don't do that. I posted once in the who-wants-to-be-hired thread, but I don't do that anymore, because I had one guy get really angry once he realized I didn't want to be his employee, he accused me of bait-and-switching him to outsourced development (LOL). I was open to perm/ft work at the time for the right fit (which this guy wasn't), but his response was so visceral that I decided it was just a bad form to post there knowing for 95% of inquiries there was no chance of me going perm and that for the longshot 5% i would probably find them through another channel.
  - aantix 11y ago
    Don't ask, tell. Tell them your credentials and how you're going to solve their immediate problem. Don't beg them "please hire me even though I'm remote!", spell out that you're a seasoned veteran, here's my code on Github and my open source projects with the air of confidence that if "you don't hire me, someone else will."
- zerr 11y ago
  The bad thing about HN is that C++ and REMOTE is almost nonexistent in a single posting.
thibaut_barrere 11y ago
I've been contracting, consulting & freelancing for the last 10 years (5 years completely remote). My advice is to avoid "searching contract work", but reverse the situation completely: make your new clients find you instead. I wrote about this in depth here: https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you-rather-than-you-chasing-them https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you.... Sites /can/ work (I know people who make a good living off certain sites), but nothing will beat self-managed marketing on the long run. Feel free to email me (see profile) if you have specific questions. Good luck!
- innertracks 11y ago
  Your blog and twitter feed are very helpful. I was doing part time consulting, mostly web-related, for a number of years. Getting myself focused in this new phase of life has been challenging. You are clearly focused in your online presence. Clear "Hire Me" call to actions among other things, too. Time for me to do them. Thanks!
andreasklinger 11y ago
I used to do a lot of contract work. I can't tell you what you should do - but here is what i did and it worked for me Two approaches: 1) Work for one large client and essentially become an employee (consider this. a lot of startups pay good money for remote employees) 2) Work for multiple clients Focusing on #2 here Core rule: You want to be paid premium for quality and service. Avoid marketplaces - it's very hard to compete on quality here. Niche - the more focused you are on a (profitable) niche the better you can charge premium for domain competence As thibaut_barrere mentioned - Build a brand - i would even go further - create an agency like brand. At the point is stopped saying "I" but said "we" i was able to charge more. Dont charge by the hour but by the value - most developers charge their time - you want to charge the value you provide to the client. Read up on "willingness to pay" Most important: Deliver as promised and always try to over-deliver in service, quality, etc. Eg try to understand why the client asks for features and not only what features she/he asks for - you might be able to come up with better solutions or anticipate future requests. Any successful project should usually lead to improved reputation and more projects and clients. Good luck!
- aggieben 11y ago
  Don't charge by the hour but by the value This sounds like a recipe for disaster to me without a lot more explanation. Time is the main cost to a provider, so it's very natural that time would also be the driver for billing. "Charging for value" sounds like you're trying to say "fixed price" without actually saying it. I have many, many issues with trying to do fixed price projects of any appreciable size (say, more than 20-40 hours). What do you mean, precisely, by "charge by the value"?
  - jeffmould 11y ago
    https://training.kalzumeus.com/newsletters/archive/consulting_1 https://training.kalzumeus.com/newsletters/archive/consultin... http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/08/13/doubling-saas-revenue/ http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/08/13/doubling-saas-revenue/
  - DrJokepu 11y ago
    Really depends on the client. If your client is able to agree on tight specs and project plans, everyone is better off with fixed project fees. The client can more easily plan financially with a fixed budget. You can charge more, because instead of charging $DAILY_RATE * $DAYS, you can charge $REVENUE_CLIENT_WILL_MAKE_WITH_FEATURE - $THEIR_MARGIN, and the latter figure tends to be significantly higher. You can also deliver the project more quickly because now it's in your interest to do so. Everyone wins. That being said, if the client is unable to commit to tight specs and project plans, you need to revert to invoicing on a time & materials basis. But even if you do that, you should really charge a daily rate, rather than an hourly rate.
ThePhysicist 11y ago
I recently made it through the Toptal (http://www.toptal.com http://www.toptal.com) screening process but haven't taken on any work through their site yet, the hourly rate that you can ask there seems to be quite reasonable though compared to sites like upwork.com, where you will mostly compete with people that are willing to work for 10 $ / hour (which for someone living in a developed country is just not possible). For Germany, Gulp (www.gulp.de) is a very good site where you can actually find clients that are willing to pay a reasonable hourly rate (they even have a rate calculator on their site).
- zerr 11y ago
  Do you think having accounts at Gulp (and XING?) would help for a person outside Germany (and non-German speaker)? Are [prospective] clients on those sites interested in remote consultants?
  - ThePhysicist 11y ago
    it depends, most gigs are on-site but there are exceptions.
- imaginenore 11y ago
  What kind of rates do you see on TopTal?
  - ThePhysicist 11y ago
    at Toptal you can set your own rate in advance
    - imaginenore 11y ago
      I know, but that's not what I'm asking. Do you see any offers? I started registering on TopTal, but then got too lazy jumping through their hoops and not knowing what the upside is.
      - 11y ago
nbrempel 11y ago
I've never used a website. Reach out to everyone you know. Buy them a coffee, mention you are getting into contracting, ask who else you should talk to, thank them, repeat.
- decasteve 11y ago
  Have you ever just reached out to someone you don't know this way and had success? Cold calling or knocking on doors? I haven't been in a position to have this need but this whole comment thread made me think about doing it the "old-fashioned" way, rather than browsing the web meat/meet markets.
  - nbrempel 11y ago
    I've never reached out to someone I've never met but I've reached out to a lot of people that I met _super_ briefly. It let me go "remember me?" in an email I sent and it breaks the tension. People are surprisingly willing to help. I found that it wasn't the first degree connections that led to work but the second degree connections. Get your immediate network to introduce you to others and drum up work from them.
    - peter_l_downs 11y ago
      Not sure if you're aware of it, but this is a well-studied phenomenon. Check out Mark Granovetter's seminal paper "The Strengrth of Weak Ties" [0] [1], it's pretty interesting reading. [0] http://www.jstor.org/stable/2776392?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents http://www.jstor.org/stable/2776392?seq=1#page_scan_tab_cont... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Granovetter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Granovetter
gist 11y ago
I'd like a way, similar to the first of month feature (where employment possibilities are posted on HN) where you could post requirements for a software project and get responses from the hacker news community (or at least links to either relevant profiles or reputable hackers as suggestions). Edit: I mean on HN similar to the first of month feature not a site (I know these are out there obviously).
pmorici 11y ago
I would avoid sites like Upwork (aka: odesk), elance, and anything similar like the plague unless working for less than minimum wage and dealing with morons is your idea of good contract work. I suspect the secret to contract work success lies in having really good networking skills and a Rolodex of contacts from having worked in a given industry and having a reputation as someone who delivers. If you don't have that then you would probably have better luck finding reasonable work by going to meetups or similar industry events to build a network of professional contacts. The only way I know of to do this online is to become a notable contributor to prominent open source projects and then use that to leverage paid work.
- akshatpradhan 11y ago
  I disagree. I love Upwork, and I pay my contractors well. What Upwork provides me with is an incredible ability to keep payments maintained and work honest. There's a sense of honesty when using the oDesk application, where both parties can say, "we feel confident that parties will get paid, and work can be reviewed." Neither my contractors nor I would want to move to any other platform because no other platform provides that kind of honesty and confidence between Contractor and Employee.
  - pmorici 11y ago
    Would you be willing to share with us the average $/hr rate you pay your Upwork employees? I'd be willing to bet it is quite low. As an employer I can totally see why you would love it, it's an effective way to pay bottom dollar for simplistic computer tasks. From the stand point of someone looking to get into software engineer contract work it's lame. The guaranteed payment thing you are talking about is only for projects that are billed hourly. If you bid on a flat rate project there is no such guarantee. The hourly pay rate guarantee also requires you to install a spyware app on your computer to monitor your work.
