8 ms·

This, I feel, is the exact story of my childhood...I figured out at somewhere around 6th grade or so that I could get all the same grades w/o doing any of the h

• _rs 11y ago
  Are there any resources you might recommend to others who have fallen down that same kind of path?
  • steverb 11y ago
    I had the same issue. TOtally quit doing homework in the 5th grade, coasted through highschool (mostly) with a 3.5. Fortunately (for me) I had a not so good HS Counselor who I never met and who never explained to me that it was possible to go to college without having rich parents. So I joined the Army straight out of high school, and that's where I learned how to work my ass off. Not mentally so much, but in general how to have an expectation of myself that I should always keep pushing myself to do better. That was 25 years ago mind you. Your mileage will definitely vary.
    • jackmaney 11y ago
      When I was in academia, some of the students I rooted for the most were non-traditional students, especially those who were former/current military. None of that "b...but, when will I ever use this in REAL LIFE! Waaahhh!" or "will this be on the test?". Just a willingness to work their ass off.
      • 6stringmerc 11y ago
        When I was in academia, some of the most intolerable time wasting, tangential and selfish people were non-traditional students taking courses because they had the means and time to do so...just sayin'
        • jackmaney 11y ago
          I guess that could be a function of one's discipline. I was a mathematician, so there were very few attempts at time-wasting and being tangential (and when there were, a quick "That's a great question, but it's a bit far afield from what we need to cover right now. I'd love to discuss it during office hours, though" would defuse the situation).
      • bigtunacan 11y ago
        Personally I find the, "Will this be used in real life?" question a very important one that sadly isn't answered frequently enough. There is a disconnect between educators and students who are there to prepare to enter the workforce.
        • jackmaney 11y ago
          That's the problem: college does not--nor should it--solely exist for preparation to enter the workforce. That's why we need a resurgence of trade programs.
          • marcosdumay 11y ago
            Anyway, for every course that is not Math, everything you learn was created for a reason (make that a "most things you learn" for Math). Yet, before one enters an university, teachers almost universally refuse to answer this question.
        • nitrogen 11y ago
          Everything will be used in real life somewhere. Also, education is about more than just the immediate facts being presented. Its primary purpose is (or should be) developing the ability to recognize connections between subjects, events, and ideas, and use those connections as the common language of society for communicating and understanding. The lack of this intended benefit of education is what allows talking heads to polarize society by shouting past each other.
  • tcfunk 11y ago
    I can't say that I know of much off-hand...for me the turning point was actually failing a few classes. That seemed to finally give me the wakeup call I needed to light a fire under me, so to speak. Not that I recommend failing, per se, that's just the way things ended up for me. One thing that certainly helped me was to take a slight detour from my graduation path for a semester to take classes that genuinely interested me. I found that taking a few courses where I was more willing to put time in out of sheer interest helped hone those same habits for classes which maybe were less interesting / more tedious. Hope this helps, and best of luck!
  • v_ee 11y ago
    For me this behaviour worked all the way until my bachelor's thesis. That was the first time I faced difficulty, and I didn't know how to deal with that. I'm still recovering from the problem but I've been able to identify some solutions. 1. Choose your peer group carefully. Your values will shift to those of your peers. In high school my friends were the smart kids. At first we were highly motivated and competitive and earned high marks, but that didn't sit well with the rest of the class. We got excluded for being try-hards. Therefore the new game was to pass the class with the least amount of effort. When I went to college I associated with similar people. It was cool to pass with the least amount of effort. Make friends who have values that you want to have: people who value effort, not talent. 2. Don't fall for the incentives trap. Your success gets measured by passing classes and getting good grades. It's natural for humans to game the incentives. Your motivation shifts to doing well on the incentives. Instead view passing the class as a bare minimum. The goal is learning, the test should be an easy byproduct. 3. Learn how to handle failure in a healthy way, otherwise you'll find yourself avoiding things that may lead to failure. When failure does come, try to stay positive. Don't try to keep up appearance of success. Be open about your failures. Find somebody you can talk to 100% openly; a friend, your parents, your gf/bf, a sibling. Make sure that your self worth isn't reliant on your success. 4. Don't rely on willpower. Using willpower is a losing battle. Design your life so that you don't need to rely on it. Set up meetings to do your homework with friends. Build good habits. Beware of slippery slopes. Now you're skipping class once, in a year you're skipping class entirely.
• stuxnet79 11y ago
  What was more difficult for me in college was getting used to having lower marks than I was accustomed to. My high school life wasn't so great whereas my grades were decent, so my identity became entirely wrapped around my grades and academic success. Anytime I faltered academically it precipitated an identity crisis - I started shying away from challenging courses. I think even just the idea that you might not be as bright as you think you are would be a nice kick in the pants for otherwise bright students to really accomplish a lot in life.
  • bane 11y ago
    There's a growing body of work that seems to show that students in high-achieving countries from Asia (Japan, Korea, Singapore, etc.) have a very low opinion of their abilities -- and there's some thought that this attitude seems to be helpful in encouraging study.
