3 ms·

We already have plenty of secular communities. Hacker News, sports fans, standup comedians, book clubs, students in college, nerdfighters, groups organizing aro

by rayalez 11y ago

We already have plenty of secular communities. Hacker News, sports fans, standup comedians, book clubs, students in college, nerdfighters, groups organizing around hobbies and interests, groups of friends. Community forms not because religion has something sepcial about it, but because people tend to form communities around any subject they are interested in. Just because religion used to be there, doesn't mean we have to replace it. We do not need something big and ritualized. You can't start with an idea to create a community and then invent a set of values that fits everybody, at best nobody will care enough to participate in it. It works in the reverse order. Whenever there's something worth believing in and organizing around - peoole do that naturally. So instead, we will end up with a lot of small "tribes", communities formed around shared interests, friendships, etc. You can look at reddit to see how process naturally works, and what works well.

rrss1122 11y ago
I've always felt that calling online forums "communities" was wishful thinking on the part of forum participants looking for a sense of belonging. Hacker News and nerdfighters, to use examples you posted, never felt like communities to me, just people coming together to talk about things they all liked, organizing around hobbies and interests. A group of friends does not make a community. I think physical proximity is an absolute requirement for a community. Students in college inevitably form communities. They come together to help each other. Online forums like reddit more often drive people apart than join people together.
- pjc50 11y ago
  > physical proximity is an absolute requirement for a community Quite possibly, but what happens when you move? Labour mobility is an inescapable part of the modern world, as is the desire for young people to move to the "big city". This is particularly bad for inter-generationality. Perhaps that will improve once the long term diversity acceptance values shift has completed.
scribu 11y ago
That's an interesting perspective, but I'm not sure how well such ad-hoc communities can deal with important life events. For example, if a loved one dies, will your book club friends help you organize the funeral (or even attend)? If you can't rely on them in cases like that, it's not really the kind of community the OP is talking about.
felipeerias 11y ago
You should probably read the article. The author is talking about organisations that entail "inter-generational communities who interact regularly and who share values and worldviews; networks of mutually supportive long-term relationships; opportunities for fellowship and social bonding; and ritual commemorations of life’s most meaningful events".
xupybd 11y ago
As someone who is deeply involved in a church I feel your comment illustrates the problem. You appear to think you have a greater depth of relationship/community than you do. I have noticed that the set of values is very much the binding force that holds, at least the church community that I am part of, together. I have very different interests with the people I have most to do with, but we live by similar moral codes. It's hard to describe but very different to what you are discussing. And the level of involvement is much higher than normal relationships. Tightly woven communities are absent from modern lives as there has been a big push for individualism and materialism.
- icanhackit 11y ago
  Tightly woven communities are absent from modern lives as there has been a big push for individualism and materialism. True, though tightly woven communities have many implicit rules, sometimes explicit, that can govern anything from sexuality to what you wear and where you live. Individualism allows a broader definition of who you are and what you can align with at the cost of a tighter support network. I feel that the increase in acceptance and support of people with different gender identities and sexuality is a direct result of individualism. The same applies to feminism. Even people who would ordinarily feign a religious belief because flipping the bird at the pastor and screaming I'm an atheist would not only affect their relationship with that person, but their whole community. They'd be an outcast, just as the feminist would lose the support of those who had accepted their assigned gender roles and rules. Humanity has become more liquid but lacks a deep connection to their neighbor as a result. Everything has a positive and negative side.

by rayalez 11y ago

rrss1122 11y ago

I've always felt that calling online forums "communities" was wishful thinking on the part of forum participants looking for a sense of belonging. Hacker News and nerdfighters, to use examples you posted, never felt like communities to me, just people coming together to talk about things they all liked, organizing around hobbies and interests. A group of friends does not make a community. I think physical proximity is an absolute requirement for a community. Students in college inevitably form communities. They come together to help each other. Online forums like reddit more often drive people apart than join people together.

pjc50 11y ago
> physical proximity is an absolute requirement for a community Quite possibly, but what happens when you move? Labour mobility is an inescapable part of the modern world, as is the desire for young people to move to the "big city". This is particularly bad for inter-generationality. Perhaps that will improve once the long term diversity acceptance values shift has completed.

scribu 11y ago

That's an interesting perspective, but I'm not sure how well such ad-hoc communities can deal with important life events. For example, if a loved one dies, will your book club friends help you organize the funeral (or even attend)? If you can't rely on them in cases like that, it's not really the kind of community the OP is talking about.

felipeerias 11y ago

You should probably read the article. The author is talking about organisations that entail "inter-generational communities who interact regularly and who share values and worldviews; networks of mutually supportive long-term relationships; opportunities for fellowship and social bonding; and ritual commemorations of life’s most meaningful events".

xupybd 11y ago

As someone who is deeply involved in a church I feel your comment illustrates the problem. You appear to think you have a greater depth of relationship/community than you do. I have noticed that the set of values is very much the binding force that holds, at least the church community that I am part of, together. I have very different interests with the people I have most to do with, but we live by similar moral codes. It's hard to describe but very different to what you are discussing. And the level of involvement is much higher than normal relationships. Tightly woven communities are absent from modern lives as there has been a big push for individualism and materialism.

icanhackit 11y ago
Tightly woven communities are absent from modern lives as there has been a big push for individualism and materialism. True, though tightly woven communities have many implicit rules, sometimes explicit, that can govern anything from sexuality to what you wear and where you live. Individualism allows a broader definition of who you are and what you can align with at the cost of a tighter support network. I feel that the increase in acceptance and support of people with different gender identities and sexuality is a direct result of individualism. The same applies to feminism. Even people who would ordinarily feign a religious belief because flipping the bird at the pastor and screaming I'm an atheist would not only affect their relationship with that person, but their whole community. They'd be an outcast, just as the feminist would lose the support of those who had accepted their assigned gender roles and rules. Humanity has become more liquid but lacks a deep connection to their neighbor as a result. Everything has a positive and negative side.