4 ms·

When you say ahead of the competition, what do you mean? Ive used it before (2005, 2008, 2010), but it was just another IDE. How have things improved?

by bliti 11y ago

bargl 11y ago
2013 was a pretty big jump (IMO) for Visual studio. It added some cool features that I use all the time. Filtering in the solution explorer. Peeking definition. Code Lens Parallel watch. (Ultimate Only) Number of references listed above the function and tests associate with it. 2015 has some even cooler stuff. It shows memory and cpu usage as you debug any program (tests/console/etc). You can call linq from the watch window (not sure where I saw this buy a key feature that was missing). The built in diagnostics tools are better (I use resharper so I don't really need that). I also really like some of the built in Code Review tools they have, which you don't need if you do pull requests in git.
- bliti 11y ago
  I assume those features are strictly for the MS stack. Am I wrong? Do they work with Python? In terms of costs, what do you pay for it (including the OS)?
  - bargl 11y ago
    Argh hate to fess this up but I think some of those features might be locked into MS stack. Just tried on my 2013 version on python and peek wasn't working. Will try 2015 later to see, but I'm not hopeful.
ohitsdom 11y ago
I work in Visual Studio exclusively for my day job the last 8 years so my experience is pretty limited. But every time I try out other languages and IDEs on my own time, I'm almost shocked at how hard the tools are to work with compared with Visual Studio. VS has excellent intellisense. Compile and runtime errors are clearly pointed out, usually with helpful error messages. And real-time debugging and being able to set variable watches make developing much easier. Compine that with the new integrated performance/memory profiling tools and it's a slam dunk. These tools may be available in other IDEs, but they are so easy to use in Visual Studio. Again, this may be due to my experience and familiarity, but I haven't found anything close. In theory Eclipse should be able to compete since the debug capabilities should be the same (.NET vs JVM) but it was disappointing. Cludgy IDE, poor intellisense. And even creating a simple Java console application required several manual configuration steps. In .NET you can have a new console app running in 2 clicks, and it's pretty intuitive so even new users shouldn't be too overwhelmed.
- bmj 11y ago
  Did you work with other IDEs/languages before you started working with VS? I typically use VS every day (currently on 2013), and yes, I have a similar experience with other IDEs. Then I remember that I know VS pretty well, and maybe that's why this other IDE doesn't seem so great. If I spent 8 years with a different IDE, and someone gave me VS2015, I'd probably have that same "this clearly isn't as awesome as X" feeling.
  - gknoy 11y ago
    I'm not sure. I used Eclipse extensively for several years (though am not an expert), but immediately discarded ANY interest in Eclipse within about 20 minutes of using PyCharm. Because of that experience, I no longer felt that IDEs were interchangeable. I haven't used Visual Studio in about a decade or more, but I would not be surprised if there were things about it that don't have an easy analogue in others, and which people miss.
- oblio 11y ago
  Creating a Java console app is not really the same as creating a non-portable, Windows only console app. Of course VS does Windows integration better, that's kind of the point :)
  - tracker1 11y ago
    In VS, you create a new console solution (Or web) in your language of choice... a hello world template is created... click the run/debug button, it compiles and runs. That has emphatically not been my experience with Eclipse at all... I've had to participate on a number of Java solutions over the years, but it always felt like a hair pulling experience. For that matter, I'm often frustrated with VS after spending most of my time the past 4-5 years in node... full text editor, and two console windows open (plus browser(s)). After a while, it feels like the low tech option is easier. There are things I miss when I play with VS... but when I use VS for JS editing, I find I'm fighting with formatting options that reformat my text, and other developers with the defaults that don't care. That said, I do like VS more than every other IDE I've used... WebStorm is really nice for node, but I haven't tried the latest NTVS seriously.

When you say ahead of the competition, what do you mean? Ive used it before (2005, 2008, 2010), but it was just another IDE. How have things improved?

by bliti 11y ago

When you say ahead of the competition, what do you mean? Ive used it before (2005, 2008, 2010), but it was just another IDE. How have things improved?

bargl 11y ago

2013 was a pretty big jump (IMO) for Visual studio. It added some cool features that I use all the time. Filtering in the solution explorer. Peeking definition. Code Lens Parallel watch. (Ultimate Only) Number of references listed above the function and tests associate with it. 2015 has some even cooler stuff. It shows memory and cpu usage as you debug any program (tests/console/etc). You can call linq from the watch window (not sure where I saw this buy a key feature that was missing). The built in diagnostics tools are better (I use resharper so I don't really need that). I also really like some of the built in Code Review tools they have, which you don't need if you do pull requests in git.

bliti 11y ago
I assume those features are strictly for the MS stack. Am I wrong? Do they work with Python? In terms of costs, what do you pay for it (including the OS)?
- bargl 11y ago
  Argh hate to fess this up but I think some of those features might be locked into MS stack. Just tried on my 2013 version on python and peek wasn't working. Will try 2015 later to see, but I'm not hopeful.

ohitsdom 11y ago

I work in Visual Studio exclusively for my day job the last 8 years so my experience is pretty limited. But every time I try out other languages and IDEs on my own time, I'm almost shocked at how hard the tools are to work with compared with Visual Studio. VS has excellent intellisense. Compile and runtime errors are clearly pointed out, usually with helpful error messages. And real-time debugging and being able to set variable watches make developing much easier. Compine that with the new integrated performance/memory profiling tools and it's a slam dunk. These tools may be available in other IDEs, but they are so easy to use in Visual Studio. Again, this may be due to my experience and familiarity, but I haven't found anything close. In theory Eclipse should be able to compete since the debug capabilities should be the same (.NET vs JVM) but it was disappointing. Cludgy IDE, poor intellisense. And even creating a simple Java console application required several manual configuration steps. In .NET you can have a new console app running in 2 clicks, and it's pretty intuitive so even new users shouldn't be too overwhelmed.

bmj 11y ago
Did you work with other IDEs/languages before you started working with VS? I typically use VS every day (currently on 2013), and yes, I have a similar experience with other IDEs. Then I remember that I know VS pretty well, and maybe that's why this other IDE doesn't seem so great. If I spent 8 years with a different IDE, and someone gave me VS2015, I'd probably have that same "this clearly isn't as awesome as X" feeling.
- gknoy 11y ago
  I'm not sure. I used Eclipse extensively for several years (though am not an expert), but immediately discarded ANY interest in Eclipse within about 20 minutes of using PyCharm. Because of that experience, I no longer felt that IDEs were interchangeable. I haven't used Visual Studio in about a decade or more, but I would not be surprised if there were things about it that don't have an easy analogue in others, and which people miss.
oblio 11y ago
Creating a Java console app is not really the same as creating a non-portable, Windows only console app. Of course VS does Windows integration better, that's kind of the point :)
- tracker1 11y ago
  In VS, you create a new console solution (Or web) in your language of choice... a hello world template is created... click the run/debug button, it compiles and runs. That has emphatically not been my experience with Eclipse at all... I've had to participate on a number of Java solutions over the years, but it always felt like a hair pulling experience. For that matter, I'm often frustrated with VS after spending most of my time the past 4-5 years in node... full text editor, and two console windows open (plus browser(s)). After a while, it feels like the low tech option is easier. There are things I miss when I play with VS... but when I use VS for JS editing, I find I'm fighting with formatting options that reformat my text, and other developers with the defaults that don't care. That said, I do like VS more than every other IDE I've used... WebStorm is really nice for node, but I haven't tried the latest NTVS seriously.