10 ms·
I think the Surface Book is finally something that can give the MacBook Pro line a run for its money, this should be interesting.
by nullrouted 11y ago
I think the Surface Book is finally something that can give the MacBook Pro line a run for its money, this should be interesting.
- Analemma_ 11y agoCredit to Panos and everyone who put that together, I didn't see the removable screen coming. That was the kind of "one more thing" moment that rivals Apple at their best showmanship.
- iLoch 11y agoRight before he said that I noticed the vents in the top of the screen and thought "huh, that's a weird place to put ventilation" but it didn't click in my mind until I saw it in the video.
- mythz 11y agoPanos was an obnoxious douche, the products and "One more thing" reveal deserved a much better presenter.
- slg 11y agoFunny, I thought he just did one of the best product launch presentations of the last few years. He gave it more personality, passion, and authenticity than you normally see in these type of things. To each their own I guess.
- mythz 11y agoAuthenticity? The guy comes off as a sleazy frustrated 2nd hand car salesman who doesn't even believe the crap he's shoveling. It's not even a matter of taste, telling people they should be excited and their too stupid for not having realized the Surface is the best thing ever made, is plain obnoxious. The guy demoing Continuum was much more likable, MS needs more him and less panos.
- jorts 11y agoI've had the pleasure of meeting Panos as a groomsman in my friend's wedding. He's a genuinely charismatic, fun and pleasurable person.
- WorldWideWayne 11y agoMicrosoft doesn't need an cult of personality or any of the shallow smoke and mirrors sales tactics that Apple utilizes. They made it to greatness without that bullshit.
- semafour 11y agoHe adopted the style of a preacher. Lots of contrast: fast to slow, loud to quiet, excited to thoughtful. He left long quiet spaces, and implored the audience to ask themselves to believe. It's a deliberate style that one may or may not like.
- SNACKeR99 11y agoComments like this don't exactly reflect well on you, either. Why not lead by example?
- cwyers 11y agoI was really excited about the Surface Book even before they showed that the keyboard is detachable, then I about lost my mind. Holy wow.
- RobotCaleb 11y agoThat reveal was pretty great.
- devit 11y agoHow do they prevent the Surface Book from toppling over, given that all internals must be in the screen part? It seems this would either double the system weight (due to counterweights) or require an extra stand in the back.
- cwyers 11y agoNot all the internals, apparently the GPU is in the keyboard (there's an Intel GPU on the CPU die that's used in tablet mod).
- cdnsteve 11y agoSurface book looks very interesting.
- pkkp 11y agoMy thoughts exactly. To me, OS/X's quality has been slipping, but I haven't found any non-Apple hardware that's comparable. If they get the trackpad and keyboard right on it, this will open a lot of interesting doors.
- vcarl 11y agoI can't believe how few laptops get the trackpad right. It's the first and primary interaction anyone has with the laptop, how are all of them so terrible! I'd love to get a non-macbook, but the list of laptops with powerful hardware that plays nice with a Unix based OS and has a trackpad that isn't unbearable is shockingly short.
- creshal 11y agoAnyone except trackpoint users! But yeah, it's mindboggling. The internal hardware is largely the same anyway, why are companies throwing away a chance to get ahead of the competition and use the same shoddy keyboards/touchpads everyone hates?
- seanmcdirmid 11y agoTrackpoints are painful for me to use though. My fingers just aren't willing to go through that trauma anymore.
- creshal 11y agoFor me it largely depends on the cap. The soft rim cap is really easy on the fingers, while the old IBM and default Lenovo caps only seem to exist to generate callus.
- creshal 11y ago> but I haven't found any non-Apple hardware that's comparable Thinkpad Ts series? Dell's XPS/Latitude 7000 lines?
- Osmium 11y ago
- Keats 11y agoIf I can put Archlinux on that (and keep Windows for tablet mode), I think I've found my next laptop
- nextos 11y agoXMonad, or any other tiling WM, would be lovely for tablet mode too, but probably requires some work.
- Veedrac 11y agoI know someone who uses a TWM on a tablet, and it works fairly albeit as clunkily as you might expect.
- owenversteeg 11y agoOh, that's exactly the person I'm looking for! (I'm considering a similar setup) Do you know what software they use/where the touchscreen works best? Thanks a ton!
- Veedrac 11y agoNot quite how I remembered it. Hopefully it's still useful information. In his words: --- I was using ArchLinux from within an Android setup using a chroot. The X server ran under Android an was called XSDL, which handles keyboard and allows me to simulate rightclick. I was using Awesome. I bound volume keys to right click and Super (my WM controlling key). The setup wasn't particularly ergonomic. Problems included the clumsiness and limitation of the X server's controls, the keyboard oriented nature of my Awesome setup, And the general lack of benefit from using a TWM. As far as I was concerned, there was limited merit in having multiple windows active at once when screen space was limited, and other WM with touch in mind would probably work better. --- It was around 10 inch, but the resolution was about 1280 or lower, and touch wasn't that accurate. (1280x800) --- Note that this was a while ago, and XSDL has undergone changes.
