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Losing 100 pounds and a ketogenic diet basically cured me. The main thing was cutting out all refined carbohydrates from my diet, but I just feel better when I

Losing 100 pounds and a ketogenic diet basically cured me. The main thing was cutting out all refined carbohydrates from my diet, but I just feel better when I replace nearly all carbs with fats. Putting on some muscle in the weightroom also made me substantially more insulin sensitive. My bloodwork has never been better, and I'm off my bipolar medication. From what I've read, it's most likely because of the slightly nootropic effect that ketones have on the brain.

culturestate 11y ago
I'm not diabetic, but I completely agree with the subjective improvement that comes with a low-carb diet. Even a light-ish carby meal -- say, penne with pesto -- makes me feel substantially heavier and more bloated than eating a steak slathered with butter.
eclipxe 11y ago
Another vote of confidence here. Keto makes a huge difference.
kruhft 11y ago
What signs made you know it was safe to go off your bipolar meds?
- jawilson2 11y ago
  I don't think this is standard-of-care yet, though some docs I know will go this route. There is a good amount of emerging research of the positive effects of the keto diet on brain health, including bipolar disorder: https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=ketogenic+diet+bipolar&btnG=&as_sdt=1%2C14&as_sdtp= https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=ketogenic+diet+bi... https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=ketogenic+diet+neuroprotective&btnG=&hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C14 https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=ketogenic+diet+neuropro...
- hyperchase 11y ago
  My psychologist decided they weren't needed any more.
  - kruhft 11y ago
    I'm curious how your psychologist came to that conclusion. Was it your suggestion to come off the meds and they agreed?
- viewer5 11y ago
  For anyone reading: Please consult your doctor before altering your dosage of mind-altering medications. Some of them, for example, have to be stepped down in dosage gradually, lest bad side effects happen.
atom-morgan 11y ago
Paleo here. Can confirm it's been great for me as well. And I just wrapped up a month with no sugar (drinks, candy, added sugar, etc).
- BlakePetersen 11y ago
  Diabetes isn't about sugar specifically, it's about carbohydrates. I'm sure you didn't have a "no carb" month -- which means your point is kinda meaningless. You may have avoided the 38 grams of sugar in that can of coke, but did you compensate by eating 4 handfuls of grapes? To a diabetic, all carbs are bad, not just the ones that rot your teeth.
  - noondip 11y ago
    I believe you're meaning to allude to refined carbohydrates, like the ones found in soda drinks. "No carbs" would mean consuming no fruit or vegetables, at all - not exactly a practical strategy for healthful eating. (Note: grapes are especially high on the glycemic index and not an ideal representation of healthy carbohydrate, so your likening them to a can of soda isn't entirely inaccurate) > The vegetarian diet (~60% of energy from carbohydrates,15% protein and 25% fat) consisted of vegetables, grains,legumes, fruits and nuts. Animal products were limited to amaximum of one portion of low-fat yogurt a day. > In conclusion, a vegetarian diet led to a greater improve-ment in quality of life and mood. Patients consuming a vegetarian diet felt less constrained than those consuming the conventional diet. Disinhibition decreased with a vegetarian diet. The decrease in feelings of hunger tended to be greater in the vegetarian group. All these results suggest that a vegetarian diet is sustainable in the long term and may exhibit desired improvements not only in physical, but also in mental health of patients with Type 2 diabetes. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23050853 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23050853
  - atom-morgan 11y ago
    Never said it was. The topic just made me think of it is all. And I didn't substitute with a ton of fruits. I barely ate any. I also eat very little carbs.
brandonmenc 11y ago
Anecdotally, my father didn't develop the disease until after he went on a ketogenic diet, but the doctors believe chronic lack of sleep caused his diabetes so diet probably was not a factor either way.
- hyperchase 11y ago
  That's unfortunate. Type 1 or 2 diabetes? My mother is T1 and she cannot do a low-carb diet because of the possibility of ketoacidosis, which she's already been hospitalized once for.
  - datiecher 11y ago
    I would suggest she tries the program created by Dr. Neil Barnard in this case as he actually uses a low fat high carb diet in order to reverse diabetes. Both my father and father-in-law got rid of the medications (my inlaw even had to take insulin before the program) and have overall improved their health, lost weight and are feeling much more energetic. My father was able to be out of his medications after two months and my father-in-law in 4 months. Here's the Amazon link for book about the program and you can also read the reviews of many people who have successfully changed their for the better as well: http://www.amazon.com/Neal-Barnards-Program-Reversing-Diabetes/dp/1594868107 http://www.amazon.com/Neal-Barnards-Program-Reversing-Diabet...
voidlogic 11y ago
+1 more anecdote, I was never diabetic, but doing keto for a year helped me lose 60 lbs and regain my insulin sensitivity. Even now if I eat keto for breakfast and lunch and moderate carb for supper. Even when I have the occasional high-carb meal, I feel dramatically different than I did before keto/weight loss. I don't know about the pancreas, but both abstaining form alcohol and keto are shown to dramatically reduce the amount of fat stored in the liver.
aantix 11y ago
Is there any way to quickly induce ketosis?
- CompelTechnic 11y ago
  Stop eating.
  - wavefunction 11y ago
    No, this just puts your body into starvation mode. You should eat proteins, vegetables (especially leafy green ones) and a moderate amount of fruit. Natural fats like animal fats are ok too, depending on other health factors. I am not a doctor but a ketogenic diet helped me lose weight and feel great. 230lb back down to 165lbs, but I am healthiest it seems around 183lbs.
- CompelTechnic 11y ago
  Stop eating.
- itchyouch 11y ago