    - jeddawson 11y ago
      I use upwork to sub-out work that I don't have time to tackle or for tasks that I lack expertise in. Once I've found someone on the platform that is really talented at what they do, I return to them for subsequent projects that need their skillset. The challenge on that platform is finding the people that stand out since there are so many low-bar contributors. Examples of work that I use it for are simple html/css stuff that just needs to get knocked out prior to integration into an app. I'll pay between $300-500 from some straight forward design to html/css conversion. I want it to be worth their while. Also, I've use it frequently for GIS work. I'm just not proficient in it and would rather pay someone that is. I managed to find an incredible person on upwork and give him the specs for each project before I quote my customers. He sets the price for the GIS components and I routinely encourage him to charge more. So to be clear, I don't use upwork to find a deal on the project (no doubt a ton of people do). I use it because it is a platform that can keep talented people busy and available for the next time I need to rely on them. I'd hire a full time GIS expert if I had steady work for the, but I don't so going with a subcontract makes a lot more sense.
fasouto 11y ago
Some people at HN will tell you the opposite but I find two of my best clients at Upwork. I didn't bid to low quality jobs and once I finish my job I offer them an maintenance contract outside upwork.
- sixQuarks 11y ago
  When I hire through Upwork, I ignore all the low hourly rate freelancers. I use a high hourly price as my first requirement. Few years ago, this worked quite well, but now there are some idiots that charge a high price for low quality work just to try to take advantage of people like me. So, now it takes some more time to filter through, but still works pretty well.
  - learc83 11y ago
    What do you consider a high hourly rate. Last time I looked, I didn't see anything above $50 an hour.
    - sixQuarks 11y ago
      Are you kidding me? There are lots of high hourly workers. I consider $40/hour as minimum, generally $65/hour or higher is where the line starts to separate between pros and average freelancers. I've seen as high as $150/hour.
awjr 11y ago
Which country? ;)
mirap 11y ago
Does anyone have good place to look for contract work in field of UX & Product design? I'm UX designer currently living in Prague, looking for remote work (and I'm open to relocate). My portfolio: http://podorsky.cz/ http://podorsky.cz/
peterbsmith 11y ago
Personal networks. I came into Syracuse knowing nobody and nothing. I had never done any app making as of January 2015. I had done some wordpress stuff, but just the basics. And I had (and have) no CS degree. I now make a living on contract work. I did it by going to local meetups and introducing myself as a freelance web developer. Nevermind that I hadn't done freelance web development ever. I kept going to meetups for month and still attend a monthly hacker meetup. I participated in hackathons without really knowing how to program. But all along the way I met people more experienced than I am and picked up two clients along the way. I think one thing that I do differently to most is that I charge a high rate (I always quote $150/hr). I am willing to negotiate lower than that but its a starting point. I have been paid that in the past for less complicated work like hiring developers and being a project manager. What am I saying? Your questions is what sites to use? Just one: meetup.com
- a_shane 11y ago
  I want to add a bit to your comment - it's important to try and identify the kind of meetups you'd like to attend that will help you meet your desired customer base, and the kinds that will help you get known in your local community (ie: meetups for web devs to connect). I find that meetups can sometimes become circle-jerks for people in a similar field to just get together and talk/humblebrag. Which is fine, but if that's not your goal you need to look at different meetups which serve that goal.
  - peterbsmith 11y ago
    Good point. Some meetups I went to were the exact circle-jerk/humblebragfests you're talking about. The one I consistently go to (shameless plug [OpenHack Syracuse](http://www.openhacksyr.com http://www.openhacksyr.com) is a monthly meetup for developers to talk about what projects they're working on and to spend time together working on projects, ideas, and sharing info. It's really just an organized hangout/hack session. And it's these types of meetups which are best for getting contract work (because contract work isn't the goal)
    - 11y ago
bcks 11y ago
I've had good success hiring developers for short-term project work through https://gun.io https://gun.io.
- eropple 11y ago
  I can't speak to the employment side of things, but the work side of things is disappointing. Their recommended gigs are scattershot and a lot of the ones they push ("in conjunction with gun.io" or similar verbiage--sounds like premium postings) are six-month, monopolize-all-your-time contracts at a low hourly rate. And they don't seem to respect their own site's rules, at least not the spirit of them: every once in a while I'm spammed with a '$1,000' offer from gun.io themselves that's really "we'll pay $100 for a blog post". Unfortunately I'm not sure that anybody else is much better! I still get most of my work through interpersonal connections and the occasional email from Hacker News readers.
- sirn 11y ago
  I tried to register for Gun.io and the first thing they want me to do is to write proposal to see if I could communicate, for skillsets that I don't have in a field that I have no knowledge of (GRE over IPSec). I make another try and now it's to write proposal for framework that I never used with explicit "no 'willing to learn' proposals" in the body text. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but if they're asking me to BS on the proposal just to see if I could communicate, then I have to say this is definitely not a good first impression.
- pekk 11y ago
  Good luck getting paid on gun.io, if the buyer just decides they want the work for free then they can take it and wander off. Gun.io doesn't care because who is bringing them money?
  - eropple 11y ago
    Is this a hypothetical, or are you speaking from experience?
dmitri1981 11y ago
For those who are London based, I recently launched a mailing list for members of the London Hacker News Meetup, which sends out contracts based on your language preference. It's averaging about 10 jobs a month at the moment however I am working on getting it to about 100 pm by the end of the year. The current sign up page is at http://eepurl.com/byq7Af http://eepurl.com/byq7Af
- Nursie 11y ago
  Interesting! I'm not London-based but am London-commute friendly so will check it out. (I've been contracting for about 3 years now, some in London)
- osullivj 11y ago
  No C# or C++ on signup page language list?
  - Nursie 11y ago
    Nor C, unfortunately. The list seems a little more narrowly targeted than I had anticipated.
    - osullivj 11y ago
      Yeah, seems very web dev centric.
JoeAltmaier 11y ago
My way was working at several successful startups, and then going into contracting. So I had contacts at every level of Silicon Valley. Might not work for everybody.
chilicuil 11y ago
Fiverr (https://www.fiverr.com/ https://www.fiverr.com/), tasks usually take less than an hour and give me enough revenue to pay domains and hosting for my pet projects.
- peterbsmith 11y ago
  Hey thats a really good idea! How long does it take to get started with that? Do you find a long lead time from signing up to building a reputation to getting a lot of gigs?
  - chilicuil 11y ago
    Depending in the gigs you offer your experience may differ, I do python/perl/sh scripts and sysop tasks and after a month I started receiving enough gigs a month (5-8) to pay my digital bills. I think logo designers, web developers and translators get a lot more traffic. I just recently was upgraded to 1st level seller after 3 months, so I think it's relatively fast.
- andy_boot 11y ago
  Got to disagree here. Even if your task takes only 30 minutes, by the time you add getting client's requirements and browsing for jobs each task will take 1 hour. You should not be working for $5 / hour.
quackware 11y ago
I get my clients primarily through gigster (http://www.gigster.com http://www.gigster.com), referrals, and my website.
- jcsnv 11y ago
  I'm having issues with Gigster. I did the first interview and passed. The subsequent follow ups (4 already!) have all been either postponed, interviewer no shows (yes really), or setup with the wrong interviewer. I understand there are growing pains, but not one of my emails have been responded to regarding this issue.
  - quackware 11y ago
    Yeah that's unfortunate... They are growing very quickly in terms on onboarding devs right now. They're also putting a lot of effort into building better tooling for interviewing / onboarding. I fortunately jumped on before the growth really got crazy.
  - gspyrou 11y ago
    A interview with Gigster was scheduled for today , I was waiting for 30 minutes in their conference tool but no one showed up.
- aquark 11y ago
  From the front page testimonial: > in less than 5 minutes the project was fully spec'd and underway. Honest question: why would I need a top '1% developer' for a project that can be fully spec'd in less than 5 minutes?
marknutter 11y ago
