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iFixit App Pulled from Apple’s Store

211 points by davidbarker 11y ago

zacwest 11y ago
> The developer unit we disassembled was sent to us by Apple. Evidently, they didn’t intend for us to take it apart. They won an Apple TV in a prerelease developer lottery, rather than being sent a demo unit by Apple like they do with the press. > Unfortunately, iFixit’s app was tied to that same account, so Apple pulled the app as well. This doesn't seem like a coincidence: _because_ they are iOS developers, they were able to receive an Apple TV unit.
- bdcravens 11y ago
  Yes, I believe the Apple TV dev units had an accompanying NDA. (I registered, but didn't get lucky; I can't recall the exact terms)
  - mikeash 11y ago
    Apple made it quite clear that the whole thing was under NDA and you were not to talk about it under any circumstances. This was mentioned repeatedly throughout the process. I'm no fan of Apple's App Store policies, but this one is entirely iFixit's fault.
    - kllrnohj 11y ago
      > I'm no fan of Apple's App Store policies, but this one is entirely iFixit's fault. Not necessarily. It's not clear that Apple's rules were reasonable. If the dev unit is identical to the production ones then an NDA is unreasonable unless it was only under NDA until an embargo.
      - mikeash 11y ago
        Why would you assume iFixit didn't violate the NDA? The NDA said you couldn't talk about your Apple TV developer hardware until the final Apple TV shipped. It hasn't shipped yet, and won't for a month or so, while iFixit already posted their teardown a week ago. That's a pretty obvious violation. It's not like iFixit went to a store, bought something, tore it down, and are getting punished for publishing the pictures. They got prerelease hardware for free (technically for a dollar plus sales tax) in exchange for an agreement not to talk about that hardware for a while. Then they talked about it anyway.
      - tvmalsv 11y ago
        To me it doesn't matter if the rules were unreasonable or not. If you accept an offer under specific rules, you have voluntarily bound yourself to them (moral, regardless of legal).
      - astrodust 11y ago
        If you think the NDA is unreasonable, don't agree to it and don't take possession of the hardware. If you do accept it and violate it, be prepared for consequences.
        sitkack 11y ago
        How about take possession and then ignore? The world isn't isn't so black and white.
        mikeash 11y ago
        I see little room for shades of gray in a scenario where someone gives you $150 of hardware for free and all they ask in exchange is that you wait two months before talking about it.
        bmelton 11y ago
        Well, that's what they did. It's called lying (or in legalese, violation of contract) and the repercussions are that their relationship with Apple is damaged. This might well be the last pre-release thing they ever receive from Apple. So, sure, things aren't black and white, but they didn't exactly leave room for Apple to respond positively, especially given Apple's rather well known positions on leaked information.
        sitkack 11y ago
        I love how a bunch of nerds get super upset over iFixit doing a teardown on prerelease hardware (lying, violation of contract (shrink wrap at that)). So much easier than getting upset about things that matter. I'd say it ranks about as high as jaywalking.
      - urda 11y ago
        > Not necessarily. 100% absolutely "necessarily". Ifixit broke the rules, and got a light punishment for it. It doesn't matter how you feel on the matter, or if the end product is the same as the dev kit. They broke the rules, and saying things like "Not necessarily" is reckless and an uneducated statement, which is simply not acceptable in HN comment sections.
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- runamok 11y ago
  Thanks for the detail. It is interesting that violating an NDA about physical hardware results in getting your software pulled from a sibling app store. Clearly an android app would not be similarly affected. Though it does seems like they are getting a light punishment considering violating NDAs can have severe legal and financial consequences.
  - rblatz 11y ago
    It was an NDA about a dev kit. Break the dev rules get kicked out of the dev program.
itg 11y ago
iFixit is surprised their actions have consequences. I mean really you tore apart a developer unit so you can get page hits and now want to complain?
- cag_ii 11y ago
  This post didn't sound surprised or like a complaint to me. I think they new very well what they were getting into and handled it quite well.
  - bdcravens 11y ago
    I would agree. It didn't have the crying and crisis and conspiracy tone that usually accompanies these posts. They knew what they were doing, and the tone was "it was totally worth it". Kudos to them for putting their grown-up pants on.
    - mikeash 11y ago
      I don't know that I'd call it "putting their grown-up pants on" to receive free hardware in exchange for an agreement not to talk about that hardware, then publish a teardown of that hardware anyway. Keeping your promises counts for something too.
      - bdcravens 11y ago
        No, I'd agree that's a bit ethically questionable. I guess I'm so used to developers acting like entitled children that when someone doesn't take that approach, it's a breath of fresh air (though in a way it's kinda like an honest politician, it's a bit sad when what should be the baseline becomes extraordinary)
