4 ms·

How long until this happens in the snows sports industry? Mid level snowboards / skis sell in the $500 range, with high end going for $1000+. Most probably have

by leejo 11y ago

How long until this happens in the snows sports industry? Mid level snowboards / skis sell in the $500 range, with high end going for $1000+. Most probably have < $50 worth of raw materials and < $100 worth of labour costs. As Signal have shown, you can make a snowboard out of just about anything once you have the machinery (which is where the high initial investment happens i suppose): http://signalsnowboards.com/shows/ett/season-1 http://signalsnowboards.com/shows/ett/season-1

collyw 11y ago
I am pretty sure you can go to any ski resort and pick up a second hand board for the close to $100 bucks.
- leejo 11y ago
  Indeed, and you can pick up gear that is unused but from a couple of seasons ago for significantly less than the new season's stuff. I guess the board rental part of the market currently takes the place of a low cost gear for beginners alternative, and if you're only spending a few days a year on the slopes you might not even be bothered about buying your own gear.
  - rokhayakebe 11y ago
    New season skiboard sounds like new season wrench/plier to me.
- josefresco 11y ago
  Are you also pretty sure that you couldn't buy a used surfboard for $100? I just did a quick search on Craigslist for my area (somewhat of a surf place) and saw prices from $200 - I'm sure if that's their asking, the sale price is potentially lower.
  - surfearth 11y ago
    You can. However, Wavestorm's disruption is that for $100 you get a new, good quality board that is ideal for beginners. Before Wavestorm <$200 would fetch a used/poor condition fiberglass board. These are somewhat harder to learn on because they pose a greater danger for novices.
    - irl_zebra 11y ago
      And with Costco's return policy, broken boards can just be brought back for a full refund, as it states in the article.
doublerebel 11y ago
Just like surfboards, any intermediate to advanced ski/snowboard easily requires more than $100 labor. Not to mention the cost of stocking/shipping such a large item. As another commenter mentioned, the seasonal aspect already provides heavy discounts on older gear. This area is not ripe for disruption, new shred stick shapers pop up all the time and there is gear for every price range. (Also the price floor is higher than surfing because if your gear breaks mid-mountain you can easily die.)
- nickbauman 11y ago
  I've been skiing downhill since the age of 4. The higher-end skis really do make a huge difference tackling advanced terrain. I don't enjoy mogul fields on cheap skis: I can't read the changes in the terrain as well through my feet, I have to push harder and earlier to initiate a turn and my edges never feel as responsive or planted as they do with better skis. I have no idea what goes into better skis, though. I just know they cost more.
  - matwood 11y ago
    I agree. I've been doing board sports since a similar age, and once you get past intermediate the higher end stuff does make a difference. (Surf|Snow|Wake|Skate)boards all have cheap intro versions, but the high end stuff does make a difference after a certain level. Should they cost _that_ much more? I don't know.
  - nn3 11y ago
    Do you think your findings would hold up to a double blind test? Often expensive items have a strong placebo effect just based on price ("it has to be better")
    - nickbauman 11y ago
      Doubt it. My skiing changed dramatically when as a lad I got top of the line skis. Later, as a ski instructor, I had to use rental skis, I found that I was unable to keep up with my advanced students with the el-cheapo rentals.
micro_cam 11y ago
For skis, boards and especially ski boots (i'm not sure how snowboard boots are made) you need to make a whole size run which drives the cost of molds/forms up. Its also more expensive to prototype since you can't hand shape a one off design. Ski shapes were evolving rapidly but have started to stabilize a bit so maybe we'll see costs go down but we're also seeing a push into lighter weight materials (and for the boots and bindings more mechanically complex designs) as backcountry touring gear is the area seeing the most consistent sales growth of late.
shanecleveland 11y ago
Would love to see it, but you'd need disruption beyond just the gear. It is incredibly expensive to gain access to the passes (lift tickets, etc.). Even after purchasing gear, a family could spend hundreds of dollars for a day of skiing. But that might be more bearable if the barrier to entry (cheaper gear) was lower.
- leejo 11y ago
  The interesting thing about lift passes is, at least here in Switzerland, you can save a significant amount by being resident in a ski resort. I bought my season pass last week, at a discount of around 40%. Other savings i made last year was by following the local ski club around, giving huge discounts on race days. Of course, the tourists get charged quite a bit more...
- gonzo 11y ago
  I get a Vail "Epic" (season) pass every year for a Christmas present. Experiences, not things.
hahamrfunnyguy 11y ago
You can buy $50 snowboards at Walmart, but it's nothing that should be ridden outside of the backyard. You can find bare boards for $75-$100, and bindings and boots for around $50. So yes, to some extent it's already happening in the snow industry. I doubt it is going to get too much cheaper than it is now.