I posted this article on medium the other day that contains all the advice I've compiled after 8 years of freelancing as a software developer: https://medium.com/@marknutter/advice-for-the-freelance-developer-68b63c69b050 https://medium.com/@marknutter/advice-for-the-freelance-deve... In short, to answer your question, I never used any sites to find contract work. I got all my leads through face-to-face interaction with real humans in the real world, and a good deal of it came from word-of-mouth because of exceeding my clients' expectations. Contracting sites marginalize developers and the type of clients who troll them are typically the kind who will try to squeeze as much work out of developers for as little money as they can. On top of that, developers are generally a pretty introverted crowd, so the number of introverted and talented developers who troll those sites looking for work is far greater than the number of outgoing, personable developers in your local area. Which group do you want to compete against?
swimduck 11y ago
I have a different approach to finding contract work, particularly as I don't have much work experience. Upwork and similar websites have not worked well for me. Instead, I browse job boards and when I find an interesting role I contact the company. If they are interested in my background and the fit is right, I sell them on setting up a contract relationship instead of full-time employee. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn't. The important part is being honest that you are looking to work as a contractor, not an employee. Job boards to consider: AngelList, WeWorkRemotely etc. If you're looking for a list of job boards (http://nodesk.co http://nodesk.co has lots and so does this article by teleport http://teleport.org/2015/03/best-sites-for-remote-jobs/ http://teleport.org/2015/03/best-sites-for-remote-jobs/)
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
eswat 11y ago
I tackle this sideways by going to Meetup or Eventbrite. Specifically I go to meetups and events that potential buyers go to and let them know what I do (I don’t try to sell my services on first contact). It takes some pruning but after a while my preferred clients are the ones I keep in contact with and we start working. I get less work through this than just by referral though. Depending on your living situation and time available I’d recommend trying to establish your own identity so you don’t have to go through a marketplace for contract work. Instead you’ll have the contract work come to you and not filtered through a middleman that would take a cut out of your work. I would never recommend someone go through fiverr, Upwork or these other marketplaces unless they were just moonlighting.
joanofarc2016 11y ago
It'll cost money to hire a good hacker but if you can pay for it, onetimehacker@outlook.com can help you get this done in no time.
Nursie 11y ago
What's the context? Which country are you in? What are your skills? If you're in the UK... I've been contracting about 3 years now and started it the simple (and probably dumb) way - stick a resume up on jobsite.co.uk, wait for agents to call. Lots will. Be nice to them on the phone but be firm about what rates and locations you're willing to work. You'll get lots of useless ones who haven't even bothered to read it, but no matter, you'll learn to filter them out pretty quickly. Remember the good ones. Rinse, repeat. I've had two contracts now through reputation, which is quite nice, but getting contracts from previous workmates isn't a panacea. One of them was the most boring thing I've ever done in my life (worse than shelf-stacking in a warehouse) and I quit after three weeks because I was literally unable to complete the work it was so dull. I told the client that I was poor value for money and a recent graduate would be a better choice. The other one was good though! Also, make sure you're prepared for some time off between contracts, it's pretty much going to happen.
- millak 11y ago
  I'd be interested to hear how you made the jump to contracting? I find myself wanting to make the jump from my permanent job (in London) but being anxious about whether or not it's the right time to do so, if my skill set (sysadmin/devops) as it stands will provide value to clients, if I have the right mix of personal qualities to make a success out of it, etc.
  - Nursie 11y ago
    Bloody-mindedness mostly. I worked permanently for various companies in and around London for about 10 years, then got sick of London, moved to Australia, did a couple more years permanent work there, then decided to move back to the UK. At that point I was sick of being an employee and had a vague offer from a friend to help bootstrap a startup, which fell through. So in lieu of having an idea to start up a company myself I decided I was going to be a contractor, set myself up a limited company and started throwing my CV at anyone that asked. I have got most of my contracts through agencies that called me, not through contacts. Making the leap can be tricky - if you have a notice period longer than one month you may have to quit your current job and then look for contracts afterwards. A lot of people want contractors to start now. You may not find one for a month or more, I've had dry patches lasting a couple of months before, and it might be another month after you start before you can invoice, and it could be another month again before you get paid, so you need a financial cushion. As soon as you get your first contract you'll need an accountant. These come in at about £100 per month. I use Nixon Williams, this is not necessarily a recommendation, they deal with hundreds of contractors, the service is streamlined but pretty basic and if you need anything out of the ordinary they probably won't do it. Errr.... time of year may have an effect, like a lot of things it seems to be easier to find work in the first few months of the year, though I have had two start in November/December. Anything else you want to know?
joanofarc2016 11y ago
To contact a professional hacker for hire contact onetimehacker@outlook.com
joanofarc2016 11y ago
To hire a professional hacker, Contact onetimehacker at outlook com
qp9384btv_2e 11y ago
For those who do contract work, what is your policy on code-reuse between clients?
- eropple 11y ago
  It depends on my arrangement with a client. Work-for-hire contracts make reuse impossible, and so I tend to price higher, whereas a perpetual, transferable, etc. license to the code I work on has a better chance of being useful down the line and so I may knock a couple bucks off.
  - qp9384btv_2e 11y ago
    My thought was to develop a library for code re-use among clients. It would cover common problems/features. In your experience, do many contract workers have such a thing?
    - eropple 11y ago
      I dunno, but I wouldn't want to have such a thing in a stack. I reuse code like "hey, I've got this super nice Vagrant setup that makes life easier" or "I've got this Chef cookbook that's a little too specialized to meaningfully open-source but I can turn it around to help," rather than application-level code. If I had a library for application code-reuse, I'd just find a platform-appropriate library like Guava or something and try to get it in there, or open-source the whole thing myself.
    - err4nt 11y ago
      I dunno about others, but I sure do! I have CSS stylesheets in 7 colour themes, a dozen bootstrap-like JS plugins that add common interactive elements I can drop into any site, and tons of parts and pieces of layouts (like an order form, signup form, pricing chart, or media player) isolated and ready to re-use. I also maintain a big snippets file, filled with HTML, CSS, JS, and command-line snippets and tricks so I can grab them from anywhere. I dont know how any freelancer or contractor doesnt have a bag of tricks like this.
juliend2 11y ago
LinkedIn. I send a LinkedIn message to some of my contacts I'd like to work with, telling them it's been a while and that I'd like to get in touch, and offer them to take a cup of coffee with them this week. During the meeting, tell them about your freelance status and that you're looking for work. Good luck!
BorisMelnik 11y ago
I like to go to places like upwork or elance and seek out people in the US with low rep that haven't done a lot of jobs. A lot of times those people are ones for big companies that are stuck in a situation that need a quick hack put together. Do a good job and you get put on their 'list' for future use.
jameslk 11y ago
I've been contracting/consulting for a couple of years now. Most my contracts have come through referrals (of friends) and sometimes recruiters. However, I was able to start my contracting career thanks to a contract that came through Toptal. This allowed me to quit my job and do this full-time. Here's my list of resources that I would be looking at if I needed to start looking for a contract immediately: Boards: - Authentic Jobs: http://www.authenticjobs.com/ http://www.authenticjobs.com/ - StackOverflow Careers: http://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?type=contract&allowsremote=true http://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?type=contract&allowsre... - We Work Remotely: https://weworkremotely.com/jobs/search?term=contract https://weworkremotely.com/jobs/search?term=contract - Angelist: https://angel.co/jobs https://angel.co/jobs - Github Jobs: https://jobs.github.com/ https://jobs.github.com/ - Hired: https://hired.com/contract-jobs https://hired.com/contract-jobs Networks: - Toptal: https://www.toptal.com/ https://www.toptal.com/ (I'm a member of Toptal's network) - Gigster: https://www.trygigster.com/ https://www.trygigster.com/ (haven't used it yet) - Crew: https://crew.co/ https://crew.co/ (haven't used it yet) Offline ideas: - Approach companies at Meetups - Meetups, meetups, meetups - Pitch on forums - Work with contract agencies - Become a subcontractor It also helps to work on branding yourself, blogging, and integrating into communities (like HN!). Generally, just becoming an authority on a topic and allowing people get to know you before they work with you helps a lot. Kind of like patio11 has done for himself around here. Then people start coming to you instead of the other way around. I would also highly recommend looking at DevChat TV's Freelance podcasts for ideas, they're really great: https://devchat.tv/freelancers https://devchat.tv/freelancers