        mikeash 11y ago
        Maybe you're thinking of something else, but in my experience when people talk about developers "acting like entitled children" it's because those developers got screwed over by Apple for no good reason, exhausted every internal avenue for redress, and decided to take their grievance public. (Been there, done that.) At least it's a breath of fresh air to see Apple smacking somebody down for an actual, legitimate violation, instead of the usual imagined nonsense they do.
frewsxcv 11y ago
Related to App Store removals: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-removing-drone-strikes-app http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-remo...
- jobu 11y ago
  > Related to App Store removals: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-removing-drone-strikes-app http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-remo... That seems completely unrelated, but it also seems a whole lot shittier. Why would Apple remove an app for reporting casualties of US Drone strikes? It's basically a very specialized news app.
  - caskance 11y ago
    The reason is right there in the article - excessively crude or objectionable content. If a porn website released their own video player as an app, you could call it a "very specialized web browser", but it would still obviously violate the app store ToS.
    - pjc50 11y ago
      The content was not "crude". And what's objectionable about it? It's a list of locations.
      - caskance 11y ago
        Locations where people were murdered.
        pjc50 11y ago
        What's specifically objectionable about that? If the NYT app mentions the location where someone was murdered, would that be grounds for removal?
        11y ago
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- arbitrage 11y ago
  I don't think apple is power mad in the way you're making them out to be, like some sort of megalomaniacal overlord tenting his fingers as he watches the mayhem unfold. I think the just don't really care that much. Because, after all, what else are you going to do? Not develop for the iOS ecosystem? I mean, they even named their platform with another well known (amongst tech folk) platform ... I don't think they're evil, so much as they've inherited the Jobsian condescension and indifference.
- cwyers 11y ago
  > I can't believe developers put up with the constant breakage of their apps from Apple after every single iOS update. It's like that old saw about how people rob banks because that's where the money is.
- matthewmacleod 11y ago
  Please don't accuse anyone who disagrees with you of being an apologist; it's not a productive line of conversation. That said, you're right that Apple doesn't like it when people ignore terms and conditions that they agree to wrt. prereleases. In an ideal world, nobody would care what we did with devices. But it's not like they're the only company doing it, and the terms are pretty clear. I take more objection to your belief that iOS releases break apps frequently. In my experience, apps that break between releases are typically relying on undocumented behaviour or not following best practices. There are exceptions, but again - in most cases, follow the rules and nothing bad happens :)
  - caskance 11y ago
    That's not an acceptable excuse for breaking apps. Has everyone forgotten the story about Windows and Sim City?
- caskance 11y ago
  They didn't buy it. They were sent a developer unit before release. In their own words, >We weighed the risks, blithely tossed those risks over our shoulder, and tore down the Apple TV anyway.
wpeterson 11y ago
Another victory for the mobile-web over a native app that didn't need to exist.
- jws 11y ago
  It also neatly solved iFixit's problem of having an app out there that they had abandoned and was giving users a defective experience. Pulling your own app from the store will make someone angry at you. Having Apple pull it is about ideal. They could spend $100 for a new apple id, fix up the code enough to pass muster, and get it back in the store if they wanted, but like they say in the post, the mobile web is fine for what their app did and they don't want to spend any money on the app. Tangential, it would be nice if Apple left a tombstone for vanished apps. If I read somewhere to get the iFixit app, I'd go to the store now and download an app named "iFixit!" which is apparently some random collection of manuals.
  - simoncion 11y ago
    > They could spend $100 for a new apple id... That's $100/year, every year, right? Apple hasn't yet made their iDeveloper (or whatever) fees non-recurring, right?
    - chrisBob 11y ago
      Free apps remain in the store even after your developer membership has expired.
      - simoncion 11y ago
        Are you sure? JWZ reports otherwise: https://www.jwz.org/blog/2012/06/dali-clock-back-in-the-app-store/ https://www.jwz.org/blog/2012/06/dali-clock-back-in-the-app-... (check 'graph 3) Did that policy change in the intervening time? If it did, would you provide a reliable citation? :)
        chrisBob 11y ago
imaginenore 11y ago
That's why I will never develop for iOS and never own their devices, unless forced to.
- monochromatic 11y ago
  Does Google not have any sort of terms of service for prerelease hardware?
  - imaginenore 11y ago
    I can install any apk without asking Google.
    - monochromatic 11y ago
      So Google wouldn't pull your apps, they'd just sue you?
andrewguenther 11y ago
