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I somewhat disagree. If someone has the passion that they'd rather code than study: They're most likely doing the wrong thing. There needs to be more people ch

I somewhat disagree. If someone has the passion that they'd rather code than study: They're most likely doing the wrong thing. There needs to be more people chasing their dreams rather then being cranked through the academia process.

trymas 11y ago
TL;DR: imho there should be a balance between catching your passionate goals and broadening your knowledge pool by getting 'normal' education. Many success stories are marginal cases and can be compared to winning a lottery ticket. Well I should agree with both of you. Many success stories must be taken with a grain of salt. Some of them are truly like winning a lottery. Also making idols out of college/school dropouts is not very healthy for society over all. I agree that today you can make descent money by making web/mobile applications, but do not think that you will be a millionaire or be hired by google/facebook/apple/etc within a year. But if you are passionate about something you should (or even must) pursue it. IMHO marginal cases should not be idolised. I have seen too many people who believe that every one can code, though ignoring that software development requires great knowledge and education (formal or informal).
bsaul 11y ago
Haven't ever had any teacher telling you to do something you didn't like to do, and then once you've done it, you realize how much better you've become at a given subject ? That's also a part of learning, and a part of the advantage of having a teacher. Sometimes, you need to do things you don't like in the short term, that will prove to be an excellent thing in the long term. Now i'm not saying someone shouldn't code in their spare time. Just don't trash your exams for it. Keep a balance. Maybe in a few years you'll realize you'll want to become a doctor and save lives rather than create video games. Keep the doors open.
- forgetsusername 11y ago
  >Haven't ever had any teacher telling you to do something you didn't like to do, This is an important point. Let's face it, kids are socially stupid and inexperienced. They don't know what they want, what they need, what's good for them or even what's out there. Their worlds are small. 15 year old me would eat pizza every meal if it were my choice. Allowing for the freedom of exploration is important, but so is a little bit of steering.
halayli 11y ago
you can chase all the dreams you want. It doesn't change the fact that chances this happening to someone else is almost 0. He's not the only person with a passion. Many superb software engineers to be won't get the opportunity he got.
- coldtea 11y ago
  Following your dreams is a tax on people who are bad at statistics.
amelius 11y ago
Being a programmer without good knowledge of calculus, linear algebra, etc. is going to suck. Even if you don't need it for your current project.
- jack9 11y ago
  Linear Algebra is almost worthless to most programmers. I challenge you to demonstrate otherwise. Of course it has use in specific industry. So what? There's a lot of thinking that math is a fundamental part of software development. That was true when the problems were coming up with abstractions that required specific solutions. That hasn't been the focus of development, for decades. Welcome to the world of data processing and presentation (the vast majority of time and effort is in UI).
  - cableshaft 11y ago
    Most business and web programmers would find it useless, perhaps, but if you're wanting to go into video games, simulation, physics, aerospace, robotics/internet of things (i.e. sensors), or the about to explode virtual reality field, you will most likely benefit quite a bit from linear algebra. I've found it much more useful than my calculus classes, personally (although calculus is also useful to know for most of these industries). Yes, those are specific industries, but that's quite a few specific industries. There's probably others that could benefit from it as well.
    - gozo 11y ago
      That's more because math is important to those fields though. If you're making e.g. a video game math is a very small part of the overall work. It's cool as a hobby if you can go "I know math and I know programming, therefor I can make this game like thing". But if you wanna work as a game programmer your better off focusing on that and figuring out whatever math you need along the way.
  - zeroxfe 11y ago
    > I challenge you to demonstrate otherwise. graphics, machine learning, cryptography, data compression, optimization, physics, simulations, genetics, traffic flow analysis, economics, audio processing, control systems, vision...
coldtea 11y ago
>I somewhat disagree. If someone has the passion that they'd rather code than study The problem is everybody thinks they have the "passion" (and the "good idea"). (where by "everybody" I mean, a hell of a lot of people who should be studying instead, not literally everybody).
rawTruthHurts 11y ago
Passion doesn't save you from your own lack of talent.
badpenny 11y ago
Studying and coding aren't mutually exclusive. Most people who program for a living did so by studying and exams. It's not sexy but then real life mostly isn't. There are plenty of people "chasing their dreams" but a lot (most?) of them will have to settle for less because of the way the world works.
cabinpark 11y ago
>There needs to be more people chasing their dreams rather then being cranked through the academia process. I am reminded of the following story I experienced in my first year chemistry class. The class was being taught by the head of undergraduate studies for science and he asked us (a room of 500 students) how many people wanted to become chemists and maybe 20 or so people put up their hand. How many people want to become physicists? Maybe 30 or so put up their hand. How many people want to become doctors? A good 400 people put up their hand. He then said "only 20 of you will make it to med school, I hope you have a back-up plan." The problem is that we only hear about the success stories not the vast amount of people who fail. That isn't to say don't follow your dreams, but be realistic about them and have other options available when things don't go your way.
kartan 11y ago
>There needs to be more people chasing their dreams rather then being cranked through the academia process. That's really bad advice. Going through a formal learning process is going to help you to understand not only technology but also processes. And you are also going to meet there a lot of people with similar interests. Not studying when you want a job in the industry is taking an extremely hard path (that's why is news that some on achieves it) for the sake of it. And you always can do both. I know a lot of people that goes to University and develop software in their spare time.
s73v3r 11y ago
But what are those people going to do when they fail? Chasing your dreams is great. Doing so at the expense of schooling, especially when it's possible to do both, is a gamble at best.