- pizza234 11y agoHybrids have a very different audience compared to regular laptops (ultrabooks), as they're structurally very different (that is, they are a compromise by definition), so I wouldn't compare them directly. Don't get me wrong, I have one instead of a regular laptop, but I can see how people used to the latter would feel uncomfortable with them, unless they have a strong motivation to move to the hybrid form factor.
- codeulike 11y agoI'm not sure you could call the Surface Book a hybrid form factor. It just looks like a laptop until you lop the screen off.
- Joeri 11y agoTypically the tradeoff is balance. I'm curious to see how well it balances on a lap.
- codeulike 11y agoTrue, yeah. It seems theres a lot of batteries under the keyboard so it might be ok.
- pjspycha 11y agoMakes you wonder how good the battery life of the tablet will be. There has to be some trade offs? If they pull this off thou.. I'll line up for one.
- zantana 11y agoI have a bay trail asus T200 which is a similar, albeit low-end, device. The problem for me, under Windows 8.1, has been getting the machine to enter a true low power sleep state. If the machine enters the true low power state than it can work like a tablet, and if you use it lightly (say an hour a night) you can get a week's worth of use without recharging. Unfortunately if any of the hardware components doesn't go to the low power state, the device will likely be dead or close to it if you don't use it for a day. Microsoft has a utility which tells you which component is keeping device from powering down, but doesn't tell you what software is causing this behavior. Windows 10 is supposed to improve this, but you can't turn off windows update so you lose one way to fight the battery drain. One way you can fight this, besides plugging it in every night, is powering it down when you are finished, which isn't as bad as it seems because the device boots cold in about 5 seconds.
- Osmium 11y agoAbsolutely. Lovely to see some innovation from Microsoft that's made it out of labs (the hinge alone looks fantastic). I'd be concerned about duplication of components between the screen and the keyboard though? I can't quite figure out from their website, but it looks like the keyboard part has the dedicated graphics and battery, and the rest (and more battery) is in the screen? I completely understand why Apple doesn't put touch-sensitive screens in their laptops, but it's such a shame. I'd love to be able to use a pen with a MacBook like this. The iPad Pro would be ideal except it lacks a proper Unix terminal, so that's pretty much out of the question for me (ssh doesn't count).
- codeulike 11y agoYes, would be interesting to know how much battery is in the screen and how long it lasts when its detatched. Perhaps not that long? Maybe thats why they call the screen a clipboard.
- sonnyp 11y agoProbably, also the screen doesn't have any port.
- IanDrake 11y ago>the hinge alone looks fantastic The hinge is the only thing that bothers me. Close the book and it seems like you'll have a thin area of metal on metal grinding on itself and end up with a rather thick profile for putting it in a laptop bag. Also, at one point they showed the internal structure of the hinge and it looked like the Yoga's hinge that's covered with some sort of articulating plastic (god I hope not). I'm impressed with everything else though.
- vinceyuan 11y agoI agree with you. If you open the lid, everything looks very good. But if you close the lid, it looks weird.
- josu 11y agoIf they are able to optimize the Oculus for this hardware, it could be a winning combination.
- tdicola 11y agoWhy? Are you really going to drag an Oculus out to a coffee shop etc. and flail around in a VR world to everyone else's amusement? Not to mention you'll have a heck of a time getting positional tracking setup in a public environment.
- josu 11y agoNo, I wasn't thinking about mobility. I was thinking that this may sell pretty well, the price is adequate for the specs, and it's standardized (just one product, unlike HP or Lenovo with their Z, X, P, T32... variations).
- nogridbag 11y agoI spent about 1 hour in the Microsoft Store playing with the SP3. I loved toying with it, but I knew that if I wanted to use it for serious software development I would probably dock it with a real keyboard. The Surface Book seems to be the answer. Truly amazing.
- Someone1234 11y agoI own one and that is definitely my experience. Most tablets are content consumption devices only. The SP3 allowed you to be a "little" productive on the go with a type keyboard, and a "lot" productive in the office with a dock and a real keyboard. If you want to be fully productive on the go, then I'd agree that buying a full laptop (e.g. Thinkpad, MBP) makes a lot of sense, and even then I'd still plug in a real mouse. The Surface's niche is that it can be a content consumption device, semi-productive device, and a fully productive device when you need it to be (with no cover, type cover, and full keyboard/mouse respectively). I will say the SP3's four biggest issues in my view: - Touchpad on the cover is just terrible. Totally unusable. - The Surface itself is too slippery without the cover. - Some overheating issues when the GPU is utilised. - The magnetic power cord fails too often/easily. Replaced it twice already. Look on Amazon for reviews/pictures to see what I mean.