The tone I get from this post is that they knew there would be consequences to their actions and that they are apologizing that there users ended up being impacted. There is nothing in here saying "Apply totally screwed us, bring down the evil overlords." I think this was really well written and had exactly the right tone. Please read past the first paragraph if you want to criticize.
- snowwrestler 11y ago
  What I take from this post is that they were ready to move away from their own mobile app anyway (like almost every other publisher who built an app over the past 5 years), and figured this would be an interesting and fun (and attention-generating) way to do so. We can't see it in the App Store anymore, but how many downloads did the iFixit mobile app have? How many active users? What did it do that a mobile website did not? As they admit, not really anything. But they're in good company there. There are a lot of content publisher apps still limping along in the App Store, despite delivering little value to their publishers. Generally speaking, content apps lost and connecting apps won. Everyone just reads their content in their social network or aggregator now. NY Times has to inject their content into Facebook to grab mobile mindshare, even though they have had their own NY Times mobile app for years.
  - marincounty 11y ago
    If this is what happened, I wish companies would just stop being so clever, cute, or deceivers. I have gotten so jaded, I just assume I being lied to, or manipulated in some way. I have a feeling I'm overlooking honest companies, and even some people? Is telling the truth that difficult? (I just noticed HN gave me the option to down vote. I always wondered where the down vote button was located. Personally, I wish HN would take the button away from me. There are very few articles on this site that are so important, I'm going to downvote someone? It's just not they way I was brought up. I think down voting is petty. A upvote is all I needed? If anyone from HN reads this; take away my downvote button. I honestly don't need it. It's actually depressing. I don't want to be hell-banned though. (Hate that lingo. It brings me back to 7 grade, when I pissed off the cool girls, and got a daily verbal beating, and then the silent treatment. I can still feel my knees buckling, from being kicked by Sue at 7:30 a.m.--while trying to get my books out of the locker. I got to the first number, and the elevator dropped. I held back those tears. It was all over the new girl Perry, that the girls thought I should be with. I was crazy about her, but I was just too shy, and couldn't get the words out. Off topic, but no hell-banning?)
matheweis 11y ago
The hypocrisy at the end of the article is astounding: "Right now, we’re not planning on it. [rebuilding their app]. Our APIs make it easy for anyone else to build one, though. (Our old app is open source if you’d like an example to build upon. Just respect our license and don’t put ads in it.)" They blatantly violated the agreement for obtaining the pre-release hardware, and then expect people to honor their own license terms? IMHO, they are extremely lucky the worst thing that happened was their developer account getting pulled. [Edited for clarity after feedback]
- mikeash 11y ago
  Wow, that's some pretty blatant hypocrisy. I didn't notice that bit. I don't know about the downvotes. I upvoted you to try to compensate. I think people are misunderstanding what happened here, maybe thinking that Apple is punishing them for disassembling retail hardware or something.
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- draw_down 11y ago
  Good point.
- forgottenpass 11y ago
  Why the downvotes? The vindictive attitude.
- WaterSponge 11y ago
  Fortunately they can continue buying released products and help the masses have an option for repairs.
- ploxiln 11y ago
  It would be hypocrisy if they re-created a copycat apple tv and sold it or distributed it with ads. They didn't do anything like that. Also, they likely violate EULAs (the A is for agreement) for non-pre-release hardware all the time. Not that big a difference.
shanemhansen 11y ago
Wow. This is how you write an announcement delivering bad news with class. They are unapologetic for exercising their right to tinker, but feel no need to whine about Apple's response.
- uncoder0 11y ago
  I would have to disagree. They broke an NDA by tearing down and publishing the internals of a device not available for public purchase. I don't they they had a legal 'right to tinker' with the developer unit they received. It'd be a lot different if they bought an already released device from a store and did the same thing. With that being said, their response just sounds like they're trying to save face after screwing up.
  - shanemhansen 11y ago
    You convinced me. This isn't like taking apart your car.
- monochromatic 11y ago
  > right to tinker Would that be the right that they (presumably) signed away when accepting pre-release hardware?
- draw_down 11y ago
  If you forfeit your right to tinker with something then you don't have a right to tinker with it anymore, but I agree on the tone of the piece.
- eridius 11y ago
  I actually think they should be apologetic. The developer unit they were sent (for free^Wone dollar) was covered under an NDA, which expressly forbid talking about the device until it was released (which it hasn't yet). So they did not have any right to tinker here (well, they can tinker, but no right to publicly release any info). I'm glad that they're not claiming that Apple was in the wrong for banning the developer account. But I think they should be taking more of a "we screwed up and violated the NDA, which in retrospect was pretty obvious" tone than the "so that happened. live and learn" tone they did take.