    • peterfirefly 11y ago
      Knuth wrote something along the same lines about himself: he didn't think he was all that good so he worked his ass off (and got a bleeding ulcer back in the 60's). Of course, he was all that good and the hard work certainly didn't make him less good.
  • peterfirefly 11y ago
    I've heard about that being a thing in the US (I don't know where you are from). I've never met anybody who actually fell into that trap, so there might be interesting cultural issues at play. Personally, I got humbled early on when I realized that I wouldn't be able to read all the interesting books in the world. I wouldn't even be able to keep up with just the new interesting books being published. A very sad day, that was. It was a simple matter of reading (and not quite understanding) a few real books aimed at researchers to see that some people were far brighter than me. Just like some were far better at drawing or playing football or high jumping. I count on someone (or many someones) being better than me at absolutely every single thing that I might be good at. Hopefully, the talent profile I have will be good enough anyway, especially if I work hard and avoid winner-takes-all areas. (It did take a long time to learn how to apply myself, though, after so many years of enforced boredom.)
• seivan 11y ago
  Same here!
• mordocai 11y ago
  I got a bad view of school in general via my similar childhood experiences. I went to community college because my parents pushed me to get a degree, but I had a kid before I was done with college and went into the workforce and now have no motivation to go back to school. I coasted through community college as well (including classes considered difficult) still bored and getting As and Bs. I probably needed to have cared more in high school and gone to a harder college for me to get the wake up call to learn to study. As it is, I learn on my own time and program. It's not the worst, but I always wonder what I'd been capable of with more motivation.
• AnimalMuppet 11y ago
  My 6th-grade teacher saved me from exactly that. She pushed me and taught me to work and study. (So did a teacher in junior high - but her I resented, maybe because, you know, junior high.) When I hit college, it was (mostly) still there.
• someone7x 11y ago
  This, I too feel, is the exact story of my childhood. Cut class and ace the tests. It worked perfectly until it suddenly stopped working at all; when real life began.
• bane 11y ago
  I had the same problem. When I finally went to college (after a few years post high-school being very disenfranchised with education), I decided that I needed to learn these skills and spent a few years in community college taking remedial courses containing material I mostly already knew -- starting with one class a semester. I challenged myself with the simple notion, "If I'm so smart, I should be able to ace any of these classes" and I simply worked my tail off until I did. I over worked for a while until I was satisfied that I understood the "how" of studying and then learned how to do it more efficiently and slowly ramped up the course load. I didn't finish my undergrad with a 4.0, but darn near it, and I fairly coasted through my grad program and still nailed above a 3.5. It all boiled down to those boring couple years where I really challenged myself to learn how to learn, because up until that point school had come so easy I hadn't bothered.
• stdbrouw 11y ago
  I'm sure you don't mean it that way, but this always feels like such a humblebrag to me. "Oh, I was actually a lousy college student, and you know what, my superior intelligence is what did me in." I can imagine that having to learn how to study (and developing the character to actually do it) is something that takes time and commitment, but if everything else is so easy for you, surely it can't be impossible?
  • dragonwriter 11y ago
    > I can imagine that having to learn how to study (and developing the character to actually do it) is something that takes time and commitment, but if everything else is so easy for you, surely it can't be impossible? Studying is more of a practice/habit, than an area of knowledge; someone that has avoided needing it because they pick up knowledge well without it and hasn't had their ability to pick up knowledge challenged isn't necessarily going to pick it up easily, especially, if they have many years of strongly ingrained contrary habits when, suddenly, for the first time their ability to gain knowledge is stressed and they need studying to keep up. Sure, its not an impossible skill to develop. OTOH, when you've missed out on many years of before-college skill development in it and try to catch that all up in time to make a difference once you get to college, its not all that likely to succeed as well as you'd like.
    • stdbrouw 11y ago
      But assuming that a person really does have superior intelligence, how strong do their study habits really need to become to succeed in college? Stronger than they were in high school for sure, but if the difference is astronomical, then wouldn't it be astronomical too for less intelligent people who already have good study habits? Wouldn't they, too, have to suddenly study that much harder and with that much more persistence? It just doesn't add up for me.
      • dragonwriter 11y ago
        > but if the difference is astronomical, then wouldn't it be astronomical too for less intelligent people who already have good study habits? The weighting of college admissions exams (which are heavily weighted toward measuring ability rather than study skills) and high school grades (which measure a combination of study skills and ability, such that you can't pull the two apart distinctly) in admissions means its easier for someone with high intelligence and weak study skills to get themselves in over their head in the college program they are admitted to than for someone with less intelligence and stronger study skills to do. Plus, the difference between not having study skills and needing to learn them from scratch and having study skills but needing to study more is one of kind, not merely of degree. (But, sure, lots of people have transition problems with college, even though those problems can have different sources, natures, and manifestations.)