kaizensoze 11y ago
HN - http://hnhiring.me/ http://hnhiring.me/ Remote OK - https://remoteok.io/ https://remoteok.io/ Stack Overflow - https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?allowsremote=True https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?allowsremote=True LiquidTalent - http://www.liquidtalent.com/ http://www.liquidtalent.com/ Working Not Working - http://workingnotworking.com http://workingnotworking.com Hired - https://hired.com/contract-jobs https://hired.com/contract-jobs Gigster - https://gigster.com/ https://gigster.com/ Mirror - http://mirrorplacement.com/ http://mirrorplacement.com/ Metova - http://metova.com/ http://metova.com/ Mokriya - http://mokriya.com/ http://mokriya.com/ HappyFunCorp - http://happyfuncorp.com http://happyfuncorp.com Savvy Apps - http://savvyapps.com/ http://savvyapps.com/ Clevertech - http://www.clevertech.biz/ http://www.clevertech.biz/ Workstate - http://www.workstate.com/ http://www.workstate.com/ AngelList - https://angel.co/jobs https://angel.co/jobs I know you're just asking for sites and not approaches to finding contract work, but getting in with a very promising early stage company through contract-to-hire [that allows remote] is probably the most sustainable way to go. Doing one contract project after another at an hourly rate just doesn't scale well financially and finding a next decent client can be like pulling teeth.
- victorantos 11y ago
  Thanks for the list! I will use it to extract angularjs jobs only, for my own job board, https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs/issues/34 https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs/issues/34
telecuda 11y ago
Tip: Have an Indeed.com resume verbose with your areas of expertise. Build a project using Parse.com or the Twitter API? Put that in there. As an employer, one of my more successful methods is to search for specific skill sets that a project may require, then reach out to a small handful of developers who hit on those searches with a pitch to why -new project- is exciting.
Mandatum 11y ago
Depends on how I'm feeling. If I'm not looking for very interesting work or I'm saving for travel, I have a few large clients (5000+ employees) that always have projects going. They are the bread and butter of my contract work and I'm known across pretty much all of the IT senior management at those companies. If I'm looking for more cutting edge, interesting work I'll go out and find either a company, industry or project I'm interested in and try and insert myself into it somehow. Usually through meetups, over coffee or in one case just showing up (probably wouldn't recommend that, depends on the people - in my case it was 4.30PM on a Friday and I brought beer). Usually I'll either do it gratis (if it's non-profit or public domain) or cut my rates if I'm learning on-the-job. When I started pretty much all of my job offers and contracts came by word of mouth. I only had to kick down doors a few times before I had developed a reputation as a good worker. This involved cold-emailing, calling and meeting people at various industry events.
nnd 11y ago
I'm fairly new to consulting (been doing it for almost a year now). I'm on my second gig right now, and both of them are through Toptal. For the first one, a recruiter reached out to me with a gig, the second one I got thanks to an article I wrote in their blog.
odonnellryan 11y ago
A lot of people are saying job websites don't work. I don't agree with them. I've been consulting over a year (US-based, near NYC) and I've found plenty of very good clients (small and large) through freelancing websites. Few loose guidelines I've used to help me with applying to gigs: 1) Evaluate if you think the person understands the value of the work, and only reply if you can somewhat-confidently answer "yes." 2) Reply to gigs that say "$5" or some other crazy low number, as long as they seem competent at explaining their project. 3) ALWAYS follow up with your past clients! Ask them for new work regularly.
- pacomerh 11y ago
  Can you elaborate on #2 ?, are you saying that starting a good relation is more important?
  - somedangedname 11y ago
    Maybe the client wants contractors that can read between the lines - someone who understands the scope of the job and is experienced enough to recognize the $5 price as a placeholder.
  - odonnellryan 11y ago
    Of course! There are two aspects to this. First, you obviously cannot work for $5 unless you're located in a low-income country. They are putting it up for $5, because they don't know how much it costs. However, you have to be careful to make sure they are competent so you're not ending up with a client who does not value your time. Second, getting a job for $1,000 (when maybe it's really a $1,500 job) with the possibility of future work is better than not getting that job at all, in most circumstances.
victorantos 11y ago
If you are looking for frontend contracts, in particular - angularjs, I would recommend http://AngJobs.com http://AngJobs.com disclaimer: I run AngJobs, https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs
WoodenChair 11y ago
One thing that I think is valuable when looking for contracting work (what I call consulting) is to learn how people that have been highly successful in consulting built their business. Checkout episodes 4 (Marcus Zarra) and 5 (Michael Fellows) of Consult: http://consultpodcast.com http://consultpodcast.com or https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/consult/id1018251429?mt=2#_=_ https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/consult/id1018251429?mt=...
lazyant 11y ago
Anybody knows of (good) sites for remote server (Linux esp.) contract work (sysadmin/devops/optimization/security/reliability)? if there are none, anybody interested in one?
122333444555666 11y ago
A bit of tangent but some advice needed. So I've been contracting out a bit on UpWork - used all the bahavioral hacks in the book: using "we" etc... It's worked amazing for getting clients. Not bad at sales. I've got one client now -- a hedge fund -- that's being very stingy. We agree on a fixed price for a particular scope/milestone, the release is shipped, but they come back and say "this is great, but we need this one additional feature or this whole release is worthless." Usually I, I mean "we", oblige. But it's getting ridiculous. What do we do? Play hardball and say no shipment until payment? Or just ditch the client. The day rate is plummeting mind you, closing in on free. Total contract size in the low XXks.
- elbear 11y ago
  Is it worth to you to keep this client? What are the advantages?
  - 122333444555666 11y ago
    They baited "us" with a long term relationship. They have a ton of cash so it seemed rational to take a hit on the effective day rate. So ostensibly they are like perfect for this but the amount they are willing to pay for the type of milestones is pretty low. Like it hurts them.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - elbear 11y ago
      They don't sound like the kind of client I would like to deal with. I would recommend trying to find better customers and then ditching this one.
peacemaker 11y ago
I've done this by reaching out to friends and old work colleagues to see what they're up to and offering to help. Because it's people you know it is much easier to make arrangements you will both be happy with. After 15 years working in software that turns out to be quite a lot of people, especially if you take the time to regularly reach out to people via LinkedIn etc.
coderKen 11y ago
Anyone, currently looking for a remote front-end developer? I am full-stack developer (tending towards front-end nowadays), I live in Lagos, Nigeria and looking for remote work. I have a strong Javascript(NodeJS, AngularJs) background with over 3yrs experience. Portfolio: http://goo.gl/OmEpz8 http://goo.gl/OmEpz8 Git: https://goo.gl/oYbi8F https://goo.gl/oYbi8F some side projects I have done: http://goo.gl/TGRSWg http://goo.gl/TGRSWg http://goo.gl/kHcn5M http://goo.gl/kHcn5M http://goo.gl/eUPozF http://goo.gl/eUPozF http://goo.gl/6orP0y http://goo.gl/6orP0y Have done more complex stuff but requires user to login.
- udswagz 11y ago
  looked at your projects, cool stuff.
gk1 11y ago
Wrote about this recently: http://www.gkogan.co/blog/how-i-learned-to-get-consulting-leads/ http://www.gkogan.co/blog/how-i-learned-to-get-consulting-le... The gist of it is, as many here are saying: Don't use marketplace sites. Instead show off your knowledge in a way that gets attention of potential customers, then they'll come to you.
graham1776 11y ago
The one thing I always tell anyone on the job hunt (which in your case is finding contract work), which few ever seem to take me up on: Informational Interviews. These are informal "Can I take you out to coffee?" talks with people in your industry to see what they are working on, what is happening with them, what is going on in the industry. Every job I have ever gotten is through informal meetings with people I have met through my network (whether its your old job, your friends, parents, relatives, or other). At the end of every one I ask: "Is there anyone else you think I should talk to?" and "Do you currently have any opportunities at your company for me?". Rinse repeat. I guarantee that after investing in 30 informational interviews you will find work.
- mdpopescu 11y ago
  I just don't see how I could call someone I've never met and ask them out for a coffee. It sounds so strange it just "doesn't compute".
  - eric-hu 11y ago
    I've been on the receiving end of these. I'm usually happy to oblige unless the other person sets of some major red flag. I don't find them strange, though I'm usually doing it for friends of friends or acquaintances.