sheraz 11y ago
I like how they played it off by playing up their mobile site, and then reminding us that their API is available to anyone who would make an app.
devit 11y ago
It's sad to see that some companies so brazenly abuse their customer's trust, and there are no consequences for them. Users trust Apple to protect them from malicious and perhaps from low-quality apps, and instead Apple abuses their power to try to silence those distributing information they don't like.
- mikhailt 11y ago
  Except iFixIt signed an NDA contract to not disclose these information and in exchange, they get a free developer kit after $1 fee. iFixit admitted they broke the NDA and they did so, to get clicks for their sites. iFixIt broke the trust, not Apple.
  - fineman 11y ago
    No, iFixit engaged in corporate behavior with a corporation - no trust ventured, none lost. Maybe there was harm - a lawsuit can settle that. But Apple broke the trust of their users - by deleting a perfectly valid app in retaliation for a third party doing something unrelated. Any user wanting to see how to fix something is harmed by Apple's actions. Maybe iFixit provoked them, but Apple pulled the trigger.
    - rimantas 11y ago
      There was no retaliation. iFix broke the agreement. Their account was cancelled as a consequence. It so happened that the app was on the same account.
      - fineman 11y ago
        "Consequences" seems like the very definition of retaliation. And yeah, the App being deleted was a mistake. Gotcha.
    - yoz-y 11y ago
      What would you suggest Apple should do? They can't let this blatant stomping over a perfectly reasonable NDA agreement pass. The other option they had would be to sue iFixit to oblivion which would have way bigger impact on the users.
z3t4 11y ago
If you have a mobile web-app, make sure users can use it while offline!
nathanb 11y ago
I support iFixit in their quest to get useful information about hardware to the masses. If you own a device, why shouldn't you be able to disassemble and repair it yourself? And why shouldn't we be able to know what's inside that device? But releasing a teardown of the new Apple TV (and breaking NDA while doing so) is not doing that since, critically, the device is not available for purchase yet. I feel like this move is hiding behind "technology wants to be free and open" while actually making a grab for clicks and views. You're not a martyr for the cause of freedom in this case. Nobody was attacking you. Apple was holding the sword and you fell on it. Had you just waited until the device was released, it would be a different story. iFixit are making it really hard to be on their side.
- scintill76 11y ago
  Yeah, I hope this doesn't damage whatever relationship iFixit may have with Apple, or in any other way inhibit the flow of information and resources for consumers to understand and fix their own devices.
  - madeofpalk 11y ago
    I highly doubt they've ever had a relationship with Apple. I don't think they've ever gotten a prerelease iPhone - they just send someone to Australia where they launch first and do the teardown before they go on sale 12 hours later in the US.
- jeffcox 11y ago
  > I feel like this move is hiding behind "technology wants to be free and open" while actually making a grab for clicks and views. I agree completely. The post and publicity that accompany it are definitely more of the same.
ableal 11y ago
[Off topic, curious bit in the original teardown:] "We noticed a distinct lack of cables connecting the power supply to the logic board. We're theorizing the power is either transmitted by magic, or through the heat sink screw posts."
ak217 11y ago
iFixit, I love what you do, so please don't compromise your integrity by breaking license agreements that companies try to get you into. You have the power to refuse those agreements and post them for the world to see. If you find yourself breaking them, please don't post blog posts with witty remarks and ask that people abide by your own licenses. Your mission is so important. You have gone so far in holding companies accountable for e-waste and sustainability of their products. Please don't screw it up with stupid mistakes like this.
icco 11y ago
I love this story. iFixit knowingly violates a messed up TOS, and the only outcome that happens is their app is taken down, which results in free press. Even if you call the TOS an NDA (which iFixit didn't post, which is kind of annoying), you do have to wonder, what did Apple expect to happen? iFixit has been publishing teardowns and helping people repair Apple products for close to a decade.
jakobegger 11y ago
I would say the title is misleading. Their developer account was cancelled because they violated the NDA. Apple didn't "pull the app", the app becoming unavailable is just a side effect of the dev account being cancelled. iFixit could get the app back in the store in a few days by signing up for a new dev account. But they don't want to do that because, as they say, the app is buggy and they want to focus on the mobile site anyway. So, the title is clickbait. Apple didn't censor the iFixit app. But no one would read an article titled "Apple terminates developer account after contract violation".