by leejo 11y ago

collyw 11y ago

I am pretty sure you can go to any ski resort and pick up a second hand board for the close to $100 bucks.

leejo 11y ago
Indeed, and you can pick up gear that is unused but from a couple of seasons ago for significantly less than the new season's stuff. I guess the board rental part of the market currently takes the place of a low cost gear for beginners alternative, and if you're only spending a few days a year on the slopes you might not even be bothered about buying your own gear.
- rokhayakebe 11y ago
  New season skiboard sounds like new season wrench/plier to me.
josefresco 11y ago
Are you also pretty sure that you couldn't buy a used surfboard for $100? I just did a quick search on Craigslist for my area (somewhat of a surf place) and saw prices from $200 - I'm sure if that's their asking, the sale price is potentially lower.
- surfearth 11y ago
  You can. However, Wavestorm's disruption is that for $100 you get a new, good quality board that is ideal for beginners. Before Wavestorm <$200 would fetch a used/poor condition fiberglass board. These are somewhat harder to learn on because they pose a greater danger for novices.
  - irl_zebra 11y ago
    And with Costco's return policy, broken boards can just be brought back for a full refund, as it states in the article.

doublerebel 11y ago

Just like surfboards, any intermediate to advanced ski/snowboard easily requires more than $100 labor. Not to mention the cost of stocking/shipping such a large item. As another commenter mentioned, the seasonal aspect already provides heavy discounts on older gear. This area is not ripe for disruption, new shred stick shapers pop up all the time and there is gear for every price range. (Also the price floor is higher than surfing because if your gear breaks mid-mountain you can easily die.)

nickbauman 11y ago
I've been skiing downhill since the age of 4. The higher-end skis really do make a huge difference tackling advanced terrain. I don't enjoy mogul fields on cheap skis: I can't read the changes in the terrain as well through my feet, I have to push harder and earlier to initiate a turn and my edges never feel as responsive or planted as they do with better skis. I have no idea what goes into better skis, though. I just know they cost more.
- matwood 11y ago
  I agree. I've been doing board sports since a similar age, and once you get past intermediate the higher end stuff does make a difference. (Surf|Snow|Wake|Skate)boards all have cheap intro versions, but the high end stuff does make a difference after a certain level. Should they cost _that_ much more? I don't know.
- nn3 11y ago
  Do you think your findings would hold up to a double blind test? Often expensive items have a strong placebo effect just based on price ("it has to be better")
  - nickbauman 11y ago
    Doubt it. My skiing changed dramatically when as a lad I got top of the line skis. Later, as a ski instructor, I had to use rental skis, I found that I was unable to keep up with my advanced students with the el-cheapo rentals.

micro_cam 11y ago

For skis, boards and especially ski boots (i'm not sure how snowboard boots are made) you need to make a whole size run which drives the cost of molds/forms up. Its also more expensive to prototype since you can't hand shape a one off design. Ski shapes were evolving rapidly but have started to stabilize a bit so maybe we'll see costs go down but we're also seeing a push into lighter weight materials (and for the boots and bindings more mechanically complex designs) as backcountry touring gear is the area seeing the most consistent sales growth of late.

shanecleveland 11y ago

Would love to see it, but you'd need disruption beyond just the gear. It is incredibly expensive to gain access to the passes (lift tickets, etc.). Even after purchasing gear, a family could spend hundreds of dollars for a day of skiing. But that might be more bearable if the barrier to entry (cheaper gear) was lower.

leejo 11y ago
The interesting thing about lift passes is, at least here in Switzerland, you can save a significant amount by being resident in a ski resort. I bought my season pass last week, at a discount of around 40%. Other savings i made last year was by following the local ski club around, giving huge discounts on race days. Of course, the tourists get charged quite a bit more...
gonzo 11y ago
I get a Vail "Epic" (season) pass every year for a Christmas present. Experiences, not things.

hahamrfunnyguy 11y ago

You can buy $50 snowboards at Walmart, but it's nothing that should be ridden outside of the backyard. You can find bare boards for $75-$100, and bindings and boots for around $50. So yes, to some extent it's already happening in the snow industry. I doubt it is going to get too much cheaper than it is now.