358 points by the_wheel 11y ago

Welcome to HN! You'll find that this was asked previously: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8908279 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8908279

Roedou 11y ago
Good find, thanks for sharing that link. It's interesting that the other thread was 364 days ago, which would have been exactly this same Monday last year (ie: the beginning of the third week of Jan.)
- 8draco8 11y ago
  Blue Monday, the most depressing day of the year.

dustingetz 11y ago

HN who's hiring threads, exclusively update: I post my pitch in the freelancer thread and potential clients contact me, for example https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9998249 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9998249

darklighter3 11y ago
Have you had success replying to those posts and asking 'Would you consider a freelancer for this position?' or how do you go about it since these threads seem to implicitly indicate that they're looking for employees?
- dustingetz 11y ago
  I definitely don't do that. I posted once in the who-wants-to-be-hired thread, but I don't do that anymore, because I had one guy get really angry once he realized I didn't want to be his employee, he accused me of bait-and-switching him to outsourced development (LOL). I was open to perm/ft work at the time for the right fit (which this guy wasn't), but his response was so visceral that I decided it was just a bad form to post there knowing for 95% of inquiries there was no chance of me going perm and that for the longshot 5% i would probably find them through another channel.
- aantix 11y ago
  Don't ask, tell. Tell them your credentials and how you're going to solve their immediate problem. Don't beg them "please hire me even though I'm remote!", spell out that you're a seasoned veteran, here's my code on Github and my open source projects with the air of confidence that if "you don't hire me, someone else will."
zerr 11y ago
The bad thing about HN is that C++ and REMOTE is almost nonexistent in a single posting.

thibaut_barrere 11y ago

I've been contracting, consulting & freelancing for the last 10 years (5 years completely remote). My advice is to avoid "searching contract work", but reverse the situation completely: make your new clients find you instead. I wrote about this in depth here: https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you-rather-than-you-chasing-them https://www.wisecashhq.com/blog/how-to-have-clients-find-you.... Sites /can/ work (I know people who make a good living off certain sites), but nothing will beat self-managed marketing on the long run. Feel free to email me (see profile) if you have specific questions. Good luck!

innertracks 11y ago
Your blog and twitter feed are very helpful. I was doing part time consulting, mostly web-related, for a number of years. Getting myself focused in this new phase of life has been challenging. You are clearly focused in your online presence. Clear "Hire Me" call to actions among other things, too. Time for me to do them. Thanks!

andreasklinger 11y ago

I used to do a lot of contract work. I can't tell you what you should do - but here is what i did and it worked for me Two approaches: 1) Work for one large client and essentially become an employee (consider this. a lot of startups pay good money for remote employees) 2) Work for multiple clients Focusing on #2 here Core rule: You want to be paid premium for quality and service. Avoid marketplaces - it's very hard to compete on quality here. Niche - the more focused you are on a (profitable) niche the better you can charge premium for domain competence As thibaut_barrere mentioned - Build a brand - i would even go further - create an agency like brand. At the point is stopped saying "I" but said "we" i was able to charge more. Dont charge by the hour but by the value - most developers charge their time - you want to charge the value you provide to the client. Read up on "willingness to pay" Most important: Deliver as promised and always try to over-deliver in service, quality, etc. Eg try to understand why the client asks for features and not only what features she/he asks for - you might be able to come up with better solutions or anticipate future requests. Any successful project should usually lead to improved reputation and more projects and clients. Good luck!

aggieben 11y ago
Don't charge by the hour but by the value This sounds like a recipe for disaster to me without a lot more explanation. Time is the main cost to a provider, so it's very natural that time would also be the driver for billing. "Charging for value" sounds like you're trying to say "fixed price" without actually saying it. I have many, many issues with trying to do fixed price projects of any appreciable size (say, more than 20-40 hours). What do you mean, precisely, by "charge by the value"?
- jeffmould 11y ago
  https://training.kalzumeus.com/newsletters/archive/consulting_1 https://training.kalzumeus.com/newsletters/archive/consultin... http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/08/13/doubling-saas-revenue/ http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/08/13/doubling-saas-revenue/
- DrJokepu 11y ago
  Really depends on the client. If your client is able to agree on tight specs and project plans, everyone is better off with fixed project fees. The client can more easily plan financially with a fixed budget. You can charge more, because instead of charging $DAILY_RATE * $DAYS, you can charge $REVENUE_CLIENT_WILL_MAKE_WITH_FEATURE - $THEIR_MARGIN, and the latter figure tends to be significantly higher. You can also deliver the project more quickly because now it's in your interest to do so. Everyone wins. That being said, if the client is unable to commit to tight specs and project plans, you need to revert to invoicing on a time & materials basis. But even if you do that, you should really charge a daily rate, rather than an hourly rate.

ThePhysicist 11y ago

I recently made it through the Toptal (http://www.toptal.com http://www.toptal.com) screening process but haven't taken on any work through their site yet, the hourly rate that you can ask there seems to be quite reasonable though compared to sites like upwork.com, where you will mostly compete with people that are willing to work for 10 $ / hour (which for someone living in a developed country is just not possible). For Germany, Gulp (www.gulp.de) is a very good site where you can actually find clients that are willing to pay a reasonable hourly rate (they even have a rate calculator on their site).

zerr 11y ago
Do you think having accounts at Gulp (and XING?) would help for a person outside Germany (and non-German speaker)? Are [prospective] clients on those sites interested in remote consultants?
- ThePhysicist 11y ago
  it depends, most gigs are on-site but there are exceptions.
imaginenore 11y ago
What kind of rates do you see on TopTal?
- ThePhysicist 11y ago
  at Toptal you can set your own rate in advance
  - imaginenore 11y ago
    I know, but that's not what I'm asking. Do you see any offers? I started registering on TopTal, but then got too lazy jumping through their hoops and not knowing what the upside is.
    - 11y ago

nbrempel 11y ago

I've never used a website. Reach out to everyone you know. Buy them a coffee, mention you are getting into contracting, ask who else you should talk to, thank them, repeat.

decasteve 11y ago
Have you ever just reached out to someone you don't know this way and had success? Cold calling or knocking on doors? I haven't been in a position to have this need but this whole comment thread made me think about doing it the "old-fashioned" way, rather than browsing the web meat/meet markets.
- nbrempel 11y ago
  I've never reached out to someone I've never met but I've reached out to a lot of people that I met _super_ briefly. It let me go "remember me?" in an email I sent and it breaks the tension. People are surprisingly willing to help. I found that it wasn't the first degree connections that led to work but the second degree connections. Get your immediate network to introduce you to others and drum up work from them.
  - peter_l_downs 11y ago
    Not sure if you're aware of it, but this is a well-studied phenomenon. Check out Mark Granovetter's seminal paper "The Strengrth of Weak Ties" [0] [1], it's pretty interesting reading. [0] http://www.jstor.org/stable/2776392?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents http://www.jstor.org/stable/2776392?seq=1#page_scan_tab_cont... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Granovetter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Granovetter

gist 11y ago

I'd like a way, similar to the first of month feature (where employment possibilities are posted on HN) where you could post requirements for a software project and get responses from the hacker news community (or at least links to either relevant profiles or reputable hackers as suggestions). Edit: I mean on HN similar to the first of month feature not a site (I know these are out there obviously).

pmorici 11y ago

I would avoid sites like Upwork (aka: odesk), elance, and anything similar like the plague unless working for less than minimum wage and dealing with morons is your idea of good contract work. I suspect the secret to contract work success lies in having really good networking skills and a Rolodex of contacts from having worked in a given industry and having a reputation as someone who delivers. If you don't have that then you would probably have better luck finding reasonable work by going to meetups or similar industry events to build a network of professional contacts. The only way I know of to do this online is to become a notable contributor to prominent open source projects and then use that to leverage paid work.