  Semi-strenuous exercise to deplete available glucose, immediately followed by fasting. Cardio works well for this. Options aren't limited to running. Speed walking or slow walking at a 5-15% incline on a treadmill for some amount of time can achieve the necessary glycogen depletion. Consuming coconut milk as a fat source with its high level of medium chain triglycerides also generates more ketones per fat ingested then other fat sources Since glycogen storage requires lots of water, losing 1-5lbs in water weight after exercising is a good sign that the glycogen stores have been depleted enough for the body to start looking for other sources of energy. One should be able to hit the scale, go exercise and sweat a ton, then go back to the scale 30mins to an hour later and see the water depletion. For myself I will hit the treadmill walking at 15% incline @ 2-4mph for 45mins to an hour while profusely sweating from the 3min mark till I stop.
  - DrScump 11y ago
    Low-intensity exercise uses free fatty acids, not glucose/glycogen, as its primary fuel.
beachstartup 11y ago
i'm a keto True Believer[tm] but removing carbs also just immediately removes a ton of calories which directly contributes to weight loss. you can eat a surprising amount of protein and fat and veg and won't replace the calories lost. a hamburger bun, and a plate of french fries is honestly like a thousand calories. one thousand! that's like a huge ribeye steak. you don't even want to know how many calories are in a mission-style burrito tortilla. it's completely out of control. that kind of food is meant for hard labor, not internet finger tapping.
- noondip 11y ago
  Removing fat and alcohol would do you much more good, if calories are your primary concern - Fat: 1 gram = 9 calories Alcohol: 1 gram = 7 calories Carbohydrates: 1 gram = 4 calories Protein: 1 gram = 4 calories
  - beachstartup 11y ago
    these discussions always devolve into a bunch of numbers by diet pedants who seemingly have no passion for cuisine. i'm sorry but all the numbers in the world will not make me give up a nice fatty spiced chicken shawarma, or a juicy sausage and kraut, or a nice ribeye steak with a glass of pinot noir. i'd rather be dead and in the ground. on the other hand, i'm fine skipping the bread and eating just a couple of fries.
    - noondip 11y ago
      The incredible thing is, our tastes physically change in just a matter of several weeks. You're encouraged to try healthy eating as an experiment for just three weeks - I think you may change your mind on consuming unhealthy foods. > An inability to perceive low concentrations of fatty acids in foods was associated with greater consumption of fatty foods, specifically butter, meat, dairy, and increasing BMI. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21757270 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21757270 > Within a behavioral economic perspective, the reinforcement value of low-fat foods may increase following a low-fat dietary intervention, whereas the reinforcing properties of high-fat foods may decline. This is desirable as low-fat foods hold many advantages over high-fat foods in terms of weight maintenance. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12725716 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12725716 > The preference results of this study demonstrate a steady, progressive decline in liking for salt in soup following dietary intervention and monitoring activities aimed at reducing sodium intake. Approximately 3 mo were required for preferences to stabilize at a significantly lower salt level, which was maintained at 1 yr. This may be of relevance in clinical settings where low-sodium diets are used for treatment or prevention of hypertension. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3728360 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3728360 > Alterations in the fat content of the diet modulated taste sensitivity to C18:1 among lean subjects, which was increased following a 4-week period of fat restriction and attenuated following the high-fat diet. The failure of the high-fat diet to alter fatty acid taste thresholds among OW/OB subjects suggests that these individuals were 'adapted' to high-fat exposure, perhaps because of differences in habitual fat consumption. Taken together, these data suggest that excessive dietary fat attenuates nutrient sensing epithelia response in the oral cavity, which could be associated with changes in diet and weight status. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21829156 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21829156
noondip 11y ago
> This same condition, ketosis, occurs naturally when people are literally starving to death or seriously ill. During starvation this metabolic state is a kindness of nature allowing the victim to suffer much reduced pains of hunger while dying. During illness the suppression of the appetite frees the person to rest and recuperate, rather then be forced by hunger to gather and prepare food. Because ketogenic diets simulate this metabolic state seen with serious illness, I refer to them as “the make yourself sick diets.” As we will see below, another reason low-carbohydrate, high-protein diets deserve this title is they contain significant amounts of the very foods — the meats — that the American Cancer Society and the Heart Association tell us contribute to our most common causes of death and disability. https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/health-science/featured-articles/articles/high-protein-diets/ https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/health-science/... > A plant-based diet beat out the conventional American Diabetes Association diet in a head-to-head randomized controlled clinical trial, without restricting portions, no calorie or carb counting. A review of all such studies found that individuals following plant-based diets experience improved reductions in blood sugars, body weight, and cardiovascular risk, compared with those following diets that included animal products. http://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diets-for-diabetes/ http://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diets-for-diabet...
- nitrogen 11y ago
  What appears to work best on the scale of a clinical study may not work so well for some subsets of the population. I've yet to find any sort of plant-based meal that makes me nearly as energetic and satisfied as one that includes animal protein of some kind.
  - noondip 11y ago
    Please check my related comment below about adjusting taste preferences. While it's true a greater amount of non-animal foods are necessary on account of them being generally less calorically dense (while at the same time being more nutrient dense), you can certainly find meals to satisfy your desires with patience and resolve. Start small - replace the beef patty with a black bean patty, for instance.