- hcurtiss 11y agoWow. I've used a SP3 hard for about a year now. I charge nightly, throw it in my bag daily, and cart it from meeting to meeting all day long. It's been great. I find the touchpad is excellent, I've not had problems with overheating (I mostly use Chrome and Office applications), and I'm happy with the power cord. My only critique is that the keyboard is a little louder than I'd like, and for that reason I'm considering buying the SP4 keyboard.
- nogridbag 11y agoComing from a rMBP 15", I found the SP3 touchpad was too small for me to use comfortably. But it was still usable. Now that they have increased the size of the touchpad and made the keyboard better, I actually have a bit of a dilemma. You can customize the SP4 preorder with an i7 and 16GB of memory for cheaper than the Surface Book i7 with 8GB memory. I'm not sure how necessary the Nvidia card is for my purposes.
- NDizzle 11y agoI had a long discussion a few weeks ago with some friends about how in the short term, Apple messed up with iOS/OS X while Microsoft took the hard, long, correct route and made the OS work in both places. This was after the launch of the iPad Pro which is xbox-huge. I was imagining a product which was a MacBook "Base" which you could connect an iPad to as the 'screen' - except you'd have two different OSes that you'd have to cover. It's not exactly a product that fits anywhere in Apple's lineup. This Microsoft thing is exactly what I was envisioning. You have a solid base which can include a GPU and more battery life and a detachable screen that works as a tablet. Brilliant!
- drglitch 11y agoOh how quickly the past is forgotten :) In early 2000s, microsoft, through its partners, tried releasing remote displays powered by windows CE - they were essentially a precursor to the tablet. Several devices were exactly as you describe. http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q1.07/50755EA6-A759-42FD-84ED-EBB5A060AF16.html http://www.roughlydrafted.com/RD/RDM.Tech.Q1.07/50755EA6-A75... Im surprised it took over a decade to get a device that doesn't suck in that form factor, but im glad it happened. Will be preordering one tomorrow! edit: this post was written on an MBP :)
- spdustin 11y agoI still have my beta Viewsonic Mira unit, along with a non-branded one. And an unopened first-gen Zune, hah! Mira worked fairly well, and we used it to control what was at that time a Homeseer-based home automation setup, but battery life was awful (battery tech has come a LONG way since then).
- scholia 11y ago> And an unopened first-gen Zune, hah! A family heirloom! It was actually a pretty good standalone MP3 player, for its day. (Just forget about the fairly useless sharing functions, and the marketing.)
- 11y ago
- ryanSrich 11y agoExcept it's still about the OS. It has always been about the OS. I'd use a $400 HP from walmart if it ran the latest version of OS X flawlessly.
- edgyswingset 11y agoInteresting. The general consensus I get when talking to people, especially devs, is that it's about apple's quality of hardware.
- ryanSrich 11y agoI guess it depends on which devs you're talking about. I'm mostly doing web development on a day to day basis; very little VM usage, and I've never really gave my hardware a second thought. Maybe because I've always used a mac? Perhaps I'd be more picky if I had to endure poor hardware. Having said that though I'm much more concerned with the OS capabilities, user experience, aesthetics, toolchains, etc.
- ashark 11y agoFor me it's the software+hardware, and the killer feature is a unixy OS with great battery life and little to no fuss. Is it possible I could get similar results out of Linux on commodity hardware? I'd put it at long odds, but even so I bet I'd have to shut off features (losing convenience) and spend a lot of time tweaking it to make that happen. It's not even just the OS. I've switched to Safari because losing 1.5-2 hours of battery life to use Chrome or Firefox isn't worth it. I'll just open Chrome when I really need it, use it for a few minutes, and close it. There's also a "no one got fired for..." factor. OSX refuses to work with the client's projector in a meeting? Apple sucks. Arch Linux refuses to work with the client's projector? You suck.
- jhasse 11y ago> Is it possible I could get similar results out of Linux on commodity hardware? I'm using a Sony VAIO Pro 13 with Ubuntu and EVERYTHING, yes everything, works perfect. Touchpad, standby, brightness, wifi, ... Also a friend of mine is running the Dell XPS 13 with Linux and also has no problems AFAIK.
- redxdev 11y agoOnly problem for me is that price... $1499 starting price is a bit high for my tastes, though I'd love to have one otherwise.
- bluedino 11y agoCosts as much as a MacBook, and a Windows laptop that costs as much as a MacBook has never had the widespread adoption a MacBook does.
- thachmai 11y agoNever say never. I love my MBP but the Surface Note has me salivating. If it works well then I'll sell the MBP. OneNote with pen is just amazing. Coupled with the detachable high quality screen, this thing is all I can dream off at the moment.
- fudgy73 11y agoIt seems like Microsoft really did their homework. The Surface Book has a 3:2 display, which was one of the biggest reasons many (me included) were interested in the latest Chromebook Pixel. Complete specs are visible here: https://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/devices/surface-book#techspec-block https://www.microsoft.com/surface/en-us/devices/surface-book...