3 ms·

This depends on one's jurisdiction, in the U.S. at least. For example, in Illinois, non-competes are generally enforceable.[0] In California, they are generally

This depends on one's jurisdiction, in the U.S. at least. For example, in Illinois, non-competes are generally enforceable.[0] In California, they are generally not.[1] [0] http://www.isba.org/ibj/2012/01/lawpulse/employmentcovenantsnottocompetetheh http://www.isba.org/ibj/2012/01/lawpulse/employmentcovenants... [1] http://www.cnet.com/news/calif-supreme-court-finds-noncompete-clauses-invalid/ http://www.cnet.com/news/calif-supreme-court-finds-noncompet...

spacecowboy_lon 11y ago
Even when you have been made redundant?
- BorgHunter 11y ago
  It seems to depend on the totality of the circumstances, in Illinois, so I'd imagine the nonvoluntary nature of the termination would be taken into account. But there doesn't seem to be a clear answer. If it ended up in litigation it could get messy; there isn't a terribly large amount of guidance from the courts.
  - mring33621 11y ago
    Regardless of the possibility of litigation, the logic is very simple: 1) a non-compete indicates that the employee has some skillset or knowledge that the business does not want to lose to a competitor; 2) the involuntary release of that same employee indicates that (1) is no longer true, unless the released employee is fairly compensated for the non-compete period. I would feel pretty comfortable presenting this argument to a judge, even without a lawyer present.
    - benaiah 11y ago
      > I would feel pretty comfortable presenting this argument to a judge, even without a lawyer present. I'm gonna go ahead and ignore any legal advice you give, then. That's completely bonkers.
      - georgemcbay 11y ago
        Personally I'd still talk to a lawyer (easy for me to say as I have a friend who is a business lawyer), but I wouldn't go so far as to say not having a lawyer here would be "bonkers" The argument is pretty clear and rational; unless the judge was in the pocket of the company on the other end of the suit (in which case you're fucked anyway), I think representing one's self would be pretty straightforward in this case.
        benaiah 11y ago
        Representing yourself is never, ever, ever a good idea. Not even if you are a lawyer (and if you were, you'd know this). "The man who represents himself has a fool for a client" is one of the few legal truisms that is actually true. That aside, your argument may be "pretty clear and rational," but that does not mean it follows the law (which is rarely either of those things). Without a lawyer you have no way of knowing (self-studying law is a great way to royally fuck yourself if you ever try to apply it in a real scenario).
    - ebiester 11y ago
      http://www.wbjournal.com/article/20120903/PRINTEDITION/308309983/non-compete-agreements-may-restrict-employees-mobility-but-experts-say-they-have-benefits http://www.wbjournal.com/article/20120903/PRINTEDITION/30830... says otherwise, as do other resources I've checked. Now, you usually have to be a bigger fish to get a non-compete enforced, or you have to threaten business. Most places that have a contract with HP will still have a contract even after hiring an expert. Fortune 1000 companies have better lawyers that know how to craft jobs to avoid exactly these scenarios.
- monksy 11y ago
  Yep. Even then. I've had a company that put one on my employment, do a mass layoff and even put a reminder that I signed the document in the termination letter.

spacecowboy_lon 11y ago

Even when you have been made redundant?

BorgHunter 11y ago
It seems to depend on the totality of the circumstances, in Illinois, so I'd imagine the nonvoluntary nature of the termination would be taken into account. But there doesn't seem to be a clear answer. If it ended up in litigation it could get messy; there isn't a terribly large amount of guidance from the courts.
- mring33621 11y ago
  Regardless of the possibility of litigation, the logic is very simple: 1) a non-compete indicates that the employee has some skillset or knowledge that the business does not want to lose to a competitor; 2) the involuntary release of that same employee indicates that (1) is no longer true, unless the released employee is fairly compensated for the non-compete period. I would feel pretty comfortable presenting this argument to a judge, even without a lawyer present.
  - benaiah 11y ago
    > I would feel pretty comfortable presenting this argument to a judge, even without a lawyer present. I'm gonna go ahead and ignore any legal advice you give, then. That's completely bonkers.
    - georgemcbay 11y ago
      Personally I'd still talk to a lawyer (easy for me to say as I have a friend who is a business lawyer), but I wouldn't go so far as to say not having a lawyer here would be "bonkers" The argument is pretty clear and rational; unless the judge was in the pocket of the company on the other end of the suit (in which case you're fucked anyway), I think representing one's self would be pretty straightforward in this case.
      - benaiah 11y ago
        Representing yourself is never, ever, ever a good idea. Not even if you are a lawyer (and if you were, you'd know this). "The man who represents himself has a fool for a client" is one of the few legal truisms that is actually true. That aside, your argument may be "pretty clear and rational," but that does not mean it follows the law (which is rarely either of those things). Without a lawyer you have no way of knowing (self-studying law is a great way to royally fuck yourself if you ever try to apply it in a real scenario).
  - ebiester 11y ago
    http://www.wbjournal.com/article/20120903/PRINTEDITION/308309983/non-compete-agreements-may-restrict-employees-mobility-but-experts-say-they-have-benefits http://www.wbjournal.com/article/20120903/PRINTEDITION/30830... says otherwise, as do other resources I've checked. Now, you usually have to be a bigger fish to get a non-compete enforced, or you have to threaten business. Most places that have a contract with HP will still have a contract even after hiring an expert. Fortune 1000 companies have better lawyers that know how to craft jobs to avoid exactly these scenarios.
monksy 11y ago
Yep. Even then. I've had a company that put one on my employment, do a mass layoff and even put a reminder that I signed the document in the termination letter.