211 points by davidbarker 11y ago

> The developer unit we disassembled was sent to us by Apple. Evidently, they didn’t intend for us to take it apart. They won an Apple TV in a prerelease developer lottery, rather than being sent a demo unit by Apple like they do with the press. > Unfortunately, iFixit’s app was tied to that same account, so Apple pulled the app as well. This doesn't seem like a coincidence: _because_ they are iOS developers, they were able to receive an Apple TV unit.

bdcravens 11y ago
Yes, I believe the Apple TV dev units had an accompanying NDA. (I registered, but didn't get lucky; I can't recall the exact terms)
- mikeash 11y ago
  Apple made it quite clear that the whole thing was under NDA and you were not to talk about it under any circumstances. This was mentioned repeatedly throughout the process. I'm no fan of Apple's App Store policies, but this one is entirely iFixit's fault.
  - kllrnohj 11y ago
    > I'm no fan of Apple's App Store policies, but this one is entirely iFixit's fault. Not necessarily. It's not clear that Apple's rules were reasonable. If the dev unit is identical to the production ones then an NDA is unreasonable unless it was only under NDA until an embargo.
    - mikeash 11y ago
      Why would you assume iFixit didn't violate the NDA? The NDA said you couldn't talk about your Apple TV developer hardware until the final Apple TV shipped. It hasn't shipped yet, and won't for a month or so, while iFixit already posted their teardown a week ago. That's a pretty obvious violation. It's not like iFixit went to a store, bought something, tore it down, and are getting punished for publishing the pictures. They got prerelease hardware for free (technically for a dollar plus sales tax) in exchange for an agreement not to talk about that hardware for a while. Then they talked about it anyway.
    - tvmalsv 11y ago
      To me it doesn't matter if the rules were unreasonable or not. If you accept an offer under specific rules, you have voluntarily bound yourself to them (moral, regardless of legal).
    - astrodust 11y ago
      If you think the NDA is unreasonable, don't agree to it and don't take possession of the hardware. If you do accept it and violate it, be prepared for consequences.
      - sitkack 11y ago
        How about take possession and then ignore? The world isn't isn't so black and white.
        mikeash 11y ago
        I see little room for shades of gray in a scenario where someone gives you $150 of hardware for free and all they ask in exchange is that you wait two months before talking about it.
        bmelton 11y ago
        Well, that's what they did. It's called lying (or in legalese, violation of contract) and the repercussions are that their relationship with Apple is damaged. This might well be the last pre-release thing they ever receive from Apple. So, sure, things aren't black and white, but they didn't exactly leave room for Apple to respond positively, especially given Apple's rather well known positions on leaked information.
        sitkack 11y ago
        I love how a bunch of nerds get super upset over iFixit doing a teardown on prerelease hardware (lying, violation of contract (shrink wrap at that)). So much easier than getting upset about things that matter. I'd say it ranks about as high as jaywalking.
    - urda 11y ago
      > Not necessarily. 100% absolutely "necessarily". Ifixit broke the rules, and got a light punishment for it. It doesn't matter how you feel on the matter, or if the end product is the same as the dev kit. They broke the rules, and saying things like "Not necessarily" is reckless and an uneducated statement, which is simply not acceptable in HN comment sections.
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runamok 11y ago
Thanks for the detail. It is interesting that violating an NDA about physical hardware results in getting your software pulled from a sibling app store. Clearly an android app would not be similarly affected. Though it does seems like they are getting a light punishment considering violating NDAs can have severe legal and financial consequences.
- rblatz 11y ago
  It was an NDA about a dev kit. Break the dev rules get kicked out of the dev program.

itg 11y ago

iFixit is surprised their actions have consequences. I mean really you tore apart a developer unit so you can get page hits and now want to complain?

cag_ii 11y ago
This post didn't sound surprised or like a complaint to me. I think they new very well what they were getting into and handled it quite well.
- bdcravens 11y ago
  I would agree. It didn't have the crying and crisis and conspiracy tone that usually accompanies these posts. They knew what they were doing, and the tone was "it was totally worth it". Kudos to them for putting their grown-up pants on.
  - mikeash 11y ago
    I don't know that I'd call it "putting their grown-up pants on" to receive free hardware in exchange for an agreement not to talk about that hardware, then publish a teardown of that hardware anyway. Keeping your promises counts for something too.
    - bdcravens 11y ago
      No, I'd agree that's a bit ethically questionable. I guess I'm so used to developers acting like entitled children that when someone doesn't take that approach, it's a breath of fresh air (though in a way it's kinda like an honest politician, it's a bit sad when what should be the baseline becomes extraordinary)
      - mikeash 11y ago
        Maybe you're thinking of something else, but in my experience when people talk about developers "acting like entitled children" it's because those developers got screwed over by Apple for no good reason, exhausted every internal avenue for redress, and decided to take their grievance public. (Been there, done that.) At least it's a breath of fresh air to see Apple smacking somebody down for an actual, legitimate violation, instead of the usual imagined nonsense they do.

