5 ms·

The only question is -- can they also create a user experience to match Apple's. That would basically mean software which should be extremely intuitive, simple,

The only question is -- can they also create a user experience to match Apple's. That would basically mean software which should be extremely intuitive, simple, and to the point, where touch features don't feel as an afterthought on a solid OS. We will have to see whether Windows derivative tablet OS is capable of supporting tablet form better than it does for mobiles/smartphones, to try and match Mac OS's versatility. If it does not, then no matter how good the hardware is, it will still be a number 2.

nazgulnarsil 17y ago
why don't any of the tech journalists gushing over designs seem to grasp this? we already have tablet interfaces that haven't taken off because they suck. they're unintuitive buggy messes. whomever solves this first wins, regardless of the hardware.
- rbanffy 17y ago
  You do remember the Newton, right? Or the Momenta?
  - jimbokun 17y ago
    Mentioning the Newton makes me think of how Microsoft still seems obsessed with handwriting/pen interfaces. This may be a generational thing. There seems to be an assumption that the average person finds writing with a pen the most natural way to record information. But I bet there are a lot of us now who spend more time typing on a keyboard than writing with a pen. I found myself surprised, for example, when the user hand-wrote a URL in the browser app to go to a page. Hand-writing a URL is a pretty foreign experience, except in those rare cases when I need to remember a URL and I'm away from a computer (and I can't remember the last time I actually did that). Your comment also got me Googling for the Simpson's clip that was pretty much the Newton's tombstone. But I found the video introducing the Newton at the bottom of this page more interesting: http://technabob.com/blog/2007/07/20/classic-apple-moment-newton-handwriting-recognition/ http://technabob.com/blog/2007/07/20/classic-apple-moment-ne... One interesting thing is that it is clear that the Newton was struggling to find a way to move data around before the dawn of the world wide web. You can print! Or fax! At least, you can the next time you are physically next to a device. Or you can "beam" something who happens to be in close proximity. Er, if they also have a Newton. The fact that literally half of the intro video is devoted to getting the handwriting recognition to work correctly, though, is certainly ominous. It indicates that the hand-writing interface was not as intuitive as they had hoped. Which brings us back to Microsoft and pens. I wonder if the vision for tablet computing was born out of Gates and his generation's familiarity with hand writing and inherently assuming that the average person is more comfortable with it than keyboards, and not updating those assumptions for the current generation who spend far more time updating their Facebook status on a keyboard than taking notes in class (assuming they don't use a laptop for that, too).
    - xcombinator 17y ago
      "There seems to be an assumption that the average person finds writing with a pen the most natural way to record information." This is a valid assumption, writing with a pen IS the most natural way for humans to record information, this includes drawing figures(how do you draw sketchs with a keyboard?). The problem is that machines don't have a brain and find very difficult to decode pen writing, the first that solve this problem will win a lot of fans. PS: I type very fast, but I don't like the keyboard as much as pen.
      - jsz0 17y ago
        I am almost completely unable to write anymore. I've been typing for 2/3rds of my life and haven't done any serious pen writing for the last 15 years. I'm sure with some practice I could get used to it but I don't see a need. Keyboards are just more natural to me. I learned to write English and spell via QWERTY. In fact I don't really know how many words I type are spelled. I just know what sequence of key-presses are required to make them. My understanding of grammar is tied to the ability to quickly edit. It's trial & error grammar. Sometimes I have to type something out a few times to determine what is proper grammar or at least passable as a coherent sentence. I've noticed when I do write with a pen my spelling & grammar skills revert to the level they were at when I stopped writing 15 years ago. (significantly worse)
        xcombinator 17y ago
        OK, that's right. But think for a moment the quantity and quality of the restrictions that needing a keyboard imposes: -It is a big thing that requires a lot of space. -It is slow to learn. -It makes sound. -Gets dirty. -You can't write with emotions, or tone, nuances are lost. On a laptop, makes it really difficult to rotate the screen(I'm writing on a rotated laptop right now, if you try it you will be slow at first, but I'm faster this way). I'm experimenting with my own sound recognition programs and note taking, I thing that is the future. IMHO we will talk with computers, and the children of your children will see keyboards as awkward as they are.
    - jcnnghm 17y ago

nazgulnarsil 17y ago

why don't any of the tech journalists gushing over designs seem to grasp this? we already have tablet interfaces that haven't taken off because they suck. they're unintuitive buggy messes. whomever solves this first wins, regardless of the hardware.

