iLemming

14 ms·

211.
by iLemming 4mo ago
I never said s-expressions have no downsides, I merely tried to explain why I think people hate them. They do have downsides - diffing and merging and complex macros are good examples - but calling Lisp code outright "unreadable"
212.
by iLemming 4mo ago
> why are you opposed to people presenting the ideas with different notation What are you talking about? I'm not opposed to anything, I don't know where that conclusion comes from. I'm just trying to explain why people hat
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I have quite the opposite effect. I don't "hate" programming languages, but honestly, sometimes I don't understand how the fuck we (people) managed to build layers and layers of complexity (both syntactic and semantic) f
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> never heard anyone say that Python is hard to read I already pre-empted that: readability tracks what you learned first and how much you've practiced, and you trying to restate the familiarity effect as if it refutes it. You&#x27
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> when I move through the wasteland You got that exactly backwards. A non-lisper unavoidably has to deal with tons of syntactic and semantic clues - parens, colons & semicolons, square brackets, indentation & white-space, special
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> It is not very readable. That holds true only for two cases: - For a programmer who never learned Lisp as their first language. I have met people who learned Clojure as their very first PL and they said it was fun. Later there were u
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> I just don't like them That is what I don't get. I have used many different languages, and often is not the syntax that I don't like - I may dislike the semantics, the runtime, the tooling, but syntax, really how? It&#x2
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> syntax carries semantic expectations True! Syntax is a signaling system. Braces and semicolons signal the C-family, so you prepare for statements, mutation, sequential side effects, and objects. Parentheses-first signals Lisp, so you e
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by iLemming 4mo ago
It's not about survivorship bias, it's about notation. It's like "hating Leibniz's dy/dx because Newton's dot notation already exists" and I'm arguing that people don't just "hate the n
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I don't "believe" things, I pragmatically choose the tools that work, the ideas that have merits. I did not say "refactoring is equivalent to structural editing", and I specifically talked about comparing Python REP
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> A lot of people hate sexprs In all my time I have never come across a single Lisper, neither in person nor online, and I know far more than a few dozens, who once grokked the REPL-driven workflow and the structural editing idioms only
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> I'm perfectly capable of programming without internet Me too, but let's be honest, I'm not talking about "Hello world!" experiments, I'm talking about developing usable software. I'm pretty sure, you
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by iLemming 4mo ago
"Running your dev stack" is not the same as "developing [usable] software".
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by iLemming 4mo ago
Goddamit, like losing the ability for coding without any Internet wasn't enough, now I have to forget how to code without Claude? ps. if you say you still capable of developing software without the Internet, you're lying. Perhaps,
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by iLemming 4mo ago
https://www.youtube.com/@emacspropaganda
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> I don't understand is wanting to replace elisp with a mainstream scripting language That typically comes from people without any experience in any Lisps. They don't know "REPL-driven development", they haven't
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I use Neovim too, but it never can fully replace Emacs for me. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48589770
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> How did you approach emacs onboarding I'd typically would start by showcasing a single (albeit enormously important) aspect of it, like search. When someone sees the countless ways to search for things in Emacs: - isearch, query-r
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I'm currently using my custom fork of thanhvg/emacs-reddigg. It isn't ideal, I've been itching to rebuild it into something more robust. Well, one day I may get annoyed enough and just do it.
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by iLemming 4mo ago
So the problem is two-fold, right? a) you need to see the timestamp in different timezone(s) A minor mode with home-zone/visiting-zone vars showing dual times via overlays answers: e.g. "It's 1PM here, what's that in Lon
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by iLemming 4mo ago
It's not just Elisp, I think, just any Lisp dialect gets this reaction. Which, honestly, I can't fully comprehend. Wait, how do even people use Emacs while at the same time hating Lisp? Isn't that kind of a painful way to dea
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> Because you're being too aggressive and unpleasant Huh. Well, I guess, fair enough. Would be weird for me to assert that I don't feel like it. What could I say in my defense? Jesus tried to spread the word nicely, have you he
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> "Is anyone still using emacs?" Nothing else is capable of handling the variety of text-related things I want from my text editor. - I consume HN and Reddit in Emacs. Allows me for example to quickly search through all the lin
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> Org timestamps infamously do not support them. So? Emacs has built-in solar and lunar calendars, has world-clock command, format-time-string accepts ZONE argument. Why don't you build a minor mode that calculates the offsets and s
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> I have zero desire to hack around in it for fun You just sit here stiff-necked without even the slightest clue of what I'm talking about. I don't hack for "fun", I hack with a purpose. Here's a practical anecdo
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I have not forgotten my own "beginner's journey" - au contraire - I vividly remember it, and thus I'm sharing an admonition - so people wouldn't waste their time. Because I did. Besides, I have successfully mentored
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> Emacs Lisp is by far the worst part of emacs Say what you want, but I wouldn't trade it for any other (non-homoiconic) language. Sure, it won't win the contest of the "nicest Lisp", nevertheless - it's a Lisp,
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> I would rather chew glass So, you're making assumptions even without ever trying? You just decided it's hard/time consuming/worthless even though you have "never heard" about it? > I have been using ema
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by iLemming 4mo ago
> You can see vi's motions as elegant and purposeful. Sure I do, and there's so much tacit knowledge that I can't ever explain verbally or in writing that goes into it, to the point that arguments like yours, challenging m
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by iLemming 4mo ago
I've had multiple config bankruptcies over the years until settling down with Doom. I'm considered "experienced Emacsian" - built and published packages, etc. I'm still using Doom but only the core of it. I don&#x27

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