frewsxcv 11y ago

Related to App Store removals: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-removing-drone-strikes-app http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-remo...

jobu 11y ago
> Related to App Store removals: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-removing-drone-strikes-app http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/30/apple-remo... That seems completely unrelated, but it also seems a whole lot shittier. Why would Apple remove an app for reporting casualties of US Drone strikes? It's basically a very specialized news app.
- caskance 11y ago
  The reason is right there in the article - excessively crude or objectionable content. If a porn website released their own video player as an app, you could call it a "very specialized web browser", but it would still obviously violate the app store ToS.
  - pjc50 11y ago
    The content was not "crude". And what's objectionable about it? It's a list of locations.
    - caskance 11y ago
      Locations where people were murdered.
      - pjc50 11y ago
        What's specifically objectionable about that? If the NYT app mentions the location where someone was murdered, would that be grounds for removal?
        11y ago

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arbitrage 11y ago
I don't think apple is power mad in the way you're making them out to be, like some sort of megalomaniacal overlord tenting his fingers as he watches the mayhem unfold. I think the just don't really care that much. Because, after all, what else are you going to do? Not develop for the iOS ecosystem? I mean, they even named their platform with another well known (amongst tech folk) platform ... I don't think they're evil, so much as they've inherited the Jobsian condescension and indifference.
cwyers 11y ago
> I can't believe developers put up with the constant breakage of their apps from Apple after every single iOS update. It's like that old saw about how people rob banks because that's where the money is.
matthewmacleod 11y ago
Please don't accuse anyone who disagrees with you of being an apologist; it's not a productive line of conversation. That said, you're right that Apple doesn't like it when people ignore terms and conditions that they agree to wrt. prereleases. In an ideal world, nobody would care what we did with devices. But it's not like they're the only company doing it, and the terms are pretty clear. I take more objection to your belief that iOS releases break apps frequently. In my experience, apps that break between releases are typically relying on undocumented behaviour or not following best practices. There are exceptions, but again - in most cases, follow the rules and nothing bad happens :)
- caskance 11y ago
  That's not an acceptable excuse for breaking apps. Has everyone forgotten the story about Windows and Sim City?
caskance 11y ago
They didn't buy it. They were sent a developer unit before release. In their own words, >We weighed the risks, blithely tossed those risks over our shoulder, and tore down the Apple TV anyway.

wpeterson 11y ago

Another victory for the mobile-web over a native app that didn't need to exist.

jws 11y ago
It also neatly solved iFixit's problem of having an app out there that they had abandoned and was giving users a defective experience. Pulling your own app from the store will make someone angry at you. Having Apple pull it is about ideal. They could spend $100 for a new apple id, fix up the code enough to pass muster, and get it back in the store if they wanted, but like they say in the post, the mobile web is fine for what their app did and they don't want to spend any money on the app. Tangential, it would be nice if Apple left a tombstone for vanished apps. If I read somewhere to get the iFixit app, I'd go to the store now and download an app named "iFixit!" which is apparently some random collection of manuals.
- simoncion 11y ago
  > They could spend $100 for a new apple id... That's $100/year, every year, right? Apple hasn't yet made their iDeveloper (or whatever) fees non-recurring, right?
  - chrisBob 11y ago
    Free apps remain in the store even after your developer membership has expired.
    - simoncion 11y ago
      Are you sure? JWZ reports otherwise: https://www.jwz.org/blog/2012/06/dali-clock-back-in-the-app-store/ https://www.jwz.org/blog/2012/06/dali-clock-back-in-the-app-... (check 'graph 3) Did that policy change in the intervening time? If it did, would you provide a reliable citation? :)
      - chrisBob 11y ago

imaginenore 11y ago

That's why I will never develop for iOS and never own their devices, unless forced to.

monochromatic 11y ago
Does Google not have any sort of terms of service for prerelease hardware?
- imaginenore 11y ago
  I can install any apk without asking Google.
  - monochromatic 11y ago
    So Google wouldn't pull your apps, they'd just sue you?