trymas 11y ago

TL;DR: imho there should be a balance between catching your passionate goals and broadening your knowledge pool by getting 'normal' education. Many success stories are marginal cases and can be compared to winning a lottery ticket. Well I should agree with both of you. Many success stories must be taken with a grain of salt. Some of them are truly like winning a lottery. Also making idols out of college/school dropouts is not very healthy for society over all. I agree that today you can make descent money by making web/mobile applications, but do not think that you will be a millionaire or be hired by google/facebook/apple/etc within a year. But if you are passionate about something you should (or even must) pursue it. IMHO marginal cases should not be idolised. I have seen too many people who believe that every one can code, though ignoring that software development requires great knowledge and education (formal or informal).

bsaul 11y ago

Haven't ever had any teacher telling you to do something you didn't like to do, and then once you've done it, you realize how much better you've become at a given subject ? That's also a part of learning, and a part of the advantage of having a teacher. Sometimes, you need to do things you don't like in the short term, that will prove to be an excellent thing in the long term. Now i'm not saying someone shouldn't code in their spare time. Just don't trash your exams for it. Keep a balance. Maybe in a few years you'll realize you'll want to become a doctor and save lives rather than create video games. Keep the doors open.

forgetsusername 11y ago
>Haven't ever had any teacher telling you to do something you didn't like to do, This is an important point. Let's face it, kids are socially stupid and inexperienced. They don't know what they want, what they need, what's good for them or even what's out there. Their worlds are small. 15 year old me would eat pizza every meal if it were my choice. Allowing for the freedom of exploration is important, but so is a little bit of steering.

halayli 11y ago

you can chase all the dreams you want. It doesn't change the fact that chances this happening to someone else is almost 0. He's not the only person with a passion. Many superb software engineers to be won't get the opportunity he got.

coldtea 11y ago
Following your dreams is a tax on people who are bad at statistics.

amelius 11y ago

Being a programmer without good knowledge of calculus, linear algebra, etc. is going to suck. Even if you don't need it for your current project.

jack9 11y ago
Linear Algebra is almost worthless to most programmers. I challenge you to demonstrate otherwise. Of course it has use in specific industry. So what? There's a lot of thinking that math is a fundamental part of software development. That was true when the problems were coming up with abstractions that required specific solutions. That hasn't been the focus of development, for decades. Welcome to the world of data processing and presentation (the vast majority of time and effort is in UI).
- cableshaft 11y ago
  Most business and web programmers would find it useless, perhaps, but if you're wanting to go into video games, simulation, physics, aerospace, robotics/internet of things (i.e. sensors), or the about to explode virtual reality field, you will most likely benefit quite a bit from linear algebra. I've found it much more useful than my calculus classes, personally (although calculus is also useful to know for most of these industries). Yes, those are specific industries, but that's quite a few specific industries. There's probably others that could benefit from it as well.
  - gozo 11y ago
    That's more because math is important to those fields though. If you're making e.g. a video game math is a very small part of the overall work. It's cool as a hobby if you can go "I know math and I know programming, therefor I can make this game like thing". But if you wanna work as a game programmer your better off focusing on that and figuring out whatever math you need along the way.
- zeroxfe 11y ago
  > I challenge you to demonstrate otherwise. graphics, machine learning, cryptography, data compression, optimization, physics, simulations, genetics, traffic flow analysis, economics, audio processing, control systems, vision...

coldtea 11y ago

>I somewhat disagree. If someone has the passion that they'd rather code than study The problem is everybody thinks they have the "passion" (and the "good idea"). (where by "everybody" I mean, a hell of a lot of people who should be studying instead, not literally everybody).

rawTruthHurts 11y ago

Passion doesn't save you from your own lack of talent.

badpenny 11y ago

Studying and coding aren't mutually exclusive. Most people who program for a living did so by studying and exams. It's not sexy but then real life mostly isn't. There are plenty of people "chasing their dreams" but a lot (most?) of them will have to settle for less because of the way the world works.

cabinpark 11y ago

>There needs to be more people chasing their dreams rather then being cranked through the academia process. I am reminded of the following story I experienced in my first year chemistry class. The class was being taught by the head of undergraduate studies for science and he asked us (a room of 500 students) how many people wanted to become chemists and maybe 20 or so people put up their hand. How many people want to become physicists? Maybe 30 or so put up their hand. How many people want to become doctors? A good 400 people put up their hand. He then said "only 20 of you will make it to med school, I hope you have a back-up plan." The problem is that we only hear about the success stories not the vast amount of people who fail. That isn't to say don't follow your dreams, but be realistic about them and have other options available when things don't go your way.

kartan 11y ago

>There needs to be more people chasing their dreams rather then being cranked through the academia process. That's really bad advice. Going through a formal learning process is going to help you to understand not only technology but also processes. And you are also going to meet there a lot of people with similar interests. Not studying when you want a job in the industry is taking an extremely hard path (that's why is news that some on achieves it) for the sake of it. And you always can do both. I know a lot of people that goes to University and develop software in their spare time.

s73v3r 11y ago

But what are those people going to do when they fail? Chasing your dreams is great. Doing so at the expense of schooling, especially when it's possible to do both, is a gamble at best.