culturestate 11y ago

I'm not diabetic, but I completely agree with the subjective improvement that comes with a low-carb diet. Even a light-ish carby meal -- say, penne with pesto -- makes me feel substantially heavier and more bloated than eating a steak slathered with butter.

eclipxe 11y ago

Another vote of confidence here. Keto makes a huge difference.

kruhft 11y ago

What signs made you know it was safe to go off your bipolar meds?

jawilson2 11y ago
I don't think this is standard-of-care yet, though some docs I know will go this route. There is a good amount of emerging research of the positive effects of the keto diet on brain health, including bipolar disorder: https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=ketogenic+diet+bipolar&btnG=&as_sdt=1%2C14&as_sdtp= https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&q=ketogenic+diet+bi... https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=ketogenic+diet+neuroprotective&btnG=&hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C14 https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=ketogenic+diet+neuropro...
hyperchase 11y ago
My psychologist decided they weren't needed any more.
- kruhft 11y ago
  I'm curious how your psychologist came to that conclusion. Was it your suggestion to come off the meds and they agreed?
viewer5 11y ago
For anyone reading: Please consult your doctor before altering your dosage of mind-altering medications. Some of them, for example, have to be stepped down in dosage gradually, lest bad side effects happen.

atom-morgan 11y ago

Paleo here. Can confirm it's been great for me as well. And I just wrapped up a month with no sugar (drinks, candy, added sugar, etc).

