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All very true. Perhaps men are more suicidal because the deck is stacked against them: - 93% of workers who died at work due to fatal accidents or violence wer

by jazzyk 11y ago

All very true. Perhaps men are more suicidal because the deck is stacked against them: - 93% of workers who died at work due to fatal accidents or violence were male - 77% of males are genitally mutilated at birth (in the US), female mutilation is illegal - 29% of male first-time offenders were sentenced to custody. For women, that figure was 17%. Men have a 62% chance of being bailed, while for women that figure is 80% - men are as likely as women to be victims of domestic abuse - men are more likely to be made redundant and less likely to be re-employed than women - 90% of homeless are male But I hear there is this "war on women" going on...

lujim 11y ago
As a male with only brothers I always thought men had things worse. We are expected to do 100% of "Man's work" and 50% of everything else "Shared work". The concept of "Women's work" is seen as a very outdated and offensive. As a male you aren't suppose to complain or ask for help so you don't. It seems like a raw deal... Now that I have a wife and a daughter I realize that women often have it worse than men (in terms of general happiness). Not because of men but because of how complex their relationships with other women/groups of women are. They are brutal to each other and spend tons of energy undermining each others confidence and playing micro social games of exclusion and humiliation for virtually no gain. I feel sad to know that my daughter will have to endure the slings and arrows of "Frenemies" as she grows up, and that she may well dish it out to some other poor girl.
jazzyk 11y ago
Down-voted for stating fully verifiable facts?
- Dylan16807 11y ago
  I'm sure it's for the words "deck is stacked against them" and the snark about the problems women face, not the list of facts. A big list of pros without cons, or cons without pros, says nothing about overall ranking. Overall ranking is a terrible way to think about things, anyway. Problems don't get fixed because other people have different problems.
  - jazzyk 11y ago
    I listed "cons" because they almost certainly affect the high rate of suicides among men - the very topic of this thread. The statistics listed support the "deck is stacked..." statement. It is hard not to be frustrated by the media narrative focusing on women's issues, mostly ignoring men's.
    - DanBC 11y ago
      Please could you show any link between male circumcision and suicide?
      - jazzyk 11y ago
        See my response in the other subthread below
- psychometry 11y ago
  I downvoted you for parroting a bunch of unrelated "red pill" nonsense in order to advance an insolent, regressive agenda instead of providing a meaningful commentary on the article or the other comments here.
  - zaccus 11y ago
    Uh, what part of that comment is unrelated nonsense? Seemed pretty related and sensical to me.
    - DanBC 11y ago
      It's a bunch of random MRA stuff dumped into a thread. How is male circumcision linked to suicide? How is workplace death linked to suicide?
      - zaccus 11y ago
        He didn't say any of those things are related to suicide, they're just examples of gender disparity. I don't know much about MRA or red pill, but my guess is that you're committing an association fallacy here.
        DanBC 11y ago
        > He didn't say any of those things are related to suicide Which is why he got downvoted. They're mostly not relevant to suicide[1]. It's just a dump of MRA bullshit with no relevance to the thread. [1] but if you can show reputable sites that make links I'd be interested to see them. (And I'm not saying they're all irrelevant.)
        gammagoblin 11y ago
        Shut the fuck up, you stupid moron. They're statistics, not "MRA bullshit". Do they show any correlation with suicide at all? No. Are they implicitly MRA statistics because they highlight disparity between genders specifically for men? No. Does highlighting the difficulties one gender faces neglect another gender's difficulties? No. So, please shut the fuck up. You are doing absolutely fuck all to help ANY gender. Your polarised views and divisive attitude is only making it far, far worse.
dsfyu404ed 11y ago
"- 93% of workers who died at work due to fatal accidents or violence were male" Violence in the workplace is negligible compared to occupational hazards. Those killed by violence in the armed forces or law enforcement is most certainly a "workplace hazard" so that can't be lumped in with workplace violence. Last I checked there weren't a lot of women working in close proximity to heavy equipment and industrial machines when compared with men. If you're not working somewhere dangerous you're less likely to be killed/injured on the job. - 77% of males are genitally mutilated at birth (in the US), female mutilation is illegal The CDC stopped recommending circumcision because it didn't have probable benefits, noticed bad results (increased chance of STD transmission) and started recommending it again. You're fighting an uphill battle on that one "- 29% of male first-time offenders were sentenced to custody. For women, that figure was 17%. Men have a 62% chance of being bailed, while for women that figure is 80%" Without information about the nature of the crimes this is useless. There's an infinite supply of anecdotal evidence that law enforcement treats women less poorly (more warnings, less piling on of charges) but that's not really admissible evidence in this sort of numbers debate. I generally agree with your implied conclusion but pick better supporting evidence, when you have an unpopular opinion you need to be so convincing that even the dumbest of the dumb don't feels quite right disagreeing.
- jazzyk 11y ago
  Your point about working conditions being the reason for fatal accidents is obviously correct, I thought it was kinda implied (wanted to keep it brief). I was not discussing potential benefits (or lack thereof) of circumcision - rather pointing out the unequal treatment of men (OK to mutilate without consent) vs women (illegal to mutilate).
- Lawtonfogle 11y ago
  >The CDC stopped recommending circumcision because it didn't have probable benefits, noticed bad results (increased chance of STD transmission) and started recommending it again. You're fighting an uphill battle on that one Are we to suggest that the main issue with FGM is that there aren't any major beneficial results from doing such?