rbanffy 17y ago
You do remember the Newton, right? Or the Momenta?
- jimbokun 17y ago
  Mentioning the Newton makes me think of how Microsoft still seems obsessed with handwriting/pen interfaces. This may be a generational thing. There seems to be an assumption that the average person finds writing with a pen the most natural way to record information. But I bet there are a lot of us now who spend more time typing on a keyboard than writing with a pen. I found myself surprised, for example, when the user hand-wrote a URL in the browser app to go to a page. Hand-writing a URL is a pretty foreign experience, except in those rare cases when I need to remember a URL and I'm away from a computer (and I can't remember the last time I actually did that). Your comment also got me Googling for the Simpson's clip that was pretty much the Newton's tombstone. But I found the video introducing the Newton at the bottom of this page more interesting: http://technabob.com/blog/2007/07/20/classic-apple-moment-newton-handwriting-recognition/ http://technabob.com/blog/2007/07/20/classic-apple-moment-ne... One interesting thing is that it is clear that the Newton was struggling to find a way to move data around before the dawn of the world wide web. You can print! Or fax! At least, you can the next time you are physically next to a device. Or you can "beam" something who happens to be in close proximity. Er, if they also have a Newton. The fact that literally half of the intro video is devoted to getting the handwriting recognition to work correctly, though, is certainly ominous. It indicates that the hand-writing interface was not as intuitive as they had hoped. Which brings us back to Microsoft and pens. I wonder if the vision for tablet computing was born out of Gates and his generation's familiarity with hand writing and inherently assuming that the average person is more comfortable with it than keyboards, and not updating those assumptions for the current generation who spend far more time updating their Facebook status on a keyboard than taking notes in class (assuming they don't use a laptop for that, too).
  - xcombinator 17y ago
    "There seems to be an assumption that the average person finds writing with a pen the most natural way to record information." This is a valid assumption, writing with a pen IS the most natural way for humans to record information, this includes drawing figures(how do you draw sketchs with a keyboard?). The problem is that machines don't have a brain and find very difficult to decode pen writing, the first that solve this problem will win a lot of fans. PS: I type very fast, but I don't like the keyboard as much as pen.
    - jsz0 17y ago
      I am almost completely unable to write anymore. I've been typing for 2/3rds of my life and haven't done any serious pen writing for the last 15 years. I'm sure with some practice I could get used to it but I don't see a need. Keyboards are just more natural to me. I learned to write English and spell via QWERTY. In fact I don't really know how many words I type are spelled. I just know what sequence of key-presses are required to make them. My understanding of grammar is tied to the ability to quickly edit. It's trial & error grammar. Sometimes I have to type something out a few times to determine what is proper grammar or at least passable as a coherent sentence. I've noticed when I do write with a pen my spelling & grammar skills revert to the level they were at when I stopped writing 15 years ago. (significantly worse)
      - xcombinator 17y ago
        OK, that's right. But think for a moment the quantity and quality of the restrictions that needing a keyboard imposes: -It is a big thing that requires a lot of space. -It is slow to learn. -It makes sound. -Gets dirty. -You can't write with emotions, or tone, nuances are lost. On a laptop, makes it really difficult to rotate the screen(I'm writing on a rotated laptop right now, if you try it you will be slow at first, but I'm faster this way). I'm experimenting with my own sound recognition programs and note taking, I thing that is the future. IMHO we will talk with computers, and the children of your children will see keyboards as awkward as they are.
  - jcnnghm 17y ago