andrewguenther 11y ago

The tone I get from this post is that they knew there would be consequences to their actions and that they are apologizing that there users ended up being impacted. There is nothing in here saying "Apply totally screwed us, bring down the evil overlords." I think this was really well written and had exactly the right tone. Please read past the first paragraph if you want to criticize.

snowwrestler 11y ago
What I take from this post is that they were ready to move away from their own mobile app anyway (like almost every other publisher who built an app over the past 5 years), and figured this would be an interesting and fun (and attention-generating) way to do so. We can't see it in the App Store anymore, but how many downloads did the iFixit mobile app have? How many active users? What did it do that a mobile website did not? As they admit, not really anything. But they're in good company there. There are a lot of content publisher apps still limping along in the App Store, despite delivering little value to their publishers. Generally speaking, content apps lost and connecting apps won. Everyone just reads their content in their social network or aggregator now. NY Times has to inject their content into Facebook to grab mobile mindshare, even though they have had their own NY Times mobile app for years.
- marincounty 11y ago
  If this is what happened, I wish companies would just stop being so clever, cute, or deceivers. I have gotten so jaded, I just assume I being lied to, or manipulated in some way. I have a feeling I'm overlooking honest companies, and even some people? Is telling the truth that difficult? (I just noticed HN gave me the option to down vote. I always wondered where the down vote button was located. Personally, I wish HN would take the button away from me. There are very few articles on this site that are so important, I'm going to downvote someone? It's just not they way I was brought up. I think down voting is petty. A upvote is all I needed? If anyone from HN reads this; take away my downvote button. I honestly don't need it. It's actually depressing. I don't want to be hell-banned though. (Hate that lingo. It brings me back to 7 grade, when I pissed off the cool girls, and got a daily verbal beating, and then the silent treatment. I can still feel my knees buckling, from being kicked by Sue at 7:30 a.m.--while trying to get my books out of the locker. I got to the first number, and the elevator dropped. I held back those tears. It was all over the new girl Perry, that the girls thought I should be with. I was crazy about her, but I was just too shy, and couldn't get the words out. Off topic, but no hell-banning?)

matheweis 11y ago

The hypocrisy at the end of the article is astounding: "Right now, we’re not planning on it. [rebuilding their app]. Our APIs make it easy for anyone else to build one, though. (Our old app is open source if you’d like an example to build upon. Just respect our license and don’t put ads in it.)" They blatantly violated the agreement for obtaining the pre-release hardware, and then expect people to honor their own license terms? IMHO, they are extremely lucky the worst thing that happened was their developer account getting pulled. [Edited for clarity after feedback]

mikeash 11y ago
Wow, that's some pretty blatant hypocrisy. I didn't notice that bit. I don't know about the downvotes. I upvoted you to try to compensate. I think people are misunderstanding what happened here, maybe thinking that Apple is punishing them for disassembling retail hardware or something.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
draw_down 11y ago
Good point.
forgottenpass 11y ago
Why the downvotes? The vindictive attitude.
WaterSponge 11y ago
Fortunately they can continue buying released products and help the masses have an option for repairs.
ploxiln 11y ago
It would be hypocrisy if they re-created a copycat apple tv and sold it or distributed it with ads. They didn't do anything like that. Also, they likely violate EULAs (the A is for agreement) for non-pre-release hardware all the time. Not that big a difference.

shanemhansen 11y ago

Wow. This is how you write an announcement delivering bad news with class. They are unapologetic for exercising their right to tinker, but feel no need to whine about Apple's response.

uncoder0 11y ago
I would have to disagree. They broke an NDA by tearing down and publishing the internals of a device not available for public purchase. I don't they they had a legal 'right to tinker' with the developer unit they received. It'd be a lot different if they bought an already released device from a store and did the same thing. With that being said, their response just sounds like they're trying to save face after screwing up.
- shanemhansen 11y ago
  You convinced me. This isn't like taking apart your car.
monochromatic 11y ago
> right to tinker Would that be the right that they (presumably) signed away when accepting pre-release hardware?
draw_down 11y ago
If you forfeit your right to tinker with something then you don't have a right to tinker with it anymore, but I agree on the tone of the piece.
eridius 11y ago
I actually think they should be apologetic. The developer unit they were sent (for free^Wone dollar) was covered under an NDA, which expressly forbid talking about the device until it was released (which it hasn't yet). So they did not have any right to tinker here (well, they can tinker, but no right to publicly release any info). I'm glad that they're not claiming that Apple was in the wrong for banning the developer account. But I think they should be taking more of a "we screwed up and violated the NDA, which in retrospect was pretty obvious" tone than the "so that happened. live and learn" tone they did take.

