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The CEO has already been fired, but for something this big it won't just be the low-level types that get fired.

ceejayoz 11y ago
He resigned, with a potential €60 million payout coming his way. More than firing is due here - people should be going to jail for criminal fraud.
- forgetsusername 11y ago
  >More than firing is due here - people should be going to jail for criminal fraud. How about they prove criminal fraud before we talk about locking people up?
  - ceejayoz 11y ago
    Someone committed criminal fraud. You don't accidentally put a defeat device like this into a car.
gruez 11y ago
>The CEO has already been fired ...with a 67M severance package https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2015/09/24/outgoing-volkswagen-ceos-exit-package-could-top-67-million/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2015/09...
- nilkn 11y ago
  Half of that is a pension already earned, not severance, and the other half is a theoretical calculation from the article based on the maximum severance he could receive.
  - gregwtmtno 11y ago
    Earned? Accrued maybe, but I don't think earned is the appropriate word.
    - nilkn 11y ago
      It was earned in the same sense that any income or salary is earned. It's agreed upon payment exchanged for an agreed upon service. It was just as much a part of his compensation as his base salary.
      - Dylan16807 11y ago
        The implication is that he did not deliver agreed-upon services.
        nilkn 11y ago
        It's extremely uncommon to have to pay back compensation when one is fired. The board has the option of denying the severance entirely if they think that he did not deliver the requested services.
        Dylan16807 11y ago
        I'm sure legally he's entitled to the money. That does not imply he did his job properly.
        nilkn 11y ago
        > That does not imply he did his job properly. That would not be surprising given that he was fired. Unless you're suggesting that an employee who is fired should have to pay back all the compensation they were paid, I honestly don't see what you're trying to argue here. The real problem here is that companies mistakenly place such an incredible amount of confidence in their CEOs and therefore offer them extraordinary leverage in the negotiations. They become convinced that they've found the one person in the world who can lead their company into the future, and once that belief has settled they're willing to pay almost anything to keep that person.
- mtgx 11y ago
  He wasn't fired, so he shouldn't be getting a "severance package". He resigned. He shouldn't be getting anything for the tens of billions of dollars in damage caused to the company. I wish CEOs stopped being rewarded for screwing up. What's worse is that VW is still pushing the narrative that only two engineers are at fault here, and it refuses to blame the CEO, even though it keeps finding millions and millions of other cars affected by this.
  - mikestew 11y ago
    I wish CEOs stopped being rewarded for screwing up. CEOs typically aren't rewarded for screwing up, they get rewarded for signing up. Any severance package is most likely negotiated before they they take the job so as to get them to show up in the first place. Now why it's that way is a different discussion. Want me as CEO of GroupOn or Yahoo? Damned straight you're giving me a severance package whether I screw up or not, otherwise I'm taking a less risky job. But CEO of VW? WTH does the company need to offer a severance package for that gig?
    - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
      The rule is: the guys who can sign checks, all sign them for each other. No other logic need be applied.
    - adevine 11y ago
      > Want me as CEO of GroupOn or Yahoo? Damned straight you're giving me a severance package whether I screw up or not, otherwise I'm taking a less risky job. Why? Tons of employees take on this risk when joining a startup, and they don't get a huge severance package. Risk should be aligned with reward - if you succeed you should be very well compensated for a risky gig, but if you fail you shouldn't also be very well compensated. The only reason these large CEO severance packages exist is because other CEOs sign these deals, and who doesn't want to be on the "heads I win tails you lose" side of a deal.
      - mikestew 11y ago
        Why? I said why: I'll take the equally-well-paying and less risky job over at FoobarCorp, which is turning a profit and shows no signs of doing otherwise for the foreseeable future, where I might be employed for a good long while and leave without a black mark on my resume. If I'm going to have the albatross around my neck of not turning around an already screwed company, you're paying me whether I turn it around or not. Don't shoot the messenger, I don't like it any more than you do. I'm just laying out what the current incentive system is. Should Fiorina just scraped by on her $4 million/year (or whatever it was) salary, and made big stacks from her options when she turned HP around? Sure, just like the rest of us. But that, unfortunately, isn't the way it works. Instead the rest of us get to sit around saying, "hell, I would have been happy to fuck up HP for half that amount", because we're not members of the "get paid whether you do a decent job or not" club.

