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The Unluckiest Paragraphs – Why Parts of Medium Sometimes Disappear

23 points by don_neufeld 11y ago

pvinis 11y ago
ok, time to say it. "eatbeef" is not a hex. does he not know that, or is he not a programmer?
nikisweeting 11y ago
Very cool bug!
tempestn 11y ago
Ah, yes. We've run into this same problem with ad blockers blocking anything that happens to have the word 'ad' or 'advertising' in it. (I run a search engine for finding classified ads across multiple sources and cities, so you can imagine why some of our markup might contain 'ad'.) Doesn't make a lot of sense given that they have exhaustive lists of actual ad domains to go from, and you've got to think most advertisers are going to figure this out pretty quick and not call their ads "ad".
empressplay 11y ago
Lately it seems to be a common refrain when new startup owners pop up on entrepreneur chats looking for feedback on their MVPs that if issues are found, they're invariably related to ad-blockers filtering out various CSS tags.
lambda 11y ago
It's an arms race, and the users are the losers. Either they disable the ad blockers, and their browsing experience is filled with so much junk you can't find the content within it, or they enable the ad blockers and lose content.
sbierwagen 11y ago
They really needed to spend a little more time justifying what sound like bizarrely strange technical decisions, rather just baldly stating them. There are no completely stupid technical decisions, but if you're doing something really weird and roundabout, you should at the very least give us a hint as to why you're doing that. On most webpages, if you click a link, the browser automatically handles loading a new page. On Medium, we speed this up a bit with JavaScript. We send a request to “https://medium.com/@ritasustelo/advertising-is-not-for-geniuses- 5d1ffbc505ac?format=json,” download the article text, and render it in your browser. What the hell is wrong with just serving flat html files, rather than making the browser parse a JSON blob? All posts are represented as a list of paragraphs. We give each paragraph a unique name. The code to generate names is a one-liner Well, why do you do that? Does doing this make any sense at all?
- olalonde 11y ago
  Just seems like a standard single page app architecture which most web developers seem to be moving to these days (Angular/Ember/React/Meteor/etc.): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-page_application https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-page_application
  - sbierwagen 11y ago
    It's a blog. The page text for a given url is always going to be the same! Why introduce all this overhead, and needlessly complicate something simple?
    - olalonde 11y ago
      Well it seems your opinion is already made but there are a few reasons why this architecture is gaining in popularity: - Faster loading time. For most users, the bottleneck is the network and a JSON payload is typically a lot smaller than a fully rendered HTML page. This reduces the overhead (unless your users have crap CPUs and fast network connections - not the norm). - Better separation of concerns. Your server becomes a dumb API and doesn't need to concern itself with presentation. Your UI can live in an entirely different repository and it doesn't matter which framework or language your backend is written in. Front-end developers only need to know about browser technologies (HTML/CSS/JavaScript) to build the UI. This reduces complexity instead of "needlessly" increasing it. - Thanks to server side Javascript, it's relatively easy to have a fallback mechanism in place to do traditional server side rendering for web crawlers or browsers with Javascript disabled.
      - cbsmith 11y ago
        Of course, in theory, web pages are supposed to have this separation of concerns, which allows for faster loading, and of course server side rendering of web pages is very, very well supported.
- paulcole 11y ago
  They've done this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8986920 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8986920
pmontra 11y ago
> A web ecosystem with ad blockers is more complicated for authors to run and maintain. A more complicated web favors big, centralized players and disfavors small, independent ones. I'm not sure if this is the case. I concede that a team that owns both the blog and the tool has an advantage but many people use standard tools like WordPress or Jekyll. The teams behind those tools can solve those problems too. I believe there is some friction but hopefully it's not so bad.

23 points by don_neufeld 11y ago

pvinis 11y ago

ok, time to say it. "eatbeef" is not a hex. does he not know that, or is he not a programmer?

nikisweeting 11y ago

Very cool bug!

tempestn 11y ago

Ah, yes. We've run into this same problem with ad blockers blocking anything that happens to have the word 'ad' or 'advertising' in it. (I run a search engine for finding classified ads across multiple sources and cities, so you can imagine why some of our markup might contain 'ad'.) Doesn't make a lot of sense given that they have exhaustive lists of actual ad domains to go from, and you've got to think most advertisers are going to figure this out pretty quick and not call their ads "ad".

empressplay 11y ago

Lately it seems to be a common refrain when new startup owners pop up on entrepreneur chats looking for feedback on their MVPs that if issues are found, they're invariably related to ad-blockers filtering out various CSS tags.

lambda 11y ago

It's an arms race, and the users are the losers. Either they disable the ad blockers, and their browsing experience is filled with so much junk you can't find the content within it, or they enable the ad blockers and lose content.

sbierwagen 11y ago

They really needed to spend a little more time justifying what sound like bizarrely strange technical decisions, rather just baldly stating them. There are no completely stupid technical decisions, but if you're doing something really weird and roundabout, you should at the very least give us a hint as to why you're doing that. On most webpages, if you click a link, the browser automatically handles loading a new page. On Medium, we speed this up a bit with JavaScript. We send a request to “https://medium.com/@ritasustelo/advertising-is-not-for-geniuses- 5d1ffbc505ac?format=json,” download the article text, and render it in your browser. What the hell is wrong with just serving flat html files, rather than making the browser parse a JSON blob? All posts are represented as a list of paragraphs. We give each paragraph a unique name. The code to generate names is a one-liner Well, why do you do that? Does doing this make any sense at all?

olalonde 11y ago
Just seems like a standard single page app architecture which most web developers seem to be moving to these days (Angular/Ember/React/Meteor/etc.): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-page_application https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-page_application
- sbierwagen 11y ago
  It's a blog. The page text for a given url is always going to be the same! Why introduce all this overhead, and needlessly complicate something simple?
  - olalonde 11y ago
    Well it seems your opinion is already made but there are a few reasons why this architecture is gaining in popularity: - Faster loading time. For most users, the bottleneck is the network and a JSON payload is typically a lot smaller than a fully rendered HTML page. This reduces the overhead (unless your users have crap CPUs and fast network connections - not the norm). - Better separation of concerns. Your server becomes a dumb API and doesn't need to concern itself with presentation. Your UI can live in an entirely different repository and it doesn't matter which framework or language your backend is written in. Front-end developers only need to know about browser technologies (HTML/CSS/JavaScript) to build the UI. This reduces complexity instead of "needlessly" increasing it. - Thanks to server side Javascript, it's relatively easy to have a fallback mechanism in place to do traditional server side rendering for web crawlers or browsers with Javascript disabled.
    - cbsmith 11y ago
      Of course, in theory, web pages are supposed to have this separation of concerns, which allows for faster loading, and of course server side rendering of web pages is very, very well supported.
paulcole 11y ago
They've done this before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8986920 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8986920

pmontra 11y ago

> A web ecosystem with ad blockers is more complicated for authors to run and maintain. A more complicated web favors big, centralized players and disfavors small, independent ones. I'm not sure if this is the case. I concede that a team that owns both the blog and the tool has an advantage but many people use standard tools like WordPress or Jekyll. The teams behind those tools can solve those problems too. I believe there is some friction but hopefully it's not so bad.