akshatpradhan 11y ago
I disagree. I love Upwork, and I pay my contractors well. What Upwork provides me with is an incredible ability to keep payments maintained and work honest. There's a sense of honesty when using the oDesk application, where both parties can say, "we feel confident that parties will get paid, and work can be reviewed." Neither my contractors nor I would want to move to any other platform because no other platform provides that kind of honesty and confidence between Contractor and Employee.
- pmorici 11y ago
  Would you be willing to share with us the average $/hr rate you pay your Upwork employees? I'd be willing to bet it is quite low. As an employer I can totally see why you would love it, it's an effective way to pay bottom dollar for simplistic computer tasks. From the stand point of someone looking to get into software engineer contract work it's lame. The guaranteed payment thing you are talking about is only for projects that are billed hourly. If you bid on a flat rate project there is no such guarantee. The hourly pay rate guarantee also requires you to install a spyware app on your computer to monitor your work.
  - jeddawson 11y ago
    I use upwork to sub-out work that I don't have time to tackle or for tasks that I lack expertise in. Once I've found someone on the platform that is really talented at what they do, I return to them for subsequent projects that need their skillset. The challenge on that platform is finding the people that stand out since there are so many low-bar contributors. Examples of work that I use it for are simple html/css stuff that just needs to get knocked out prior to integration into an app. I'll pay between $300-500 from some straight forward design to html/css conversion. I want it to be worth their while. Also, I've use it frequently for GIS work. I'm just not proficient in it and would rather pay someone that is. I managed to find an incredible person on upwork and give him the specs for each project before I quote my customers. He sets the price for the GIS components and I routinely encourage him to charge more. So to be clear, I don't use upwork to find a deal on the project (no doubt a ton of people do). I use it because it is a platform that can keep talented people busy and available for the next time I need to rely on them. I'd hire a full time GIS expert if I had steady work for the, but I don't so going with a subcontract makes a lot more sense.

fasouto 11y ago

Some people at HN will tell you the opposite but I find two of my best clients at Upwork. I didn't bid to low quality jobs and once I finish my job I offer them an maintenance contract outside upwork.

sixQuarks 11y ago
When I hire through Upwork, I ignore all the low hourly rate freelancers. I use a high hourly price as my first requirement. Few years ago, this worked quite well, but now there are some idiots that charge a high price for low quality work just to try to take advantage of people like me. So, now it takes some more time to filter through, but still works pretty well.
- learc83 11y ago
  What do you consider a high hourly rate. Last time I looked, I didn't see anything above $50 an hour.
  - sixQuarks 11y ago
    Are you kidding me? There are lots of high hourly workers. I consider $40/hour as minimum, generally $65/hour or higher is where the line starts to separate between pros and average freelancers. I've seen as high as $150/hour.

awjr 11y ago

Which country? ;)

mirap 11y ago

Does anyone have good place to look for contract work in field of UX & Product design? I'm UX designer currently living in Prague, looking for remote work (and I'm open to relocate). My portfolio: http://podorsky.cz/ http://podorsky.cz/

peterbsmith 11y ago

Personal networks. I came into Syracuse knowing nobody and nothing. I had never done any app making as of January 2015. I had done some wordpress stuff, but just the basics. And I had (and have) no CS degree. I now make a living on contract work. I did it by going to local meetups and introducing myself as a freelance web developer. Nevermind that I hadn't done freelance web development ever. I kept going to meetups for month and still attend a monthly hacker meetup. I participated in hackathons without really knowing how to program. But all along the way I met people more experienced than I am and picked up two clients along the way. I think one thing that I do differently to most is that I charge a high rate (I always quote $150/hr). I am willing to negotiate lower than that but its a starting point. I have been paid that in the past for less complicated work like hiring developers and being a project manager. What am I saying? Your questions is what sites to use? Just one: meetup.com

a_shane 11y ago
I want to add a bit to your comment - it's important to try and identify the kind of meetups you'd like to attend that will help you meet your desired customer base, and the kinds that will help you get known in your local community (ie: meetups for web devs to connect). I find that meetups can sometimes become circle-jerks for people in a similar field to just get together and talk/humblebrag. Which is fine, but if that's not your goal you need to look at different meetups which serve that goal.
- peterbsmith 11y ago
  Good point. Some meetups I went to were the exact circle-jerk/humblebragfests you're talking about. The one I consistently go to (shameless plug [OpenHack Syracuse](http://www.openhacksyr.com http://www.openhacksyr.com) is a monthly meetup for developers to talk about what projects they're working on and to spend time together working on projects, ideas, and sharing info. It's really just an organized hangout/hack session. And it's these types of meetups which are best for getting contract work (because contract work isn't the goal)
  - 11y ago

bcks 11y ago

I've had good success hiring developers for short-term project work through https://gun.io https://gun.io.

eropple 11y ago
I can't speak to the employment side of things, but the work side of things is disappointing. Their recommended gigs are scattershot and a lot of the ones they push ("in conjunction with gun.io" or similar verbiage--sounds like premium postings) are six-month, monopolize-all-your-time contracts at a low hourly rate. And they don't seem to respect their own site's rules, at least not the spirit of them: every once in a while I'm spammed with a '$1,000' offer from gun.io themselves that's really "we'll pay $100 for a blog post". Unfortunately I'm not sure that anybody else is much better! I still get most of my work through interpersonal connections and the occasional email from Hacker News readers.
sirn 11y ago
I tried to register for Gun.io and the first thing they want me to do is to write proposal to see if I could communicate, for skillsets that I don't have in a field that I have no knowledge of (GRE over IPSec). I make another try and now it's to write proposal for framework that I never used with explicit "no 'willing to learn' proposals" in the body text. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but if they're asking me to BS on the proposal just to see if I could communicate, then I have to say this is definitely not a good first impression.
pekk 11y ago
Good luck getting paid on gun.io, if the buyer just decides they want the work for free then they can take it and wander off. Gun.io doesn't care because who is bringing them money?
- eropple 11y ago
  Is this a hypothetical, or are you speaking from experience?

dmitri1981 11y ago

For those who are London based, I recently launched a mailing list for members of the London Hacker News Meetup, which sends out contracts based on your language preference. It's averaging about 10 jobs a month at the moment however I am working on getting it to about 100 pm by the end of the year. The current sign up page is at http://eepurl.com/byq7Af http://eepurl.com/byq7Af

Nursie 11y ago
Interesting! I'm not London-based but am London-commute friendly so will check it out. (I've been contracting for about 3 years now, some in London)
osullivj 11y ago
No C# or C++ on signup page language list?
- Nursie 11y ago
  Nor C, unfortunately. The list seems a little more narrowly targeted than I had anticipated.
  - osullivj 11y ago
    Yeah, seems very web dev centric.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago

My way was working at several successful startups, and then going into contracting. So I had contacts at every level of Silicon Valley. Might not work for everybody.

chilicuil 11y ago

Fiverr (https://www.fiverr.com/ https://www.fiverr.com/), tasks usually take less than an hour and give me enough revenue to pay domains and hosting for my pet projects.

peterbsmith 11y ago
Hey thats a really good idea! How long does it take to get started with that? Do you find a long lead time from signing up to building a reputation to getting a lot of gigs?
- chilicuil 11y ago
  Depending in the gigs you offer your experience may differ, I do python/perl/sh scripts and sysop tasks and after a month I started receiving enough gigs a month (5-8) to pay my digital bills. I think logo designers, web developers and translators get a lot more traffic. I just recently was upgraded to 1st level seller after 3 months, so I think it's relatively fast.
andy_boot 11y ago
Got to disagree here. Even if your task takes only 30 minutes, by the time you add getting client's requirements and browsing for jobs each task will take 1 hour. You should not be working for $5 / hour.

quackware 11y ago

I get my clients primarily through gigster (http://www.gigster.com http://www.gigster.com), referrals, and my website.

jcsnv 11y ago
I'm having issues with Gigster. I did the first interview and passed. The subsequent follow ups (4 already!) have all been either postponed, interviewer no shows (yes really), or setup with the wrong interviewer. I understand there are growing pains, but not one of my emails have been responded to regarding this issue.
- quackware 11y ago
  Yeah that's unfortunate... They are growing very quickly in terms on onboarding devs right now. They're also putting a lot of effort into building better tooling for interviewing / onboarding. I fortunately jumped on before the growth really got crazy.
- gspyrou 11y ago
  A interview with Gigster was scheduled for today , I was waiting for 30 minutes in their conference tool but no one showed up.
aquark 11y ago
From the front page testimonial: > in less than 5 minutes the project was fully spec'd and underway. Honest question: why would I need a top '1% developer' for a project that can be fully spec'd in less than 5 minutes?