He resigned, with a potential €60 million payout coming his way. More than firing is due here - people should be going to jail for criminal fraud.

forgetsusername 11y ago
>More than firing is due here - people should be going to jail for criminal fraud. How about they prove criminal fraud before we talk about locking people up?
- ceejayoz 11y ago
  Someone committed criminal fraud. You don't accidentally put a defeat device like this into a car.

gruez 11y ago

>The CEO has already been fired ...with a 67M severance package https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2015/09/24/outgoing-volkswagen-ceos-exit-package-could-top-67-million/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/on-leadership/wp/2015/09...

nilkn 11y ago
Half of that is a pension already earned, not severance, and the other half is a theoretical calculation from the article based on the maximum severance he could receive.
- gregwtmtno 11y ago
  Earned? Accrued maybe, but I don't think earned is the appropriate word.
  - nilkn 11y ago
    It was earned in the same sense that any income or salary is earned. It's agreed upon payment exchanged for an agreed upon service. It was just as much a part of his compensation as his base salary.
    - Dylan16807 11y ago
      The implication is that he did not deliver agreed-upon services.
      - nilkn 11y ago
        It's extremely uncommon to have to pay back compensation when one is fired. The board has the option of denying the severance entirely if they think that he did not deliver the requested services.
        Dylan16807 11y ago
        I'm sure legally he's entitled to the money. That does not imply he did his job properly.
        nilkn 11y ago
        > That does not imply he did his job properly. That would not be surprising given that he was fired. Unless you're suggesting that an employee who is fired should have to pay back all the compensation they were paid, I honestly don't see what you're trying to argue here. The real problem here is that companies mistakenly place such an incredible amount of confidence in their CEOs and therefore offer them extraordinary leverage in the negotiations. They become convinced that they've found the one person in the world who can lead their company into the future, and once that belief has settled they're willing to pay almost anything to keep that person.
mtgx 11y ago
He wasn't fired, so he shouldn't be getting a "severance package". He resigned. He shouldn't be getting anything for the tens of billions of dollars in damage caused to the company. I wish CEOs stopped being rewarded for screwing up. What's worse is that VW is still pushing the narrative that only two engineers are at fault here, and it refuses to blame the CEO, even though it keeps finding millions and millions of other cars affected by this.
- mikestew 11y ago
  I wish CEOs stopped being rewarded for screwing up. CEOs typically aren't rewarded for screwing up, they get rewarded for signing up. Any severance package is most likely negotiated before they they take the job so as to get them to show up in the first place. Now why it's that way is a different discussion. Want me as CEO of GroupOn or Yahoo? Damned straight you're giving me a severance package whether I screw up or not, otherwise I'm taking a less risky job. But CEO of VW? WTH does the company need to offer a severance package for that gig?
  - JoeAltmaier 11y ago
    The rule is: the guys who can sign checks, all sign them for each other. No other logic need be applied.
  - adevine 11y ago
    > Want me as CEO of GroupOn or Yahoo? Damned straight you're giving me a severance package whether I screw up or not, otherwise I'm taking a less risky job. Why? Tons of employees take on this risk when joining a startup, and they don't get a huge severance package. Risk should be aligned with reward - if you succeed you should be very well compensated for a risky gig, but if you fail you shouldn't also be very well compensated. The only reason these large CEO severance packages exist is because other CEOs sign these deals, and who doesn't want to be on the "heads I win tails you lose" side of a deal.
    - mikestew 11y ago
      Why? I said why: I'll take the equally-well-paying and less risky job over at FoobarCorp, which is turning a profit and shows no signs of doing otherwise for the foreseeable future, where I might be employed for a good long while and leave without a black mark on my resume. If I'm going to have the albatross around my neck of not turning around an already screwed company, you're paying me whether I turn it around or not. Don't shoot the messenger, I don't like it any more than you do. I'm just laying out what the current incentive system is. Should Fiorina just scraped by on her $4 million/year (or whatever it was) salary, and made big stacks from her options when she turned HP around? Sure, just like the rest of us. But that, unfortunately, isn't the way it works. Instead the rest of us get to sit around saying, "hell, I would have been happy to fuck up HP for half that amount", because we're not members of the "get paid whether you do a decent job or not" club.