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Why did Google bother with all of that work to fix SD storage in Android M[0] if they're still not going to put an SD card in their Nexus phones!?! I was holdi

• jjcm 11y ago
  Serious question - do you really use more than 128GB on your phone? If so, at what point would internal storage be good enough for you to not require extendable storage?
  • AdmiralAsshat 11y ago
    128 GB would be enough, but I resent having to pay an extra $150 for it as internal storage when I can find a 128gb memory card for about $60 on Amazon.
    • cpncrunch 11y ago
      The internal memory is much faster than SD cards, and potentially more reliable. I think Google and Samsung have decided to ditch sd cards to prevent the user having a shitty experience. Also, Google is offering 128GB, which is pretty decent. And their pricing is much less than Samsung's for 64gb vs 32gb.
      • mtgx 11y ago
        It may be, but you only have to buy one high-speed (U3?) microSD card once (every 4-6 years), while if you need 128GB storage in your phone but it only comes as internal, then with every phone you buy you'll have to pay that extra premium.
        • DannyBee 11y ago
          If you have a microsd card that is not failing after 6 years, i'd be super-duper impressed :) I have never gotten one past 3 with normal usage.
      • gohrt 11y ago
        How fast is internal storage? When has an SD card failed before every other part of the phone, including USB port and screen?
        • chadzawistowski 11y ago
          It depends on the device, but I'm working with the Qualcomm DragonBoard 410c (similar to a phone in some respects), and eMMC memory is WAY faster than SD cards.
        • ac29 11y ago
          It can be pretty fast. Apple's new iPhone gets storage speeds in line with a low end SSD [1]. [1] http://anandtech.com/show/9662/iphone-6s-and-iphone-6s-plus-preliminary-results http://anandtech.com/show/9662/iphone-6s-and-iphone-6s-plus-...
        • mjcohen 11y ago
          I have tried two different 128GB cards on my Note 3. The first one died after a few months, the second one is currently having problems. My next phone will have at least 128GB internal storage (iPhone or 6P).
      • nine_k 11y ago
        Speed does not matter too much for music / video / photos storage.
      • ForHackernews 11y ago
        > I think Google and Samsung have decided to ditch sd cards to prevent the user having a shitty experience. I think Google has decided to ditch SD cards to encourage users to keep more of their data on Google's servers.
        • DannyBee 11y ago
          Right, because they makes more sense than ditching them because they are an unreliable mess that cause more problems than they solve, and are not necessary for the vast majority of users. Do you think apple never supported SD cards because they wanted more people to put stuff in icloud?
          • ForHackernews 11y ago
            What makes them an "unreliable mess that cause more problems than they solve"? I've never had a single problem with an SD card. I put files on it, sometimes I read those files.
          • devrelm 11y ago
            > Do you think apple never supported SD cards because they wanted more people to put stuff in icloud? Uhh... of course? Both companies charge extra for more space — Apple past 5GB and Google past 15GB. They make money by forcing you to upgrade your online storage.
          • sangnoir 11y ago
            Not iCloud: Apple would prefer you buy all your storage (NAND) from Apple rather than Kingston, Samsung or SanDisk. Soldered, with an Apple-sized margin.
        • rasz_pl 11y ago
          this and M$ NTFS/xFAT patent extortion
      • zanny 11y ago
        Then amend the parent and instead say "I feel ripped off paying $150 premium for a 128GB model when I could buy a desktop 512GB 850 Evo for that much". And I guarantee you Samsungs SSD options are faster than their phone flash, because they go for performance way more on desktop parts.
        • Navarr 11y ago
          Aren't you paying for the size the storage has been compressed down to at these prices? Itty bitty little tiny chips? Your desktop 512GB 850 EVO isn't going to fit into the space a smartphone has for storage.
          • pkaye 11y ago
            The SD cards are a better price comparison because they will use a similar stacking technology to get the small form factor. The main difference is SD cards need a controller which adds cost.
      • vectorpush 11y ago
        > I think Google and Samsung have decided to ditch sd cards to prevent the user having a shitty experience. This line of reasoning makes absolutely no sense. How could having the option to use an SD card with your device make for a shittier UX. The use of an SD expansion slot is completely optional, if you don't have the desire to use an SD card it has absolutely no bearing on the UX, and if you do, no matter how shitty the UX, it will always be preferable to the absence of removable media capabilities altogether.
        • froo 11y ago
          Because there is an opportunity cost to having an SD slot. Remember it takes up physical space inside the device, which could be used for more internal memory, battery space etc. they would have opted for something everyone wants over a smaller subset of users
          • scintill76 11y ago
            That sounds more like an engineering challenge than a UX compromise. Also, as these heated threads show, what "everyone wants" is a bit elusive. I think they could overcome these "costs" if they wanted, but they don't -- the actual UX "cost" of complicating how the user interacts with storage is probably one reason why.
          • vectorpush 11y ago
            > Because there is an opportunity cost to having an SD slot. Remember it takes up physical space inside the device, which could be used for more internal memory, battery space et There are opportunity costs for everything, but microsd readers are a cheap, mature, commodity technology that's been in top-end phones for ages, its impact on the phone's available real-estate for battery and memory is nearly negligible.
  • asavadatti 11y ago
    Yeah but this one comes with 32gb max.
  • windsurfer 11y ago
    The more storage someone has available, the more they might use. I could see carrying around a phone with 4 TB of storage, holding all my operating systems, data, HD movies and video games, for instance, and simply plugging it into terminals and booting on more powerful hardware.