marknutter 11y ago

I posted this article on medium the other day that contains all the advice I've compiled after 8 years of freelancing as a software developer: https://medium.com/@marknutter/advice-for-the-freelance-developer-68b63c69b050 https://medium.com/@marknutter/advice-for-the-freelance-deve... In short, to answer your question, I never used any sites to find contract work. I got all my leads through face-to-face interaction with real humans in the real world, and a good deal of it came from word-of-mouth because of exceeding my clients' expectations. Contracting sites marginalize developers and the type of clients who troll them are typically the kind who will try to squeeze as much work out of developers for as little money as they can. On top of that, developers are generally a pretty introverted crowd, so the number of introverted and talented developers who troll those sites looking for work is far greater than the number of outgoing, personable developers in your local area. Which group do you want to compete against?

swimduck 11y ago

I have a different approach to finding contract work, particularly as I don't have much work experience. Upwork and similar websites have not worked well for me. Instead, I browse job boards and when I find an interesting role I contact the company. If they are interested in my background and the fit is right, I sell them on setting up a contract relationship instead of full-time employee. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn't. The important part is being honest that you are looking to work as a contractor, not an employee. Job boards to consider: AngelList, WeWorkRemotely etc. If you're looking for a list of job boards (http://nodesk.co http://nodesk.co has lots and so does this article by teleport http://teleport.org/2015/03/best-sites-for-remote-jobs/ http://teleport.org/2015/03/best-sites-for-remote-jobs/)

deleted 11y ago
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eswat 11y ago

I tackle this sideways by going to Meetup or Eventbrite. Specifically I go to meetups and events that potential buyers go to and let them know what I do (I don’t try to sell my services on first contact). It takes some pruning but after a while my preferred clients are the ones I keep in contact with and we start working. I get less work through this than just by referral though. Depending on your living situation and time available I’d recommend trying to establish your own identity so you don’t have to go through a marketplace for contract work. Instead you’ll have the contract work come to you and not filtered through a middleman that would take a cut out of your work. I would never recommend someone go through fiverr, Upwork or these other marketplaces unless they were just moonlighting.

joanofarc2016 11y ago

It'll cost money to hire a good hacker but if you can pay for it, onetimehacker@outlook.com can help you get this done in no time.

Nursie 11y ago

What's the context? Which country are you in? What are your skills? If you're in the UK... I've been contracting about 3 years now and started it the simple (and probably dumb) way - stick a resume up on jobsite.co.uk, wait for agents to call. Lots will. Be nice to them on the phone but be firm about what rates and locations you're willing to work. You'll get lots of useless ones who haven't even bothered to read it, but no matter, you'll learn to filter them out pretty quickly. Remember the good ones. Rinse, repeat. I've had two contracts now through reputation, which is quite nice, but getting contracts from previous workmates isn't a panacea. One of them was the most boring thing I've ever done in my life (worse than shelf-stacking in a warehouse) and I quit after three weeks because I was literally unable to complete the work it was so dull. I told the client that I was poor value for money and a recent graduate would be a better choice. The other one was good though! Also, make sure you're prepared for some time off between contracts, it's pretty much going to happen.

millak 11y ago
I'd be interested to hear how you made the jump to contracting? I find myself wanting to make the jump from my permanent job (in London) but being anxious about whether or not it's the right time to do so, if my skill set (sysadmin/devops) as it stands will provide value to clients, if I have the right mix of personal qualities to make a success out of it, etc.
- Nursie 11y ago
  Bloody-mindedness mostly. I worked permanently for various companies in and around London for about 10 years, then got sick of London, moved to Australia, did a couple more years permanent work there, then decided to move back to the UK. At that point I was sick of being an employee and had a vague offer from a friend to help bootstrap a startup, which fell through. So in lieu of having an idea to start up a company myself I decided I was going to be a contractor, set myself up a limited company and started throwing my CV at anyone that asked. I have got most of my contracts through agencies that called me, not through contacts. Making the leap can be tricky - if you have a notice period longer than one month you may have to quit your current job and then look for contracts afterwards. A lot of people want contractors to start now. You may not find one for a month or more, I've had dry patches lasting a couple of months before, and it might be another month after you start before you can invoice, and it could be another month again before you get paid, so you need a financial cushion. As soon as you get your first contract you'll need an accountant. These come in at about £100 per month. I use Nixon Williams, this is not necessarily a recommendation, they deal with hundreds of contractors, the service is streamlined but pretty basic and if you need anything out of the ordinary they probably won't do it. Errr.... time of year may have an effect, like a lot of things it seems to be easier to find work in the first few months of the year, though I have had two start in November/December. Anything else you want to know?

joanofarc2016 11y ago

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joanofarc2016 11y ago

To hire a professional hacker, Contact onetimehacker at outlook com

qp9384btv_2e 11y ago

For those who do contract work, what is your policy on code-reuse between clients?

eropple 11y ago
It depends on my arrangement with a client. Work-for-hire contracts make reuse impossible, and so I tend to price higher, whereas a perpetual, transferable, etc. license to the code I work on has a better chance of being useful down the line and so I may knock a couple bucks off.
- qp9384btv_2e 11y ago
  My thought was to develop a library for code re-use among clients. It would cover common problems/features. In your experience, do many contract workers have such a thing?
  - eropple 11y ago
    I dunno, but I wouldn't want to have such a thing in a stack. I reuse code like "hey, I've got this super nice Vagrant setup that makes life easier" or "I've got this Chef cookbook that's a little too specialized to meaningfully open-source but I can turn it around to help," rather than application-level code. If I had a library for application code-reuse, I'd just find a platform-appropriate library like Guava or something and try to get it in there, or open-source the whole thing myself.
  - err4nt 11y ago
    I dunno about others, but I sure do! I have CSS stylesheets in 7 colour themes, a dozen bootstrap-like JS plugins that add common interactive elements I can drop into any site, and tons of parts and pieces of layouts (like an order form, signup form, pricing chart, or media player) isolated and ready to re-use. I also maintain a big snippets file, filled with HTML, CSS, JS, and command-line snippets and tricks so I can grab them from anywhere. I dont know how any freelancer or contractor doesnt have a bag of tricks like this.

juliend2 11y ago

LinkedIn. I send a LinkedIn message to some of my contacts I'd like to work with, telling them it's been a while and that I'd like to get in touch, and offer them to take a cup of coffee with them this week. During the meeting, tell them about your freelance status and that you're looking for work. Good luck!

BorisMelnik 11y ago

I like to go to places like upwork or elance and seek out people in the US with low rep that haven't done a lot of jobs. A lot of times those people are ones for big companies that are stuck in a situation that need a quick hack put together. Do a good job and you get put on their 'list' for future use.

jameslk 11y ago

I've been contracting/consulting for a couple of years now. Most my contracts have come through referrals (of friends) and sometimes recruiters. However, I was able to start my contracting career thanks to a contract that came through Toptal. This allowed me to quit my job and do this full-time. Here's my list of resources that I would be looking at if I needed to start looking for a contract immediately: Boards: - Authentic Jobs: http://www.authenticjobs.com/ http://www.authenticjobs.com/ - StackOverflow Careers: http://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?type=contract&allowsremote=true http://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?type=contract&allowsre... - We Work Remotely: https://weworkremotely.com/jobs/search?term=contract https://weworkremotely.com/jobs/search?term=contract - Angelist: https://angel.co/jobs https://angel.co/jobs - Github Jobs: https://jobs.github.com/ https://jobs.github.com/ - Hired: https://hired.com/contract-jobs https://hired.com/contract-jobs Networks: - Toptal: https://www.toptal.com/ https://www.toptal.com/ (I'm a member of Toptal's network) - Gigster: https://www.trygigster.com/ https://www.trygigster.com/ (haven't used it yet) - Crew: https://crew.co/ https://crew.co/ (haven't used it yet) Offline ideas: - Approach companies at Meetups - Meetups, meetups, meetups - Pitch on forums - Work with contract agencies - Become a subcontractor It also helps to work on branding yourself, blogging, and integrating into communities (like HN!). Generally, just becoming an authority on a topic and allowing people get to know you before they work with you helps a lot. Kind of like patio11 has done for himself around here. Then people start coming to you instead of the other way around. I would also highly recommend looking at DevChat TV's Freelance podcasts for ideas, they're really great: https://devchat.tv/freelancers https://devchat.tv/freelancers