BlakePetersen 11y ago
Diabetes isn't about sugar specifically, it's about carbohydrates. I'm sure you didn't have a "no carb" month -- which means your point is kinda meaningless. You may have avoided the 38 grams of sugar in that can of coke, but did you compensate by eating 4 handfuls of grapes? To a diabetic, all carbs are bad, not just the ones that rot your teeth.
- noondip 11y ago
  I believe you're meaning to allude to refined carbohydrates, like the ones found in soda drinks. "No carbs" would mean consuming no fruit or vegetables, at all - not exactly a practical strategy for healthful eating. (Note: grapes are especially high on the glycemic index and not an ideal representation of healthy carbohydrate, so your likening them to a can of soda isn't entirely inaccurate) > The vegetarian diet (~60% of energy from carbohydrates,15% protein and 25% fat) consisted of vegetables, grains,legumes, fruits and nuts. Animal products were limited to amaximum of one portion of low-fat yogurt a day. > In conclusion, a vegetarian diet led to a greater improve-ment in quality of life and mood. Patients consuming a vegetarian diet felt less constrained than those consuming the conventional diet. Disinhibition decreased with a vegetarian diet. The decrease in feelings of hunger tended to be greater in the vegetarian group. All these results suggest that a vegetarian diet is sustainable in the long term and may exhibit desired improvements not only in physical, but also in mental health of patients with Type 2 diabetes. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23050853 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23050853
- atom-morgan 11y ago
  Never said it was. The topic just made me think of it is all. And I didn't substitute with a ton of fruits. I barely ate any. I also eat very little carbs.

brandonmenc 11y ago

Anecdotally, my father didn't develop the disease until after he went on a ketogenic diet, but the doctors believe chronic lack of sleep caused his diabetes so diet probably was not a factor either way.

hyperchase 11y ago
That's unfortunate. Type 1 or 2 diabetes? My mother is T1 and she cannot do a low-carb diet because of the possibility of ketoacidosis, which she's already been hospitalized once for.
- datiecher 11y ago
  I would suggest she tries the program created by Dr. Neil Barnard in this case as he actually uses a low fat high carb diet in order to reverse diabetes. Both my father and father-in-law got rid of the medications (my inlaw even had to take insulin before the program) and have overall improved their health, lost weight and are feeling much more energetic. My father was able to be out of his medications after two months and my father-in-law in 4 months. Here's the Amazon link for book about the program and you can also read the reviews of many people who have successfully changed their for the better as well: http://www.amazon.com/Neal-Barnards-Program-Reversing-Diabetes/dp/1594868107 http://www.amazon.com/Neal-Barnards-Program-Reversing-Diabet...

voidlogic 11y ago

+1 more anecdote, I was never diabetic, but doing keto for a year helped me lose 60 lbs and regain my insulin sensitivity. Even now if I eat keto for breakfast and lunch and moderate carb for supper. Even when I have the occasional high-carb meal, I feel dramatically different than I did before keto/weight loss. I don't know about the pancreas, but both abstaining form alcohol and keto are shown to dramatically reduce the amount of fat stored in the liver.

aantix 11y ago

Is there any way to quickly induce ketosis?

CompelTechnic 11y ago
Stop eating.
- wavefunction 11y ago
  No, this just puts your body into starvation mode. You should eat proteins, vegetables (especially leafy green ones) and a moderate amount of fruit. Natural fats like animal fats are ok too, depending on other health factors. I am not a doctor but a ketogenic diet helped me lose weight and feel great. 230lb back down to 165lbs, but I am healthiest it seems around 183lbs.
CompelTechnic 11y ago
Stop eating.
itchyouch 11y ago
Semi-strenuous exercise to deplete available glucose, immediately followed by fasting. Cardio works well for this. Options aren't limited to running. Speed walking or slow walking at a 5-15% incline on a treadmill for some amount of time can achieve the necessary glycogen depletion. Consuming coconut milk as a fat source with its high level of medium chain triglycerides also generates more ketones per fat ingested then other fat sources Since glycogen storage requires lots of water, losing 1-5lbs in water weight after exercising is a good sign that the glycogen stores have been depleted enough for the body to start looking for other sources of energy. One should be able to hit the scale, go exercise and sweat a ton, then go back to the scale 30mins to an hour later and see the water depletion. For myself I will hit the treadmill walking at 15% incline @ 2-4mph for 45mins to an hour while profusely sweating from the 3min mark till I stop.
- DrScump 11y ago
  Low-intensity exercise uses free fatty acids, not glucose/glycogen, as its primary fuel.