sheraz 11y ago

I like how they played it off by playing up their mobile site, and then reminding us that their API is available to anyone who would make an app.

devit 11y ago

It's sad to see that some companies so brazenly abuse their customer's trust, and there are no consequences for them. Users trust Apple to protect them from malicious and perhaps from low-quality apps, and instead Apple abuses their power to try to silence those distributing information they don't like.

mikhailt 11y ago
Except iFixIt signed an NDA contract to not disclose these information and in exchange, they get a free developer kit after $1 fee. iFixit admitted they broke the NDA and they did so, to get clicks for their sites. iFixIt broke the trust, not Apple.
- fineman 11y ago
  No, iFixit engaged in corporate behavior with a corporation - no trust ventured, none lost. Maybe there was harm - a lawsuit can settle that. But Apple broke the trust of their users - by deleting a perfectly valid app in retaliation for a third party doing something unrelated. Any user wanting to see how to fix something is harmed by Apple's actions. Maybe iFixit provoked them, but Apple pulled the trigger.
  - rimantas 11y ago
    There was no retaliation. iFix broke the agreement. Their account was cancelled as a consequence. It so happened that the app was on the same account.
    - fineman 11y ago
      "Consequences" seems like the very definition of retaliation. And yeah, the App being deleted was a mistake. Gotcha.
  - yoz-y 11y ago
    What would you suggest Apple should do? They can't let this blatant stomping over a perfectly reasonable NDA agreement pass. The other option they had would be to sue iFixit to oblivion which would have way bigger impact on the users.

z3t4 11y ago

If you have a mobile web-app, make sure users can use it while offline!

nathanb 11y ago

I support iFixit in their quest to get useful information about hardware to the masses. If you own a device, why shouldn't you be able to disassemble and repair it yourself? And why shouldn't we be able to know what's inside that device? But releasing a teardown of the new Apple TV (and breaking NDA while doing so) is not doing that since, critically, the device is not available for purchase yet. I feel like this move is hiding behind "technology wants to be free and open" while actually making a grab for clicks and views. You're not a martyr for the cause of freedom in this case. Nobody was attacking you. Apple was holding the sword and you fell on it. Had you just waited until the device was released, it would be a different story. iFixit are making it really hard to be on their side.

scintill76 11y ago
Yeah, I hope this doesn't damage whatever relationship iFixit may have with Apple, or in any other way inhibit the flow of information and resources for consumers to understand and fix their own devices.
- madeofpalk 11y ago
  I highly doubt they've ever had a relationship with Apple. I don't think they've ever gotten a prerelease iPhone - they just send someone to Australia where they launch first and do the teardown before they go on sale 12 hours later in the US.
jeffcox 11y ago
> I feel like this move is hiding behind "technology wants to be free and open" while actually making a grab for clicks and views. I agree completely. The post and publicity that accompany it are definitely more of the same.

ableal 11y ago

[Off topic, curious bit in the original teardown:] "We noticed a distinct lack of cables connecting the power supply to the logic board. We're theorizing the power is either transmitted by magic, or through the heat sink screw posts."

ak217 11y ago

iFixit, I love what you do, so please don't compromise your integrity by breaking license agreements that companies try to get you into. You have the power to refuse those agreements and post them for the world to see. If you find yourself breaking them, please don't post blog posts with witty remarks and ask that people abide by your own licenses. Your mission is so important. You have gone so far in holding companies accountable for e-waste and sustainability of their products. Please don't screw it up with stupid mistakes like this.

icco 11y ago

I love this story. iFixit knowingly violates a messed up TOS, and the only outcome that happens is their app is taken down, which results in free press. Even if you call the TOS an NDA (which iFixit didn't post, which is kind of annoying), you do have to wonder, what did Apple expect to happen? iFixit has been publishing teardowns and helping people repair Apple products for close to a decade.

jakobegger 11y ago

I would say the title is misleading. Their developer account was cancelled because they violated the NDA. Apple didn't "pull the app", the app becoming unavailable is just a side effect of the dev account being cancelled. iFixit could get the app back in the store in a few days by signing up for a new dev account. But they don't want to do that because, as they say, the app is buggy and they want to focus on the mobile site anyway. So, the title is clickbait. Apple didn't censor the iFixit app. But no one would read an article titled "Apple terminates developer account after contract violation".