kaizensoze 11y ago

HN - http://hnhiring.me/ http://hnhiring.me/ Remote OK - https://remoteok.io/ https://remoteok.io/ Stack Overflow - https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?allowsremote=True https://careers.stackoverflow.com/jobs?allowsremote=True LiquidTalent - http://www.liquidtalent.com/ http://www.liquidtalent.com/ Working Not Working - http://workingnotworking.com http://workingnotworking.com Hired - https://hired.com/contract-jobs https://hired.com/contract-jobs Gigster - https://gigster.com/ https://gigster.com/ Mirror - http://mirrorplacement.com/ http://mirrorplacement.com/ Metova - http://metova.com/ http://metova.com/ Mokriya - http://mokriya.com/ http://mokriya.com/ HappyFunCorp - http://happyfuncorp.com http://happyfuncorp.com Savvy Apps - http://savvyapps.com/ http://savvyapps.com/ Clevertech - http://www.clevertech.biz/ http://www.clevertech.biz/ Workstate - http://www.workstate.com/ http://www.workstate.com/ AngelList - https://angel.co/jobs https://angel.co/jobs I know you're just asking for sites and not approaches to finding contract work, but getting in with a very promising early stage company through contract-to-hire [that allows remote] is probably the most sustainable way to go. Doing one contract project after another at an hourly rate just doesn't scale well financially and finding a next decent client can be like pulling teeth.

victorantos 11y ago
Thanks for the list! I will use it to extract angularjs jobs only, for my own job board, https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs/issues/34 https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs/issues/34

telecuda 11y ago

Tip: Have an Indeed.com resume verbose with your areas of expertise. Build a project using Parse.com or the Twitter API? Put that in there. As an employer, one of my more successful methods is to search for specific skill sets that a project may require, then reach out to a small handful of developers who hit on those searches with a pitch to why -new project- is exciting.

Mandatum 11y ago

Depends on how I'm feeling. If I'm not looking for very interesting work or I'm saving for travel, I have a few large clients (5000+ employees) that always have projects going. They are the bread and butter of my contract work and I'm known across pretty much all of the IT senior management at those companies. If I'm looking for more cutting edge, interesting work I'll go out and find either a company, industry or project I'm interested in and try and insert myself into it somehow. Usually through meetups, over coffee or in one case just showing up (probably wouldn't recommend that, depends on the people - in my case it was 4.30PM on a Friday and I brought beer). Usually I'll either do it gratis (if it's non-profit or public domain) or cut my rates if I'm learning on-the-job. When I started pretty much all of my job offers and contracts came by word of mouth. I only had to kick down doors a few times before I had developed a reputation as a good worker. This involved cold-emailing, calling and meeting people at various industry events.

nnd 11y ago

I'm fairly new to consulting (been doing it for almost a year now). I'm on my second gig right now, and both of them are through Toptal. For the first one, a recruiter reached out to me with a gig, the second one I got thanks to an article I wrote in their blog.

odonnellryan 11y ago

A lot of people are saying job websites don't work. I don't agree with them. I've been consulting over a year (US-based, near NYC) and I've found plenty of very good clients (small and large) through freelancing websites. Few loose guidelines I've used to help me with applying to gigs: 1) Evaluate if you think the person understands the value of the work, and only reply if you can somewhat-confidently answer "yes." 2) Reply to gigs that say "$5" or some other crazy low number, as long as they seem competent at explaining their project. 3) ALWAYS follow up with your past clients! Ask them for new work regularly.

pacomerh 11y ago
Can you elaborate on #2 ?, are you saying that starting a good relation is more important?
- somedangedname 11y ago
  Maybe the client wants contractors that can read between the lines - someone who understands the scope of the job and is experienced enough to recognize the $5 price as a placeholder.
- odonnellryan 11y ago
  Of course! There are two aspects to this. First, you obviously cannot work for $5 unless you're located in a low-income country. They are putting it up for $5, because they don't know how much it costs. However, you have to be careful to make sure they are competent so you're not ending up with a client who does not value your time. Second, getting a job for $1,000 (when maybe it's really a $1,500 job) with the possibility of future work is better than not getting that job at all, in most circumstances.

victorantos 11y ago

If you are looking for frontend contracts, in particular - angularjs, I would recommend http://AngJobs.com http://AngJobs.com disclaimer: I run AngJobs, https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs https://github.com/victorantos/AngJobs

WoodenChair 11y ago

One thing that I think is valuable when looking for contracting work (what I call consulting) is to learn how people that have been highly successful in consulting built their business. Checkout episodes 4 (Marcus Zarra) and 5 (Michael Fellows) of Consult: http://consultpodcast.com http://consultpodcast.com or https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/consult/id1018251429?mt=2#_=_ https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/consult/id1018251429?mt=...

lazyant 11y ago

Anybody knows of (good) sites for remote server (Linux esp.) contract work (sysadmin/devops/optimization/security/reliability)? if there are none, anybody interested in one?

122333444555666 11y ago

A bit of tangent but some advice needed. So I've been contracting out a bit on UpWork - used all the bahavioral hacks in the book: using "we" etc... It's worked amazing for getting clients. Not bad at sales. I've got one client now -- a hedge fund -- that's being very stingy. We agree on a fixed price for a particular scope/milestone, the release is shipped, but they come back and say "this is great, but we need this one additional feature or this whole release is worthless." Usually I, I mean "we", oblige. But it's getting ridiculous. What do we do? Play hardball and say no shipment until payment? Or just ditch the client. The day rate is plummeting mind you, closing in on free. Total contract size in the low XXks.

elbear 11y ago
Is it worth to you to keep this client? What are the advantages?
- 122333444555666 11y ago
  They baited "us" with a long term relationship. They have a ton of cash so it seemed rational to take a hit on the effective day rate. So ostensibly they are like perfect for this but the amount they are willing to pay for the type of milestones is pretty low. Like it hurts them.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - elbear 11y ago
    They don't sound like the kind of client I would like to deal with. I would recommend trying to find better customers and then ditching this one.

peacemaker 11y ago

I've done this by reaching out to friends and old work colleagues to see what they're up to and offering to help. Because it's people you know it is much easier to make arrangements you will both be happy with. After 15 years working in software that turns out to be quite a lot of people, especially if you take the time to regularly reach out to people via LinkedIn etc.

coderKen 11y ago

Anyone, currently looking for a remote front-end developer? I am full-stack developer (tending towards front-end nowadays), I live in Lagos, Nigeria and looking for remote work. I have a strong Javascript(NodeJS, AngularJs) background with over 3yrs experience. Portfolio: http://goo.gl/OmEpz8 http://goo.gl/OmEpz8 Git: https://goo.gl/oYbi8F https://goo.gl/oYbi8F some side projects I have done: http://goo.gl/TGRSWg http://goo.gl/TGRSWg http://goo.gl/kHcn5M http://goo.gl/kHcn5M http://goo.gl/eUPozF http://goo.gl/eUPozF http://goo.gl/6orP0y http://goo.gl/6orP0y Have done more complex stuff but requires user to login.

udswagz 11y ago
looked at your projects, cool stuff.

gk1 11y ago

Wrote about this recently: http://www.gkogan.co/blog/how-i-learned-to-get-consulting-leads/ http://www.gkogan.co/blog/how-i-learned-to-get-consulting-le... The gist of it is, as many here are saying: Don't use marketplace sites. Instead show off your knowledge in a way that gets attention of potential customers, then they'll come to you.

graham1776 11y ago

The one thing I always tell anyone on the job hunt (which in your case is finding contract work), which few ever seem to take me up on: Informational Interviews. These are informal "Can I take you out to coffee?" talks with people in your industry to see what they are working on, what is happening with them, what is going on in the industry. Every job I have ever gotten is through informal meetings with people I have met through my network (whether its your old job, your friends, parents, relatives, or other). At the end of every one I ask: "Is there anyone else you think I should talk to?" and "Do you currently have any opportunities at your company for me?". Rinse repeat. I guarantee that after investing in 30 informational interviews you will find work.

mdpopescu 11y ago
I just don't see how I could call someone I've never met and ask them out for a coffee. It sounds so strange it just "doesn't compute".
- eric-hu 11y ago
  I've been on the receiving end of these. I'm usually happy to oblige unless the other person sets of some major red flag. I don't find them strange, though I'm usually doing it for friends of friends or acquaintances.