beachstartup 11y ago

i'm a keto True Believer[tm] but removing carbs also just immediately removes a ton of calories which directly contributes to weight loss. you can eat a surprising amount of protein and fat and veg and won't replace the calories lost. a hamburger bun, and a plate of french fries is honestly like a thousand calories. one thousand! that's like a huge ribeye steak. you don't even want to know how many calories are in a mission-style burrito tortilla. it's completely out of control. that kind of food is meant for hard labor, not internet finger tapping.

noondip 11y ago
Removing fat and alcohol would do you much more good, if calories are your primary concern - Fat: 1 gram = 9 calories Alcohol: 1 gram = 7 calories Carbohydrates: 1 gram = 4 calories Protein: 1 gram = 4 calories
- beachstartup 11y ago
  these discussions always devolve into a bunch of numbers by diet pedants who seemingly have no passion for cuisine. i'm sorry but all the numbers in the world will not make me give up a nice fatty spiced chicken shawarma, or a juicy sausage and kraut, or a nice ribeye steak with a glass of pinot noir. i'd rather be dead and in the ground. on the other hand, i'm fine skipping the bread and eating just a couple of fries.
  - noondip 11y ago
    The incredible thing is, our tastes physically change in just a matter of several weeks. You're encouraged to try healthy eating as an experiment for just three weeks - I think you may change your mind on consuming unhealthy foods. > An inability to perceive low concentrations of fatty acids in foods was associated with greater consumption of fatty foods, specifically butter, meat, dairy, and increasing BMI. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21757270 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21757270 > Within a behavioral economic perspective, the reinforcement value of low-fat foods may increase following a low-fat dietary intervention, whereas the reinforcing properties of high-fat foods may decline. This is desirable as low-fat foods hold many advantages over high-fat foods in terms of weight maintenance. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12725716 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12725716 > The preference results of this study demonstrate a steady, progressive decline in liking for salt in soup following dietary intervention and monitoring activities aimed at reducing sodium intake. Approximately 3 mo were required for preferences to stabilize at a significantly lower salt level, which was maintained at 1 yr. This may be of relevance in clinical settings where low-sodium diets are used for treatment or prevention of hypertension. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3728360 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3728360 > Alterations in the fat content of the diet modulated taste sensitivity to C18:1 among lean subjects, which was increased following a 4-week period of fat restriction and attenuated following the high-fat diet. The failure of the high-fat diet to alter fatty acid taste thresholds among OW/OB subjects suggests that these individuals were 'adapted' to high-fat exposure, perhaps because of differences in habitual fat consumption. Taken together, these data suggest that excessive dietary fat attenuates nutrient sensing epithelia response in the oral cavity, which could be associated with changes in diet and weight status. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21829156 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21829156

noondip 11y ago

> This same condition, ketosis, occurs naturally when people are literally starving to death or seriously ill. During starvation this metabolic state is a kindness of nature allowing the victim to suffer much reduced pains of hunger while dying. During illness the suppression of the appetite frees the person to rest and recuperate, rather then be forced by hunger to gather and prepare food. Because ketogenic diets simulate this metabolic state seen with serious illness, I refer to them as “the make yourself sick diets.” As we will see below, another reason low-carbohydrate, high-protein diets deserve this title is they contain significant amounts of the very foods — the meats — that the American Cancer Society and the Heart Association tell us contribute to our most common causes of death and disability. https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/health-science/featured-articles/articles/high-protein-diets/ https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/health-science/... > A plant-based diet beat out the conventional American Diabetes Association diet in a head-to-head randomized controlled clinical trial, without restricting portions, no calorie or carb counting. A review of all such studies found that individuals following plant-based diets experience improved reductions in blood sugars, body weight, and cardiovascular risk, compared with those following diets that included animal products. http://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diets-for-diabetes/ http://nutritionfacts.org/video/plant-based-diets-for-diabet...

nitrogen 11y ago
What appears to work best on the scale of a clinical study may not work so well for some subsets of the population. I've yet to find any sort of plant-based meal that makes me nearly as energetic and satisfied as one that includes animal protein of some kind.
- noondip 11y ago
  Please check my related comment below about adjusting taste preferences. While it's true a greater amount of non-animal foods are necessary on account of them being generally less calorically dense (while at the same time being more nutrient dense), you can certainly find meals to satisfy your desires with patience and resolve. Start small - replace the beef patty with a black bean patty, for instance.