  • neves 11y ago
    music photos videos
• BinaryIdiot 11y ago
  They did the work for third parties to keep it an an option for the lower end market. The higher end market has shown it doesn't care about SD cards and, honestly, I think for good reason: their user experience has always been terrible. Internal storage is faster and more reliable so I think you're always going to see more and more phones, especially flagships, not offer expandable options.
  • zanny 11y ago
    SD card user experience is terrible, so we will fix the user experience (and just make them a joint overlay FS) but not include one, while still shipping phones with 16-64GB capacities like we did five years ago. If they want me to ever buy an SD card-less phone, they better start shipping 256GB options at the real cost of the flash memory involved (ie, $40 more expensive over a 64GB option, not $100 or more). When you are shipping phones with cameras nearing 20+ MP where you would fill up the paltry internal storage (what, like 10GB after OS on the 16GB models?) in a thousand photos at PNG compression (ie, about 10MB a shot) you are doing it wrong, especially when SSD manufacturers are about to start shipping 4TB options in m.2 form factors (ie, the size of a small candy bar).
  • danieldk 11y ago
    Internal storage is faster and more reliable Still, SD cards are still fine for storing large amounts of photos, videos, and music. And as a proud father of a 1.5 year old, I like to stash a lot of photos/videos on my phone. their user experience has always been terrible. The other obvious reason is that phone manufacturers like to overcharge on extra storage. I think you're always going to see more and more phones, especially flagships, not offer expandable options. Not everyone is moving in that direction. E.g. the new Moto Xs support SD cards, while the previous generations didn't.
  • rsync 11y ago
    "The higher end market has shown it doesn't care about SD cards and, honestly, I think for good reason: their user experience has always been terrible." But that's just an easy software fix away. There is nothing inherent to SD cards (or removable storage in general) that makes it a tough UI case. It's pretty simple, actually,
• JustSomeNobody 11y ago
  Price? They would have to pay licensing fees for the technology.
• jewbacca 11y ago
  1. The Nexus line is supposed to be something like Google's Android reference device, and implements the minimum common set of features -- up-to-date computing hardware and screen, reasonable-resolution cameras, standard set of sensors (GPS, acceleration, etc.). An SD card slot doesn't really add any technical possibilities. 2. Google probably wants to push the idea that any storage beyond local apps should be to the cloud. (which is comically unviable in Canada, where you're paying $25-50 per 1 GB of mobile data) --- A year ago, I got a Nexus 5 after a long search for a replacement for my stalwart iPhone 3GS. The lack of SD card was the primary sticking point, and caused me days of choice-agony. In the end, price and "cleanliness" (stock android, lack of shitware, doesn't fight software customization very hard) won out.
  • inversionOf 11y ago
    I pay $30 for 6GB of LTE data per month (Rogers, via a promotional plan that they've offered countless times). And I generally use about 200MB in an average month as I'm virtually always around WiFi of some sort. Which is exactly what Google envisions, with most of their cloud solutions defaulting to only operating over WiFi. SD storage has always been a mess on Android because it was originally added just as an easy way to port music and movies over. It was essentially supposed to be read-only memory. Then of course apps and users started using it and the ugly, messy history is notorious.
    • will_hughes 11y ago
      I'm not in Canada, but I do use Google Play Music on my commute (2-3hrs per day) with it's streaming curated playlists. That eats through a ton of bandwidth. That chewed through about 3GB last month before I had to stop listening while out and about.
  • xelipe 11y ago
    Google's advert claims "The ultimate Android experience", not the "The minimum common set of features Android experience".
    • 11y ago
• jsz0 11y ago
  > Why did Google bother with all of that work to fix SD storage The changes they made could be useful for more than just SD cards.
• hackuser 11y ago
  It simplifies managing storage for users. Per Matias Duarte, who I think was Director of Android User Experience at the time: [1] Everybody likes the idea of having an SD card, but in reality it's just confusing for users. If you’re saving photos, videos or music, where does it go? Is it on your phone? Or on your card? ... We take a different approach. Your Nexus has a fixed amount of space and your apps just seamlessly use it for you without you ever having to worry about files or volumes or any of that techy nonsense left over from the paleolithic era of computing. Remember the vast majority of users have vastly less technical understanding than HN readers. [1] http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/10/30/matias-duarte-answers-questions-about-jelly-bean-ui-and-the-lack-of-micro-sd-cards/ http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/10/30/matias-duarte-answer...
  • Brakenshire 11y ago
    You could say the same thing about cloud storage, couldn't you? As with extra local storage, that has additional UI baggage, which comes along with extra utility for the user. To be able to bring with you all of your music or photos, without requiring a connection, is a massive benefit. That also doesn't explain sticking with the same storage options from two years ago, even though prices have plummeted in the meantime. It's clearly about what benefits Google.
    • shostack 11y ago
      Yeah, for me it is hard to take this at face value when Google has a vested interest in cloud storage from the standpoint of data analysis, platform lock-in, and subscription revenue.
  • acjohnson55 11y ago
    Since every Android phone I've ever had takes SD, the process of transferring all my data over is basically just pulling the card out of the old phone and putting it into the new phone. This unfortunately doesn't handle reinstallation of my apps and migration of data like texts and calls. Google's done all this work, and there still isn't a simple migration path. Give me a simple way to boot up the 6P and have all my data migrated over, and I'll kiss my SD card goodbye. In the meantime, the user experience is still broken.
• SZJX 11y ago
  Why do you need expandable storage if you get 64/128GB. I've never even managed storage on my 64GB Nexus 6 since I got it in February.