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Re: “Cowen is merely repeating the talking points of the propaganda campaign against the estate tax planned in the mid-90s…” Cowen’s argument is not the same.

by shahryc 11y ago

Re: “Cowen is merely repeating the talking points of the propaganda campaign against the estate tax planned in the mid-90s…” Cowen’s argument is not the same. 1) Cowen is saying that the rich engage in tax avoidance. While, in the article Meagher is describing “how and why the estate tax became part of the pro-family agenda of social conservatives.” (There’s a ton of data on it: see “Tax Avoidance Saves Wealthiest Americans $3 Trillion Each Year” http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/07/tax-avoidance_n_2426754.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/07/tax-avoidance_n_242...) 2) re: “This seems very speculative.” The point that I’m making is about the time value of money. (I’m not making a Reaganomics supply side argument.) My point is, a dollar before a death tax is worth a lot more than after the death tax --- there’s enormous evidence for that (and even without a death tax based on time value decay alone it is true.) Admittedly, I am assuming that rich people would rather not voluntarily give money to the government, even if they don’t want to give it to their heirs. (ie. The Giving Pledge the super rich make to philanthropy.)

hackuser 11y ago
> Cowen’s argument is not the same. ... Cowen is saying that the rich engage in tax avoidance. While, in the article Meagher is describing “how and why the estate tax became part of the pro-family agenda of social conservatives.” I'm a bit confused by this. In the quote I included, Meagher describes the talking points planned by Beach as including "decreased revenue through other taxation", which is what Cowen claims happens due to tax avoidance. I'm not sure why you refer to a sentence from a summary of Meagher's article (though I realize the article is behind a paywall, sorry), which I didn't mention and doesn't seem to apply. > I’m not making a Reaganomics supply side argument. I didn't mean to say you were, sorry. I meant, like those Reagonomics arguments, it's yet another speculative reason why the wealthy shouldn't pay their share of taxes. But regarding its speculative nature you say that ... > there’s enormous evidence for that I believe there is an enormous number of arguments behind it, but given the organized propaganda campaign and the fact that this point matches one of its talking points, I'd have to judge the evidence for myself. It's not reasonable to expect you to do research and provide it for the sake of a HN discussion, but if you could happen to recommend any I'd appreciate it. Thanks. > death tax As I mention elsewhere, this term for the estate tax, it's proper name, was a major, carefully implemented part of that same propaganda campaign.

by shahryc 11y ago

hackuser 11y ago

> Cowen’s argument is not the same. ... Cowen is saying that the rich engage in tax avoidance. While, in the article Meagher is describing “how and why the estate tax became part of the pro-family agenda of social conservatives.” I'm a bit confused by this. In the quote I included, Meagher describes the talking points planned by Beach as including "decreased revenue through other taxation", which is what Cowen claims happens due to tax avoidance. I'm not sure why you refer to a sentence from a summary of Meagher's article (though I realize the article is behind a paywall, sorry), which I didn't mention and doesn't seem to apply. > I’m not making a Reaganomics supply side argument. I didn't mean to say you were, sorry. I meant, like those Reagonomics arguments, it's yet another speculative reason why the wealthy shouldn't pay their share of taxes. But regarding its speculative nature you say that ... > there’s enormous evidence for that I believe there is an enormous number of arguments behind it, but given the organized propaganda campaign and the fact that this point matches one of its talking points, I'd have to judge the evidence for myself. It's not reasonable to expect you to do research and provide it for the sake of a HN discussion, but if you could happen to recommend any I'd appreciate it. Thanks. > death tax As I mention elsewhere, this term for the estate tax, it's proper name, was a major, carefully implemented part of that same propaganda campaign.