by jazzyk 11y ago

lujim 11y ago

As a male with only brothers I always thought men had things worse. We are expected to do 100% of "Man's work" and 50% of everything else "Shared work". The concept of "Women's work" is seen as a very outdated and offensive. As a male you aren't suppose to complain or ask for help so you don't. It seems like a raw deal... Now that I have a wife and a daughter I realize that women often have it worse than men (in terms of general happiness). Not because of men but because of how complex their relationships with other women/groups of women are. They are brutal to each other and spend tons of energy undermining each others confidence and playing micro social games of exclusion and humiliation for virtually no gain. I feel sad to know that my daughter will have to endure the slings and arrows of "Frenemies" as she grows up, and that she may well dish it out to some other poor girl.

jazzyk 11y ago

Down-voted for stating fully verifiable facts?

Dylan16807 11y ago
I'm sure it's for the words "deck is stacked against them" and the snark about the problems women face, not the list of facts. A big list of pros without cons, or cons without pros, says nothing about overall ranking. Overall ranking is a terrible way to think about things, anyway. Problems don't get fixed because other people have different problems.
- jazzyk 11y ago
  I listed "cons" because they almost certainly affect the high rate of suicides among men - the very topic of this thread. The statistics listed support the "deck is stacked..." statement. It is hard not to be frustrated by the media narrative focusing on women's issues, mostly ignoring men's.
  - DanBC 11y ago
    Please could you show any link between male circumcision and suicide?
    - jazzyk 11y ago
      See my response in the other subthread below
psychometry 11y ago
I downvoted you for parroting a bunch of unrelated "red pill" nonsense in order to advance an insolent, regressive agenda instead of providing a meaningful commentary on the article or the other comments here.
- zaccus 11y ago
  Uh, what part of that comment is unrelated nonsense? Seemed pretty related and sensical to me.
  - DanBC 11y ago
    It's a bunch of random MRA stuff dumped into a thread. How is male circumcision linked to suicide? How is workplace death linked to suicide?
    - zaccus 11y ago
      He didn't say any of those things are related to suicide, they're just examples of gender disparity. I don't know much about MRA or red pill, but my guess is that you're committing an association fallacy here.
      - DanBC 11y ago
        > He didn't say any of those things are related to suicide Which is why he got downvoted. They're mostly not relevant to suicide[1]. It's just a dump of MRA bullshit with no relevance to the thread. [1] but if you can show reputable sites that make links I'd be interested to see them. (And I'm not saying they're all irrelevant.)
        gammagoblin 11y ago
        Shut the fuck up, you stupid moron. They're statistics, not "MRA bullshit". Do they show any correlation with suicide at all? No. Are they implicitly MRA statistics because they highlight disparity between genders specifically for men? No. Does highlighting the difficulties one gender faces neglect another gender's difficulties? No. So, please shut the fuck up. You are doing absolutely fuck all to help ANY gender. Your polarised views and divisive attitude is only making it far, far worse.

dsfyu404ed 11y ago

"- 93% of workers who died at work due to fatal accidents or violence were male" Violence in the workplace is negligible compared to occupational hazards. Those killed by violence in the armed forces or law enforcement is most certainly a "workplace hazard" so that can't be lumped in with workplace violence. Last I checked there weren't a lot of women working in close proximity to heavy equipment and industrial machines when compared with men. If you're not working somewhere dangerous you're less likely to be killed/injured on the job. - 77% of males are genitally mutilated at birth (in the US), female mutilation is illegal The CDC stopped recommending circumcision because it didn't have probable benefits, noticed bad results (increased chance of STD transmission) and started recommending it again. You're fighting an uphill battle on that one "- 29% of male first-time offenders were sentenced to custody. For women, that figure was 17%. Men have a 62% chance of being bailed, while for women that figure is 80%" Without information about the nature of the crimes this is useless. There's an infinite supply of anecdotal evidence that law enforcement treats women less poorly (more warnings, less piling on of charges) but that's not really admissible evidence in this sort of numbers debate. I generally agree with your implied conclusion but pick better supporting evidence, when you have an unpopular opinion you need to be so convincing that even the dumbest of the dumb don't feels quite right disagreeing.

jazzyk 11y ago
Your point about working conditions being the reason for fatal accidents is obviously correct, I thought it was kinda implied (wanted to keep it brief). I was not discussing potential benefits (or lack thereof) of circumcision - rather pointing out the unequal treatment of men (OK to mutilate without consent) vs women (illegal to mutilate).
Lawtonfogle 11y ago
>The CDC stopped recommending circumcision because it didn't have probable benefits, noticed bad results (increased chance of STD transmission) and started recommending it again. You're fighting an uphill battle on that one Are we to suggest that the main issue with FGM is that there aren't any major beneficial results from doing such?